for the reason the guest just said, which is as the economy improves, then we may see an uptick in individuals who are crossing the border illegally, and that is not what we want from a good immigration policy that works. we want a process where it's legal. look, we are a nation of immigrants and laws, and we need people to follow our laws, but we need a law that works, and that's why we need comprehensive immigration reform. >> so one of the things i'd like to ask you is, if this emphasis on border patrols -- so there's been a number of ways in which this enforcement is done, right? doubling our border agents. we now have aerial drones that are going over. we have built a physical fence in a bunch of places. we've also built an electronic fence so called in other places, which has been, as ruben, i think, alluded to very buggy and dysfunctional and kind of a boondoggle in a lot of ways. john mccain has said that there's been real improvements in border security.