things didn't work together. and then the very interesting thing, that you have a jesuit-trained pope who takes the name of a franciscan. and so we have to remember that francis is a reformer in the early 13th century. and ignatius is a reformer in the 16th century. we tend to think of these people as establishment figures. when francis shows up, he's on the edge. he's an itinerant preacher. people are wondering whether or not he's, quite frankly, kosher. ignatius was investigated because of the inquisition twice and used to carry around a piece of paper, gleefully, that cleared him. >> stay with us. monsignor, we're going to say goodbye to you. thank you for your contribution. coming up, i'll talk to two former u.s. ambassadors and find out what they have to say about this historic election of pope francis.