so he doesn't have anybody he can call in because he doesn't want to -- he doesn't want everybody to know that he's aligned with trump. so i just think that's a campaign. that's a functioning campaign. >> one thing, i'm for mcauliffe to be clear but youngkin has done a good job presenting himself as an outsider, what everyone really thinks of that. but mcauliffe was governor for four years and i -- he was a pretty good governor and once -- >> of that sounds like a terrible resume. he was governor, but -- >> the voters are so intent to change. it's a well-governed state. low unemployment. you have to run on that if you're mcauliffe. bringing in all the surrogates is what you do if you're an unknown congressional candidate, not if you're the former. >> youngkin is trying to discuss education and local control of education. listen to this -- what terry mcauliffe said at a debate that is now all over the media from youngkin trying to push this. take a look.