doing that. steve jobs did that. he didn't take a dime from the federal government. >> gregg: he reinvestsed his money. >> yes. the other thing he -- he dispensed almost no lobbying money compared to most companies. the word is, you can really succeed without the federal government. he sold to the federal government as a market. but he didn't take any money from it. so you are absolutely right. >> gregg: isn't itç ironic protesters on wall street decrying capitalism the other night they paid tribute to steve jobs the quintessential lesson in capitalism. >> there's a lot of irony there. >> gregg: profits are not evil, profits empower people. thanks brenda. >> heather: remember the story we talked about it yesterday. new details about the members