they didn't have a -- they wanted to know how to organize a band how it is done. they asked me to help them get out of hole their survive was at stake for them and their families that's what i did. when i joined them they were earning two, three thousand a night when i left $185,000 a night. i must have showed them something. >> greta: why were these two bands successful? >> interesting. they were wildly different. the rolling stones i tell people they are the competitive model versus the cooperative mod roll stones super competitive want to be number one, huge albums, want to be famous. have their pictures everywhere. grateful , cooperative, didn't really care about the media. i think the grateful dead