hillary clinton land about how they use bill or don't use him. >> it's got to be a big worry. i mean, he's been a great campaigner for obama and other politicians. when hillary clinton ran, he made a lot of mistakes. the big one, of course, being when he compared obama's victory in south carolina to jesse jackson's, offended a lot of african-americans. even before that he made a lot of gaffes -- >> you swallowed that. offended a lot of -- why did it offend him? he seemed to demean the victory, that the victory didn't mean anything. he basically said only black people voted for obama, that's how he won south carolina. it goes to the point -- >> he also yelled, it's a fantasy. >> it's a fantasy. he said a lot of things. he's otherwise great, but in terms of campaigning for his wife, he was very defensive and very angry at times. >> well, is this just human nature? closer to home, the more you complain? the more you go -- >> the spouse always is more aggrieved than the principal in my experience. when the spouse is bill clinton, and particularly when the spouse is the president of the united states in general, but bill clinton in particular, that's a spouse that bears some watching.