this mental racism judgment in america. what's interesting about the resumes is even when they changed the qualifications and made deshawn even more qualified and made jake even less qualified, you know, jake still got more callbacks. so i think -- it's very telling. >> and what is it, you know, then what's the message to african-americans who are thinking about naming their children? do they need to say if there's a name i liked or wanted i need to realize that perhaps my kid's going to be judged on this? >> well, and it's also a choice. i grew up in west virginia. you're going to name your kid bobby jo. you start hearing names together, might be a little country, it's not the same as robert joseph. it sounds more wise and eloquent, you know. but there is -- there is connotations that come with those names. >> very interesting. also socioeconomic. you found it wasn't just related to race. this was an interesting bit i like to play for people. >> so what's happened to ashley?