they sat in a room and said who is the best latin-american, they said who is the best person. i think it was an a-b-c pope. the second is, of course, this is the first time a jesuit has ever been elected pope. the notion was, there wasn't anything like a taboo, but the notion was, jesuits, because they take that special fourth vow to do whatever it is the pope asks them to do, those two things didn't work together. and then the very interesting thing, that you have a jesuit-trained pope who takes the name of a franciscan. and so we have to remember that francis is a reformer in the early 13th century. and ignatius is a reformer in the 16th century. we tend to think of these people as establishment figures. when francis shows up, he's on the edge. he's an itinerant preacher. people are wondering whether or not he's, quite frankly, kosher. ignatius was investigated because of the inquisition twice and used to carry around a piece of paper, gleefully, that cleared him. >> stay with us.