you are part of this alliance that helps fund some of the research that's happening there. maybe there's a conflict. >> well, how can there be a reflect when it's a statement of support? >> the thing i think that struck me, it was so early. how were you so certain at that point to go ahead and label anything that was not a natural origin a conspiracy theory? >> well, because the theory at the time was that this is a bioengineered virus. >> so this was not in any way to take off the possibility that this could have still leaked from a lab even if it not been bioengineered? >> that wasn't what was being said at the time. what was being said at the time was this was a bioengineered virus that had been released by chinese scientists. >> there were concerns, is there something here that might be the signature of human manipulation? >> initially in january, knowing the type of work that was going on at the wuhan institute of virology, we started thinking things like, look, we need to consider the possibility that