to the way people who are put out by it or put out by a version of it are unfairly punished or unjustly punished or mysteriously punished from people who don't understand. so it's not an objection to everything happening in the culture, and the piece is not an attack on wokeness, or it's not a woke versus anti-woke argument, it's really about thinking about, okay, we have these cultural changes, how do we cope with them, how do we make sure that people are treated fairly in the light of the speed of judgment that you can now -- that is now common nowadays? >> and it is so fascinating. anne has obviously spent the last five years writing about illiberalism on the right in america and poland and hungary