dealing with the facts presented before them and ignoring them. >> there is also the fact of social media fox which do change venues for the arguments. but what i see is more of an ability today to deny reality. that didn't happen back then. >> would nixon have had to resign in today's times? >> it's a close question, because when people look at nixon today through the lens of all we know about him, which was so much more than he resigned on, it was much worse than everybody thought. so i'm not sure he would have had to resign. >> interesting about that point you raised, had they known then what they know now, was a common refrain from the witnesses of sondland and volker alike this week and their notion of, listen, i didn't realize rudy giuliani was doing all that he was doing. i didn't realize also perhaps