Democrats. You think of it as a purely democrat area. Its a very unfair situation. Donald trump may have violated the gag order in his Hush Money Trial yet again yesterday during a radio interview, complaining about the jury. Well get expert legal analysis on that. And yesterdays Opening Statements and first witness. Plus, well go through the newly unsealed transcripts in the classified Documents Case which shows a former white house staffer tried to warn trump about the legal issues he could face. You know, if he stole classified documents. And its another day where trump is in court and President Biden is on the Campaign Trail. This time in trumps home state. Well preview the president s speech in tampa, florida. Good morning. Welcome to morning joe. It is tuesday, april 23rd. Along with joe, willie, and me, we have u. S. Special correspondent for bbc news, katty kay. And Deputy Managing Editor for politics at politico, sam stein. Doing a little Way Too Early duty this morning. Of course he is. The great sam stein. He is the great, legendary sam stein. Thank you, guys. Also a very excited sam stein. Despite the fact that we are fielding a aa team, red sox are doing pretty well right now. Better record than the dodgers. Better record than the dodgers. True. Exactly. Its true. It matters more now because its april. Anyway, willie just go to willie for the top story. Because the red sox did not play last night, mika and i got to how many episodes oh, my god. We binge on a show. Four maybe . Its called pom royal. So good. So talented. Shes amazing. Willie when she goes, you failed. You interviewed, willie, Carol Burnett, the legend of legends. There was a scene with kristen wiig and carol going back and forth. Shes just going, ah. Mika and i looked at each other, and i was like, oh, my god. Yeah. She can go theyre spirit animals. Theyre spirit animals. Yeah. She can go toetotoe with one of the greatest of all time. It was a pleasure to watch. In fact, the whole crew, everything. It is a beautiful, splashy show, palm beach in 1969. The sets, the houses, the costumes, snooty people at Country Clubs trying to crack into society. Amazing. Carol burnett starts the show in a coma. She said it was the best gig ever. She could go to hair and makeup and then lie there all day. Shed get a check at the end of it. We wont give away too much, but she and kristen wiig are incredible. Great cast. Looks good, too. Its a great show. So many great actors in here. At one point, Carol Burnett, while shes not talking, going, ah, ah. Nice throwback. Katty, one, two, snooty reviews saying, that couldnt happen. That couldnt happen. They dont know palm beach. I thought it was an extraordinary send up of palm beach. Amazing fashion. I wish we still dressed like this. The husband, the pool boy, the guys that come into it are great. I love how you start to realize, you know, for all the glamour and glitz, its all about secrets. Everybody has secrets. Theyre trying to be somebody they are not actually. Thats what is genius about it. It comes out wednesdays, and i wait for wednesday. Waiting for wednesday. Thats my life. You can have the day off. Yeah. Of course, josh lucas was on earlier. I know. We have to get more of them on. We need to collect them all. This is a nice break from donald trump in court. Donald trump in court. Donald trump in court. Willie, donald trump was in court again yesterday, and i think he fell asleep again. I think so, too. Laura dern, allison, janney, and ricci martin, incredible in the show. All three of them. Yes. I mean, all of them are great. Go down the list. Theyre all extraordinary. Mika and i turned to each other, and i just loved kristen wiig. Shes extraordinary on snl, in whatever she does. After it was over, we said, thats next level. Next level, yeah. She has gone next level. Yeah, extraordinary. She has taken it to the next level. Palm royale, check it out if you havent seen it yet. Speaking of south florida, donald trump tliflives there. I was going for a segue, but it didnt work. By the way, at one point, Allison Janney looks at the Mobster Husband and says, this is where were going. Were common criminals. This is where were going in the future. Palm beach. It was good. Yeah. Theres your segue. Heres the segue. There you go. Donald trumps Hush Money Criminal Trial will resume today in a New York City courtroom after a busy day yesterday, where both sides delivered Opal Statements and the prosecution called its first witness. In their opening, the prosecution and defense painted two very different pictures of the former president. Prosecutors describing him as having been involved in years of sordid business deals. They called trump a coconspirator in a plot to cover up a sex scandal in a catchandkill plan during the 2016 president ial election. They said trumps actions amount to criminal conspiracy and coverup by scheming with his then lawyer, Michael Cohen, and david pecker, who was the publisher of the National Enquire at the time. The defense painted trump as a family man and innocent, no crime was committed. The prosecution called pecker as the first witness. The former chairman and ceo of American Media incorporated explained his publications had practiced Checkbook Journalism, where they paid thousands of dollars for stories. The publications would purchase stories to prevent them from being published by other outlets and bury them. Pecker also testified trump met with him after the 2016 election to thank him for being the campaigns, quote, eyes and ears, scooping up information that could