Its out of the dire straits song money for nothing. Interest rates have been so low for so long, and i think most everybody understands that wherever this shakes out, the days of basically cheap money for investors is coming to an end. Serge the days of close to zero interest rates. Free money. We have veteran columnist and msnbc contributor, mike barnicle. And National Affairs analyst for nbc news, and msnbc, John Heilemann. Hes peppy this morning, thats not good. We have Time Magazine contributing editor and author of the president s club Michael Duffy. And msnbc contributor, kasie hunt. Its also kasie what are republicans thinking on capitol hill when they did pretty well in the last Government Shutdown. Shifted the blame to democrats. It was the schumer shutdown. Democrats panicked, pulled back. Now were moving towards a new shutdown and the president of the United States is saying i would love a Government Shutdown. Republicans, what say they . They say theyre not interested in a Government Shutdown. And for who wants it . Actually feels like capitol hill is getting somewhere. I mean Chuck Schumer, Mitch Mcconnell seemed to be relatively on the same page. Theyre talking about this big major budget deal, theyve been governing from crisis to crisis, for so long this would clear the detection for two years. Let them actually set those levels. It had been all tied up with immigration. Democrats after the shutdown said okay, fine, were going to try and strike this deal. This could likely keep the government open this week. And it seems like the president feels like perhaps he won the last round and so he seems anxious to you know try and figure out if he can use it to his advantage. But i mean the reality is, nobody is really listening to what the president is actually saying. Theyre listening to what john kelly is saying behind closed doors. Every time the president makes a move he doesnt seem to follow through or he changes his mind. And something completely different is the ultimate outcome. Its almost as if he has a short attention span. I watched the rocky series a couple of weeks ago. Heres the thing about sequels, in order to keep them interesting, the sequel has a different ending than the first one. Rocky loses the first one, but wins the second one. Its not going to be the same story. The second time around. Hey, lets do that again. Ive said this before. Everybody says when does, when does everything catch up to trump . Its not a lie. Its not an outrageous comment. Its not even all of the racist attacks he makes for some reason, none of this, its not, its not a sex scandal with a porn star that he pays off, that would get lets say 9 out of 10 president s. Its not that. For 99 out of 100. Its not that. Its when he gets predictable and its when he gets boring. This is a reality tv show. And im not being glib about it. This is a reality tv show. People like watching this guy go crazy. This is, this is the kardashians come to washington. When he gets predictable, when they say ive seen this before when they turn it off and say, you know by the way when it starts to seem like the normal washington, another shutdown . Great. And seriously is, ive seen this series before. Theyre repeating the same thing as before. And Michael Duffy i always go back to this. As a younger guy, i was shocked that the great communicator after about six years, could go out, he could give the same exact speech, he could try to get 100 million measly dollars for the contras in Central America. He would give the same speech and chill was go up and down my conservative spine. And the rest of america yawned. And i realized then that every president has a sellby date. For reagan it was six years. But with donald trump, because everything is so amped up, its going to obviously, its going to come sooner. Yeah, im a little worried about this movie sequel metaphor of johns. You know because i always thought that after the third jaws movie you began to root for the shark because it got so boring. You know you knew what was going to happen. That might only be you, duffy. It might be only me. But reagan was different. People liked him. They tolerated him. They actually you know had deep affection for that man. And that was a difference. And its a differencemaker for president s in good times and bad. Were not quite at that point with trump. And you know, i think kasie nailed it this morning when she said essentially governance and responsibility may be about to break out here and thats a relief, it looks like theyre going to do this deal this morning. And everybody is going to get a little more money. Well see if that flies in the house. But that is for us, i think, a win. And whatever the president may have said yesterday about wanting or welcoming a shutdown. Mike, following up on what michael said about reagan was likable. Everything goes back to Johnny Carson for me. Carson was likable, you could watch him every night. He was invited into your home. He was even invited into your bedroom. Because there wasnt the sharp edge to him. Again, trump theres a lot of flash, theres a lot of anger. Theres a lot of shock. Theres a lot of awe. But lasts a lot shorter than what say reagans winning personality did. Johnny carson didnt wear on you, he didnt exhaust you. Trump does both, he wears on you and exhausts you. But continuing with the sequel metaphor, this is the first sequel, where the president in the secondpart series becomes irrelevant. The senate is moving forward as if the president doesnt exist. He has his lawyers saying hes, hes not smart enough to stand toe to toe with bob mueller. So please i mean i saw last night, they had Newt