joining us now for the interview is richard clarke, the nation's first special adviser to the president for signer security and the nation's former counterterrorism chief and the chairman of good harbor, and his book "cyber war" is just now out in paperback. thank you for being here. >> good to be back. >> thinking about that iranian oil terminal and stux net, is cyber war is a way that countries are waging war with each other now? >> i think it's a way that the united states is attacking iran. you could call it cyber war, or call it covert action. it's not really important whether we call it a war of the nor. it's true that the united states and probably israel are engaged in cyber activities against iran. and what happened on karg was probably the united states or israel attacking the digital