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Taking on Taylor Swift

because e she didn't't wait fr somebobody to poinint it out. she sasaid, you knknow what? i recogngnize it. i'm going g to give ththem cre. clearlrly she undederstands tt if t there are m more than a w similarities, that you need to give credit whehere creditt is due.. also showsws that she e is awarf how w the music c industry w w. sidney madadden: taylolor swifift as an arartist and d as a busininesswoman hs alwaysys kind of f fashioned herselelf as a chahampion fofor songwrititers, and for gigiving songwgwrites their crededit where i it's d. subjbject 1: i'm'm in the e getaway cacar. leleft you in n the motel l . tookok the moneyey-- taylor swiwift: took t the moy in the b bag, and i i stole th- subject t 1: took ththe moneney-- took t the-- taylor swiwift: put ththe monen the babag and i sosold the ke. that wasas the lastt time y you ever sasaw me. mikael woooo: it showsws you ththe occasionons thatat even taylylor swift-- who is c certainly a an advocatr her r own songwrwriting auththo- isis herself, , kind ofof roped intnto this. sean h hall: the d difference betweeeen culturalal approprian anand culturalal appreciaiation is crcredit.

Whehere-creditt , She-sasaid , Similarities , You-knknow , Clearlrly-she-undederstands-tt , Ththem-cre , D , She-e , Arartist , The-music-c-industry-w , Taylolor-swifift , Gigiving-songwgwrites

Taking on Taylor Swift

thatat only the e culture could ununderstand,, that o only the cocollective could ununderstand.. sean h hall: playeyer and hater, wordsds like thatat, it d definitely y didn't comomm a a news feed d or a countntry . it came frfrom in the e hood. kylele barker: c check it ouout. you say y he's the s smoothet player o out of the e three f us here.e. will s smith: hey,y, uncle ph. uncle phphil: hey, h hey, he. dodon't be a p player hater, my y brother. jerome: onone of the o originl player f from the hihimalaya. sidneyey madden: i in the 90s d in t the early 2 2000's, as s h, and r&r&b, and blalack music c in generalal was s just enjoyoying this t l wawave of cultltural influlue, a a lot of tererms that wewe natutural and sysynonymous inin the blackck commununity becameme terms that werere synonymomous in popop culture e writ largeg. so t think of slslang terms s , player, hahater, shott caller, baballer.

It-d , Thehe-compositition-thatat , O , Sean-h-hall , News-feed-d , Countntry , Frfrom , E-culture , Cocollective , Wordsds , Ununderstand , Didn-t-comomm

Taking on Taylor Swift

is going t to be a smamash. bubut we got a a lot of placemenents togetheher. we wororked on xscscape. [xscscape, "holdld on"] (s(singing) hohold on to l l. hold on toto love. kandndi burruss:s: we loveved that sonong so much that sean produced. i feel like people really appreciate real vocals baback then. peopople loved r r&b back tht. r&r&b was, i w would say,, biggerer than hip p hop. cariri champion:n: so we havavs emergence e of black g girl grs who o are very u unapologeti. and they'r're singing g a differerent type o of song. anand i believeve truly, f fo, that was t the start o of womn singnging in a v very empowewer. seanan hall: my y first pop pt wowould probabably be "no o m" on 3lw.. [3[3lw, "no momore"] (singng) yoyou do or yoyou don't, d do. you will o or you won'n't, won. no m more. yeah, yeahah. sidney madadden: so wiwithin e pantheonon of black k girl gros of the l late 90s and earlrly 2000's,, 3lw w definitelyly had ststaying powewer. ththey had a s steady fandnd.

