you can't get a gun. so he, at least this suggests, would never have passed a background check. but he got a gun anyway. that's my point. background checks don't necessarily stop this. >> well, you know, erin, again, this is what happens. in every single case someone goes, oh, well this wouldn't have stopped that or that wouldn't have stopped that. couldn't all of this help? again, republicans have voted repeatedly to cut funding for mental health. so i'm just saying, yes, it is all a piece, but the problem is the gun lobby makes sure that guns are never any part of the discussion. even background checks, which as you just said a huge majority of the american people are for. i mean how can we not even get that done at a minimum. >> i believe we had a conversation of background checks for many months and ultimately it floundered. why did it flounder? because there's a deep difference between folks who live in cities and suburbs and those who live in rural america and we happen to have a political system that empowers people who live in rural areas so you have to respect their opinions. i think that if you look at