great -- there's a great argument that it's definitely the solution, too. when e.j. says they may not call it into a second stimulus, i think you're right. but fiscal policy is going to be important to getting back to rational levels. >> where is the money going to come from? the money is just not there. they will wrap some of this into a transportation bill, but the money is just not there. i find no hunger for a second stimulus absolutely. it's not federal spending that got us into this mess. it's private debt, credit card debt. it's a fundamental societal problem. we can try to change the sort of fizz of private debt for public debt but it's not going to get us out of this problem. >> that's also the question. should there be a focus on relieving the debt, reducing the debt, or should, as a lot of more liberal economists are saying you've got to keep priming the pump if you're going to do something specifically about jobs.