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Department for all intensive purposes, at least as it pertains to these cases, and they will disappear, he can't pardon himself or do anything to effect as president something that happens at a state court. so there is a strategic case for the state cases to go ahead, even potentially before the federal, cases even though that what you should be the other way around. >> by the way, the states are picking up speed in terms of their prosecution of people involved in january six. today, to fix electors in michigan were indicted. the states have set very plainly that that is not the end of the roa...

Ones where there really is quite a timeline, because depending on what happens in the election, those cases could go away. that is not true with respect to the current case and manhattan, and if there is a case in georgia, everyone's centipede also, will not go away. you can imagine the two federal judges thinking that there might be some reason for those cases. you could imagine the state judges thinking that is right. >> yeah, just to underscore the point there, i think a lot of us think about federal courts getting deference, and the federal cases go first. laetitia james, the attorney gene...

Public life. but, if you are badly convicted or appealing a conviction on something as serious as trying to enter democracy because of your terrible losing streak, which is where the losers stuff, he's a repeat loser of elections, and the alleged evidence of coup stuff combines into a very unpopular sandwich. and donald trump understands, and donald trump -- >> you are not unpopular sandwich, that is not what he meant. >> well, that is where that all comes together, and it is something donald trump knows because he's always calling everyone what? loser? we're accusing them of being a criminal ...

>> you might have made the point earlier that the panel made that the idea of saving democracy actually turned out to be a powerful factor in the midterms, as did abortion. but i am with alex. if i am the biden campaign, to go back to my old world of being in a campaign world i would go to each of these states, because one of the things that the democrats are a bit concerned about is, they are always concerned low-key about black male turnout. the turnout of black voters. i hope that it will be as robust as they needed to be to win. and obviously they are always concerned about the drift of so...

Remedy. in terms of the case, it is hard to not see this as very strong. you don't have to be or to go to law school to know he had classified documents, he was hiding them, they were found after an fbi search, you have people who say he lied to me and told me to lie to the government, he told me to get rid of tapes, surveillance tapes. this is a pretty rudimentary obvious scheme. this is where i think a jury is not going to be like okay this is an arcane issue and why should i care? there it's this why should i care, all you have to do is look at the description of the classified documents. i...