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The dial only goes to ten, right. and once you put it up to ten long enough it sounds like five you can only mod late so much. if everything is a crazes nothing is a crisis which is a challenge. people say don't normalize but you don't want to be history onic saying this is nuts, this is nuts. >> except given the level of insanity we have seen just in his demeanor, in his rhetoric rick, we have not seen a kind of corresponding catastrophe in foreign affairs or the economy or any of the things we foe are supersensitive dell kits things that require a fundamentally sane person at the whole. what...

Phenomenon created by repetition. the phrase i use is, the dial only goes to ten. once you put it up to ten for long enough, it starts to sound like five. you can only modulate so much. people say, don't normalize. then you don't want to be histrionic and constantly, this is nuts. >> except that given the level of insanity that we have seen just in his demeanor, in his rhetoric, we have not seen a corresponding catastrophe in foreign affairs or in the economy or any other things that we know are super sensitive, delicate things that require a really fundamentally sane person at the wheel. what...

Sensitivity that i and many had about the term boy. and especially in a racial context. and about normalizing segregationists. yes, if you're engaged in getting something done, yes, you have to work with speak that you absolutely disagree with. but don't normalize and civilize them. i tried to get him to see that and deal with that. and he said he understood it but he would not apologize for it. where we differed. i think, joe and mika, a lot of confusion i have heard, this is not generational. john lewis and others that defend him are 15 years older than me. i'm -- cory booker is closer to my...

She is definitely her own person and interesting she is fighting back and taking on her critics head on. pete: i was near el paso when she came down, because the family separated from their families. it was an important moment. does she take on her critics and elevate, the texas border, elevate her impact on these issues? >> reporter: i think so but i don't know because there is so much bias, no matter what she does or what the president does they don't want them to win, don't one them in a positive light or to shine in any way. she should press forward, do what she is doing, people like mysel...

This way more than any of the people that you mentioned and so does the president of the united states. and we're talking about the president of the united states who should, who should, his character should be beyond reproach. he should be setting the example. >> don't normalize him. >> therein lies the problem. therein lies the problem. with all due respect to scott, i agree with you, we should condemn all of it, and there should be consistency. but the problem is in the era of trump, what about-ism has become the king of the hill here. >> no, no, no, i'm not saying what about -- i'm not say...