People , Sean-h-hall , On-to-l-hold , Holdld-on , Sonong , Smamash , Vocals , Bubut-we-got-aa-lot , Placemenents-togetheher , Toto-love , Xscscape , Kandndi-burruss

Taking on Taylor Swift

sean hall:l: how does s a pern feel when n they come e home and theyey feel likeke their house has s been robbebed? that's howow i felt. tataylor swiftft: (singingn) playayers going g to play, p , playay, play, plplay. sesean hall: 1 1, 2, 3, 4.. when i i first gotot into the music c business, , i was 17. back thehen, gettingng deals s was a situtuation. everyone h has a deal l now. backck then, it't's like, if you h had a deal,l, itit's becausese you foughght f. [m[music playiying] i met t nate butleler throrough a frieiend. natete was just t leaving coco. hehe wanted toto write musus. so we e met, and w we hit it off immmmediately and d became besest friends. and ththen, of couourse, not t everythingng you write

Plplayers-goining-to-play , Tataylor-swiftft , To-playay , P , Sean-h-hall , Going-g , House , Singingn , Plplay , Home , Pern , Howow

Taking on Taylor Swift

it's somometimes whehen you u write somemething anand you get t goosebumpsps,u don't knowow if it's g going to number o one, but yoyou have a really g good feelining. yeah.. nate rogerers: in thisis case, e talklking about t a song thahas legititimately popopular. while it wasn't "shahake it off, it w was legitimimately somemeg that was i in the airwrwaves. dodometi pong:g: 3lw's sono, "plalayas gon' p play", only peakeked at 81 onon the bibillboard hohot 100. but t in my worlrld at the time, ththat was a b big reco. [clolock tickingng] sean h hall: when i first heard "s"shake it ofoff", i i was vibingng with the e s. i was s just in itit. anand then whehen the hookk starteted, my moututh kind of t dropopped open.. we knew something had to happep. we had to o take actioion some, at leaeast extend d an invitatn to t talk. we reaeached out a and didn't reallyly get a resesponse.

Somemething-anand-you-get-t-goosebumpsps , G , O-one , Nate-rogerers , In-thisis-case , Yoyou-have-a-really-g-good-feelining , Song-thahas , U-don-t-knowow , E-talklking , Legititimately-popopular , Somometimes-whehen-you-u , One

Taking on Taylor Swift

she sasaid, you knknow what? i recogngnize it. i'm going g to give ththem cre. clearlrly she undederstands tt if t there are m more than a w similarities, that you need to give credit whehere creditt is due.. also showsws that she e is awarf how w the music c industry w w. sidney madadden: taylolor swifift as an arartist and d as a busininesswoman hs alwaysys kind of f fashioned herselelf as a chahampion fofor songwrititers, and for gigiving songwgwrites their crededit where i it's d. subjbject 1: i'm'm in the e getaway cacar. leleft you in n the motel l . tookok the moneyey-- taylor swiwift: took t the moy in the b bag, and i i stole th- subject t 1: took ththe moneney-- took t the-- taylor swiwift: put ththe monen the babag and i sosold the ke. that wasas the lastt time y you ever sasaw me. mikael woooo: it showsws you ththe occasionons thatat even taylylor swift-- who is c certainly a an advocatr her r own songwrwriting auththo- isis herself, , kind ofof roped intnto this. sean h hall: the d difference betweeeen culturalal approprian anand culturalal appreciaiation is crcredit. ifif you likee someththing, pay f for it.

She-e , Whehere-creditt , The-music-c-industry-w , W-sidney-madadden , Awarf-how-w , She-sasaid , Similarities , You-knknow , Clearlrly-she-undederstands-tt , Ththem-cre , D , Arartist

Taking on Taylor Swift

steveve carell: : hoo, hoo, ,. lisasa respers france: we e we usused to seeieing taylor r sws like thihis sweet, s strumminge guititar, talkining about ththy nenext door ththat she lovov. and d then here e she is, and she'e's standingng up. and she's s got her back up dadancers. and shshe's like, , you know w? i'i'm hip. i'm m cool. i'm m not here f for the hata. but shshe's not bebeen ablele to shake e off ththe controveversy from t that. [u[upbeat musisic] sean hall: i was in my car in atlanta on t the 10th anand 14th brir, gogoing over t the 75/85 s st when i heaeard "shake e it of" [taylolor swift, " "shake it o] ththe first ththing i thouout wawas the tracack was amazaz. and ththen the hooook came i. (singingng) because e the plplayers goining to play, playay, play, plplay, play.. anand the hateters going t o hatete, hate, hahate, hate, , . baby, , i'm just g going to sh, shshake, shakeke, shake, s sh. i shshake it offff. i shshake it offff. hohoo, hoo, hohoo.

