cooperate. a lot of people feel like in similar situations, a case like this would have been pled out by now. >> i was surprised that it didn't plead much earlier, but at a certain point, he had spent so much money on the defense, that it makes no sense for him to start talking about cooperating at that point. but also very interesting if he is blaming his partner rick gates, rick gates pled out in part because he had no money. so now you have manafort saying he stole my money, embezzled money from me. how come rick gates doesn't have money to defend himself and you do. that would be my question. so that under cuts the argument that rick gates took the money. >> this courtroom which is sealed. at a time when it is the president's campaign manager. and the stuff that they are