Gingrich, they had who is the former nixon guy in south florida roger stone. Bebe rebosa . Roger stone who has the best nixon memorabilia. You can see it on the google machine. I would love to see the memorabilia. Its incredible. Hes got a nixon bong thats right up my alley. I dont need to see that. But okay i lost my train of thought. These guys were on tv last night and they were frantic. Newt gingrich no, he cant go in front of bob mueller. That would be the worst idea ever. When you go back to the first thing that Newt Gingrich said about bob mueller, is bob mueller is a man of great integrity. A perfect choice. But theyve all figured out that mueller is so much smarter than donald trump they think so. I would never say that. But everybody close to him thinks, mika, that hes going, hes too stupid. Hes too dishonest to sit down and talk to bob mueller. And i dont know if i were donald trump, that would hurt my feelings. But if you look at the Washington Post i think tallies, its five lies a day. Can you imagine an hour with bob mueller . My god. The man cant open his mouth without a lie popping out. Somebody is going to compel him to talk. So theyre kicking the can down the road a little bit. I would just say it is, it is remarkable that you work for somebody and you admit, four people admit to the New York Times that he cannot be trusted to talk to an officer of the Court Without lying. How would you feel about it if your lawyers were saying that kind of stuff, not just saying it, but saying it to the New York Times. And also we may be youll get this. I dont think anybody else will. Kurt flood. Free agent. But Major League Baseball didnt want to sue kurt flood because they knew they would lose and it would open pandoras box. Its the same thing here with Donald Trumps lawyers. They can do all of this maneuvering. But at the end of the day, mueller is going to say i need a subpoena. Its going to go all the way to the Supreme Court. I dont think trumps lawyers want to lose that, because then that opens the door for the next question. And the next question. And the final question to go to the Supreme Court which is can the president of the United States be indicted. The interesting thing about kurt flood, again, going back to metaphors now, nobody around kurt flood was panicked about what kurt flood was doing. All the people were saying yeah, kurt, go ahead. Nearly everyone around the president of the United States is in a state of panic about the spectacle, the spector of him having to testify before bob mueller. Mika, ive never seen anything like it. They do not trust him to be smart enough to do this. Or just to tell the truth. Or to tell the truth. I dont know what is worse. They think any interview is a perjury trap. If you could sit with mueller, its a perjury trap. And to go where you began, this is a reality show and most reality shows, if you think about the most popular ones out there, they do crazy things, you basically watch people push the envelope on life and on norms. And they course in our society coarsen our society. And this reality is doing the same thing, except to our democracy. Thats the parallel. On capitol hill theyre trying to get things done. Trying to figure out a deal. Heres Mitch Mcconnell and Chuck Schumer compared to the president , talking about potential shutdown. Senator schumer and i had a good meeting this morning about a caps deal and the other issues weve been discussing from some, for some months now, im optimistic that very soon well be able to reach an agreement. Im very pleased to report, my meeting with leader mcconnell went very well. Were making Real Progress on a spending deal. That would increase the caps for both military and middle class priorities on the domestic side that democrats have been fighting for. Im very hopeful, very hopeful, nothing is done yet, theres some outstanding issues. If we dont change it, lets have a shutdown. Well do a shutdown. And its worth it for our country. Id love to see a shutdown, if we dont get this stuff taken care of. If we have to shut it down because the democrats dont want safety, and unrelated, but still related, they dont want to take care of our military . Then shut it down. Well go with another shutdown. We dont need a Government Shutdown on this. We really i think both sides have learned that a Government Shutdown was bad. It wasnt good for them and we do have bipartisan support on these things. You can say what you want. Were not getting support from the democrats on this legislation. If you put this up in the senate well see, we have to get that. They are not supporting us. Can you then clarify would the president rather see a shutdown or a shortterm spending fix this week . Again, we are not advocating for the shutdown. Thats the fault of the democrats, not being willing to do their jobs. The president wants a longterm deal and he wants to get a deal on immigration. And we hope that democrats will come to the table and get those things done. So kasie, the leaders, the republican and Democratic Leaders both said that they were moving close to a deal. Did i count the president talking about wanting a shutdown seven or eight times . Any idea whats going on there . Why, why did he lead with his chin and let the American People know that he really wanted a Government Shutdown . Well i think there seems to be a minor misunderstanding about exactly like what is on the table here and how the government is funded and why it shuts down. I guess i can understand that because democrats tied immigration to a Government Shutdown. But they have now untied those two pieces. So to have a Government Shutdown, the president would assuming