nothing untoward. >> and the lead pilot, 53-year-old veteran, highly respected. richard, there was a youtube video of him with a flight simulator in his home. he was a dedicated pilot. >> he was. and these pilots like this captain. they're the old school. they still do like to -- they see somebody on the plane, having somebody in the cockpit, maybe that's not the wisest thing. and very few countries still allow it. but there are some times when the captain does have the discretion to invite somebody on into the cockpit. >> michael, tell us about the transponders because you're familiar with what is going on. how unusual is it for a triple 777 to lose a transponder, indeed both trance pspondetrans? >> highly unusual. i don't remember where that happened before. outside of what's been reported, whether they were voluntarily turned off, which would be a