be harmful to trump and reporting it back to Michael Cohen. Pecker is expected to resume his testimony later this morning. Lets bring in former litigator and msnbc Legal Correspondent lisa rubin. And former attorney and msnbc contributor, chuck rosenberg. Good morning to you both. Great to have you with us. Lisa, you were in the Overflow Floor yesterday watching all this, kind of Keeping Track of Donald Trumps facial gestures, perhaps nodding off. What was your big takeaway from yesterday, day one. The big takeaway is this is a crime about falsification of Business Records, yet, what the government seems to have the most evidence of is of the underlying conspiracy. What is still unknown to me is how theyre going to prove Donald Trumps own involvement and the falsification of the Business Records with which he has been charged. So we heard a lot of preview of the evidence of the construction of the conspiracy, who was involved in it, who will place donald trump with the knowledge and intent to commit electionrelated crimes. What i didnt hear as much about is how donald trump then directed the coverup thereafter. For example, willie, there is a 2017 Oval Office Meeting between donald trump and Michael Cohen where the prosecution said they cemented the repayment deal. How are they going to prove that . One, through the testimony of Michael Cohen. But i was looking yesterday to hear how else are they going to prove that . They say they have a photograph of the two gentlemen at that meeting. They also have invoices days afterwards. A couple days after that, the first payment to Michael Cohen. But i was hoping to hear that they have a lot more than that. Somebody who was also at the meeting, who overheard the meeting, who placed some of these documents in front of donald trump, heard his comments about that. I didnt hear that yesterday. Im hoping that we hear prosecutors have a lot more about the back end of the deal as much as they do about the front end of it. Chuck, what stood out to you . Id agree with lisa but add one thing. Circumstances also matter. We often talk about there being direct evidence, maybe conversations or photographs or emails of a transaction, but circumstances matter, too, willie. If you walk out of your house and theres snow on the front lawn, what do you think happened last night . It snowed. You may not have seen it, and there may be some other explanation for why there is snow on your front lawn, maybe someone put it there, but the likely explanation is that it snowed. So, here, lisa, and i know you agree because weve talked about this, there are a bunch of circumstances, the timing, the motivation, that show that, after these conversations and this conspiracy formed, certain things happened, including the issuance of checks to Michael Cohen under the guise of a Retainer Agreement and then ledger entries that followed. So youre going to see, i think, over the course of this trial, willie, direct evidence of the conspiracy and what they agreed to do, and Circumstantial Evidence, as well. A judge will tell the jury at the end of the day, both matter. Theyre both compelling. You can accept circumstantial or direct evidence in deliberating on your verdict. So donald trump is calling on his supporters to protest outside the courthouse in Lower Manhattan where his Hush Money Trial is being held. So far, his base has been a noshow. As the New York Times puts it, the former president is not getting the circus he wanted. The paper reports there were only a handful of Trump Supporters outside yesterday morning, and they were outnumbered by the Trump Detractors, who had signs about his alleged affair with an adult film actress. The former president tried to rally his followers with a long post on his social media site just before 7 00 yesterday morning. Hed post later that the courthouse is completely closed down, which it is not, suggesting the poor turnout was a plot against his supporters. Yeah. Let me go to sam, but you first, joe. I mean, i know theres going to be this hearing before court resumes today about the gag order. I just wonder, i mean, donald trump wants to be careful about asking people to come and rally. I mean, the last time he was pushing people to show up somewhere, there was an insurrection on the capitol. He was saying, ill meet you there. I dont think he should be telling im not a lawyer, but it seems to me that he might want to just go to court. Thats who he is, though. And not ask people to show up in his defense. Sam, after he was inaugurated as president of the United States, you could go in the white house for the next week. Usually when youre outside the press room, you can see all these different pictures. The president with a young child. President with marines saluting. President with this, president with that. Trump put up pictures of the crowd from angles that made it look like he had more people at his inauguration than he actually did. Hes obsessed with this stuff. I will say, he told them to congregate peacefully. Maybe thats where the misstep was for donald trump because nobody showed up. I mean, so it is maddening to him. Everything seems to be going against him. Hes having to sit in this courtroom. I thought it was fascinating last night on fox news, you actually had fox news hosts complaining that he was too old. He was a 77yearold man. Who would make a 77yearold sit down all day . All day. Thats what a lot of 77yearold men do. They sit down all day. They watch the atlanta braves. I know, my dad was one of them. But a lot of people sit down all day. Hes