but there is also to me the fact that he -- it's not just him, there are people who are currently working overtime in alabama to justify their support for roy moore. i mean, you really got to take a step back. this is a guy we saw in the interview, family values, family integrity, the integrity of women and children because of bathroom bills and gay marriage. it is remarkable to watch an entire structural of ideology built around the sanctity of family and purity and protection come behind this individual. >> well, right. i think on the one hand, it shows how rickety it is and how situational it is and to some extent, the -- there are two things that i think are fundamental here, right? there's both race and the fact that roy moore, you know, in addition to being a three accurate, is also somebody who opposed taking segregationist language out of the alabama constitution, who just the other day was talking about alabama being on the right side of the civil war.