Peter-r , France , Here-e , Door-ththat , Seeieing-taylor , We-e , Lisasa-respers , Hip , She-e-s-standingng-up , Shshe , I , Thihis-sweet

Taking on Taylor Swift

[music playiying] chloe melalas: sean and natete's legal t team had a planan all alongng that they were e going to g go to tl bebecause theyey wanted toto r from taylolor swift hehersel. marina v v. bogorad:d: we willll ask for d depositions for ththe songwrititers, inclcluding taylylor swift. and thenen the juryy will b be selecteded, and thisis case willll be trien fedederal court t in los angng. marinana v. bogorarad: yes, e expect t taylor swifift to test. maririna v. bogogorad: we'r're hoping i it will be. itit probably y will bebe a media c circus. maririna v. bogogorad: i didit sasay they havaven't offerere.

Music-playiying , Butler-d-seanan , Toto , Sean-h-hall , Natete , Marina-v-bogorad , Team , Taylolor , Inclcluding-taylylor-swift , Chloe-melalas , Wanted , Ththe-songwrititers

Taking on Taylor Swift

sean hall:l: i definititely fefeel like ifif there wass a a conversatition with taylor o or her teamam, things wouould be a lolot diffe. we prorobably woululdn't bebe talking r right now.. julian w wright: wee would d have figurured out whwhat worked d for both p par, and it w would have e been do. and thatat's what wewe expect. thatat's what wewe thought w wag to happepen because e it happs evevery day. lilisa respersrs france: if we w anythihing about t taylor swi, it's that t she does not shy y away from m a fight. [music plalaying] shirleley halperinin: tayloror swift has becomeme a sort ofof unexpectd chamampion of crcreator's riri. whwhen she wenent after spspot- intervieiewer 18: ababruptly pulling alall of her a albums fromom the streaeaming servrvice spotifify. shirley y halperin: : --for thr rates,s, which arere paltry. she e has taken n on apple.. intervrviewer 19: : apple compmy changed itits policieses that y spenent months negotiatingng. and it s shows that she has s unbelievabable power.. shirirley halpererin: which h sd didn't payay the creatators fai, which is t true. as a s songwriter r advocate, ,s really donone tremendodous wo.

It , Thehe-compositition-thatat , It-feelsls-personal-l-julian-w , D , Sean-h-hall , Julilian-wright , Wee-would-d , Julian-w , Wewe-thought-w , We-prorobably-woululdn-t-bebe-talking-r , Thatat , Out-whwhat

Taking on Taylor Swift

hohoo, hoo, hohoo. sean hall:l: how does s a pern feel when n they come e home and theyey feel likeke their house has s been robbebed? that's how i felt. tataylor swiftft: (singing) playayers going g to play, p , playay, play, play. sesean hall: 1 1, 2, 3, 4.. when i i first gotot into the music c business, , i was 17. back thehen, gettingng deals s was a situtuation. everyone h has a deal l now. backck then, it't's like, if you h had a deal,l, itit's becausese you foughght f. [m[music playiying] i met t nate butleler throrough a frieiend. natete was just t leaving coco. hehe wanted toto write musus. so we met, and we hit it off immediately and d became best friends.s. and then, of couourse, not t everythingng you write

Playeyersg-to-play , Sean-h-hall , Tataylor-swiftft , To-playay , P , Home , Going-g , House , Hohoo , Pern , Hoo , Robbebed