started, which we knew publically was about e-mail hacking? >> i think that's how they followed manafort. in the litigation over whether or not the special prosecutor had a right to go after manafort, one of the things they said was what they were doing was following the money. following the money that the ukraine sources to manafort. and i think following the money is what they are doing throughout. getting back to the sentencing issue, i am reminded that john dean, for example, when he testified before congress, i believe he did some time for his role in nixon's obstruction of justice. so the notion that cohen would get some time, i think that this is right, would make some sense. that was the other question. but the other thing, with respect to the russian issue, we have to step back. there's almost like it was -- we thought this case was about flynn, michael flynn lying about his contacts with the russians. which when, if you recall, sally