found that just by calling people, in fact, we got that from republican sources who were trump supporters who were willing to provide it. it wasn't classified, it wasn't secret, but carl's right. there is a coverup going on here. the question is, when you get into the courts, that the president, the former president, does have some rights here, unfortunately. there is a right to conceal information. it certainly is wrong in this committee and what i worry about is, do we really have a mechanism in this committee or in the justice department, to get to the bottom and explain what happened? and this is where carl is -- i mean, you really have to do