that Congress Gets it together on the shortterm spending bill, which right now it seems as though its going to, to basically find its way through and then we may have this bigger deal as well. The president would have to veto that in order to have a Government Shutdown and there still would be no deal on immigration. I was having a little bit of trouble following. So is the president i wont ask the question, ill just say what everybody knows. The president was lost yesterday. It was as if he had not been keeping up with what was going on on capitol hill. What his own Staff Members were telling him. What he said was completely disconnected from reality, wasnt it . Its becoming a common problem with the president and negotiations behind the scenes on the hill. Congressional leaders think one thing, they go to a meeting, maybe with the president or they watch the president Say Something in public and then they take actions based on that. And both sides, republicans and democrats, have learned that that is unreliable. That those moments and those promises are unreliable. And that they learn later on, from the podium, Sarah Huckabee sanders, or john kelly behind closed doors on the hill, that they just, they simply cannot take action based on what they hear from the president. Its really, its quite remarkable. Its become our normal. But its really quite remarkable and new and a different way of governing and doing things here. At the end of the day on immigration its going to come down to whether speaker ryan is confident that whatever he would put on the house floor President Trump would sign. I think john kelly is going to give him the indication and the sign on that. And thats whats ultimately going to determine whether we have a solution for the daca kids, if theres no appetite for a shutdown on capitol hill theyre not going to let what the president said yesterday stop them. It is really republicans do tell me, this is like nothing theyve ever seen before. Of course democrats say it as well. Is that the president is completely disconnected by whats going on. His staffers tell him, you know hes got people on the hill that are very connected with the negotiations. But he is, hes strangely disconnected. Maybe hes just not paying attention. But i think you can go back in American History and time and time again, when weve gone through these difficult times, you know weve just ordered up a military parade. I remember you know, back when the red sox won in countries do that thats the soviet union and north korea, isnt it . Yes. The leaders watch it and look at them. Never mind. The president , this is very autocratic. Who would ever guess this president would be autocratic tendencies. Can you imagine if it happens . The images are going to be pronista. This would be a thing. It will not, it will not go off without incident, right . We just dont do military parades. Military parades . Not part of our Great American tradition. Well President Trump has asked his top military commanders to plan a military parade. We have to tell him no. The pentagon spokesman confirms that the department is quote looking at possible dates. Tell him no. Adding that november 11th is veterans day and thats a possibility. I have a great idea yeah. Why dont we get, and im dead serious, why dont we get vietnam vets some korean vets, get vets from the wars, to march. Those that have already been to war. Perhaps those who are still carrying the scars of those wars. Let them march and on veterans day and we can applaud them. That would be great. I dont think thats exactly that happens all over the United States now. Im saying why doesnt the president organize that . Have the pentagon organize that and have the largest veterans parade in American History. Where veterans can come together from all of these wars. And talk through the challenges they still are facing in peacetime, 30, 40 years later. Its more about power and being saluted. Its not about actually respecting the sacrifices of people who love our country so much that they would lay their lives on the line. A lot has happened over the past 14 months since donald trump was sworn in as president. This is the saddest thing to my mind. I mean we have been at war for 17 years, we have had nearly two decades of sacrifice and sorrow borne by less than 1 of the american public. The American Military is the strongest, the proudest, the best in the world. The American Military and the American People do not need a parade we need peace. Why doesnt the president direct the pentagon to double down with the va, john . To make sure that our men and women who are still suffering in afghanistan, who are suffering from the scars of afghanistan, and from iraq, and from vietnam, why doesnt he put his focus on us actually as a country, taking care of the men and women who have already given their all . You got a ptsd crisis from the veterans who served. Youve got suicide, extraordinary plague of suicides among veteran who is have served as mike said. How about you take the millions, and it will be millions of dollars thats going to go into planning this alleged parade, take that money, earmark it and put it into ptsd counseling and services, use that money to try to actually help the people who have already made these extraordinary sacrifices for their country. How many suicides per day . Its a horrifying number. A year or two ago we were well over 20 suicides a day from our men and women in uniform. Lets bring in nbc News Pentagon correspondent hans nichols, what more can you tell us about whats behind this request. Are we misunderstanding it . No, you have it clear. The president gave a directive to