just going crazy and, to add insult to injury, of course, hes been outnumbered by people that are having, you know his supporters are outnumbered by people that are holding up signs talking about porn stars and time in prison. Yeah. I mean, he doesnt have sean spicer this time to go out there and tell everyone that its the biggest crowd ever to witness a court case, right . We is see it with our own eyes and ears. There are not that many people out there. Some of it may have to do with the fact its taking place in New York City. There are not that many Trump Supporters who are there. Some of it may have to do with the fact that the last time he urged people to congregate on his behalf was january 6th. We know how that ended up. Certainly, a lot of people have been arrested for their decision to descend on the capitol. I cant get around the fact, and maybe lisa can address this, the act of encouraging protests at the courthouse, of asking your supporters to make a spectacle of the court proceedings, to a degree, maybe not in legal terms, but to a degree, it seems like an attempt at intimidation. Im wondering if thats permeated the courthouse at all, if the judge is aware of this, if there are ramifications or implications for trump for doing things like this. I think, sam, that those implications or ramifications pale in comparison to the alleged violations of the gag order were going to deal with this morning at 9 30. The d. A. Has brought to the judges attention at least ten different instances that they say are trumps statements that violate this gag order. Many of them are the same statement with respect to Michael Cohen, but theres also a statement with respect to the jurors themselves. In particular, a quotation from a fox news host about democratic activists trying to infiltrate this jury, to throw it against donald trump. Thats quite an accusation. Putting aside the existence of the gag order but given the wording of the gag order, even worse. One thing i want to bring to your and our viewers attention, in asking for this hearing, they have asked for 1,000 per violation, and theyve asked the judge to award what is just and proper in addition. That matters because under the Criminal Contempt Statute in new york, you only have two options. You can either fine someone 1,000 per violation, or you can put them in jail for up to 30 days. In asking the judge to take additional measures to the extent he finds them just and proper, that is the d. A. Subtly saying, if you think this guy deserves the slammer, now is the time. Its in your court. Katty kay, i dont want to run too far up field, but i promise we will get back to this point quickly. I remember in 2016, Opinion Page Editors had to cut down on the quotes that columnists would want to bring into their columns from William Butler yates the Second Coming and apply it to donald trump. Especially the line, the best lack all conviction while the worst are full of passionate intensity. That was, it seemed, very applicable in 2016, but i actually thought about those lines when i when i saw trump whining about the fact that, basically, nobody cares anymore. This isnt even elvis 77. This is like the tour bus has rolled on, and people just dont care. I dont see the intensity, but i will tell you, i see a lot of exhaustion from people who voted for donald trump in 2016. Yeah. Look, you see that reflected on the streets of manhattan. You see it reflected in all of the polls that show us that theres a phenomenal lack of interest in this election writ large. What are we . The nbc polls seem to show the least interest in 20 years. I dont think this is going to be another situation where donald trump drives out massive turnout like he did in 2016, like he did against him in 2018, like he did in 2020. I mean, thats been the argument of the Trump Campaign all along, is whether you love him or you hate him, trump drives people to the polls and manages to find new voters to come to the polls, which is how he squeaked out his win in 2016. Well, if thats the model theyre looking at in 2024, it just doesnt seem to be there. You know, we look with our eyes. We hear it from our friends. We talk to people who say theyre exhausted. I dont know anyone that isnt already exhausted, and we still have another six months to go of this election. We still have another however many, six weeks or so of this Court Hearing to report on. But, chuck, let me ask a question to you about the prosecutions strategy as you saw it laid out yesterday. There seems to be this focus on Election Interference, that Election Interference is behind this, and, yet, thats not actually what trump is charged with in this case, unlike in georgia documents. Those cases are election related. Is that a risky strategy for the prosecution to try and throw that in there, and will it complicate things for the jurors . I think, katty, it helps explain things if done properly, right . Youre absolutely right, that mr. Trump isnt charged with Election Interference. He is charged with the falsification of the records. But there is a context to this. There is a story to this. Its a logical one. Its a linear one. The government is trying to tell it chronologically. The reason that you end up with falsified records is because there was a plot, a conspiracy, a scheme to try and suppress what storeStormy Daniels, Karen Mcdougal, and others had to say about their liaison with mr. Trump. That set off a string of events. Payments to Michael Cohen as retainers, when it was a passthrough to get money to these women to keep them