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The law, he wouldn't do it. what happened to them? they were thrown to the wolves. the same thing happened to pence. how can republicans still be enabling trump and his lie knowing all that? >> well, a couple things. number one, thank goodness these people did their duty. i think as you watch these hearings and you see these people who stood up and understood what their public responsibilities were and they didn't shirk from that. they didn't run away from it. they stood up to it. knowing full well what was going to happen to them because of the president's anger. so thank you to the people wh...

House speaker rusty bowers. he voted for donald trump twice. but when he was asked to break the law, he wouldn't do it. what happened to them? they were thrown to the wolves. the same thing happened to pence. how can republicans still be enabling trump and his lie knowing all that? >> well, a couple things. number one, thank goodness these people did their duty. i think as you watch these hearings and you see these people who stood up and understood what their public responsibilities were and they didn't shirk from that. they didn't run away from it. they stood up to it. knowing full well what...

You don't have aplan for the nhs. the second thing we've got to do is to sort out social care. i think in november there were over 400,000 cases where people were able to be discharged from hospital into the community but couldn't because the care home wouldn't take them or community settings and support wasn't there. so you've got to deal with the late discharges. and the third is, in terms of the private sector capacity, as the last labour government showed, using the private sector to bring down nhs waiting lists is effective, its popular with patients, but it comes at a cost. so no doubt t...

Will turn to the private sector, no doubt the next labour government may have to use private sector capacity to bring down nhs waiting lists, and i won't shirk that for a minute to get people better health outcomes, but i will be pretty furious at the costs involved because it shouldn't be the case that because tory governments run down the nhs, we have to spend more taxpayers' money than would be necessary in the private sector because we haven't sorted out the public sector. so, that will be my focus. that's fascinating, because essentially, it's a value for money argument whereas, for some ...

May have to use private sector capacity to bring down nhs waiting lists, and i won't shirk that for a minute to get people better health outcomes. but i will be pretty furious at the costs involved because it shouldn't be the case that, because tory governments run down the nhs, we have to spend more taxpayer's money than would be necessary in the private sector because we haven't sorted out the public sector. that will be my focus. that's fascinating, because essentially it's the value for money argument. whereas, for some people, it's deeper than that. it's in their gut. keir starmer sat in ...