he had to announce the investigations. he didn't actually have to do them, as i understood it. >> we've been watching together all day long. i -- i have now heard that three times, including when i heard it live. and it still rattles me. this is so far from normal. this is so far from ethical. i think it's an open question about whether or not it's illegal. but i know having spent my career on campaigns that it is something of value to have -- and the fact that it wasn't the actual investigation, that is supposed to be secret and that could have been done stateside. but that it was supposed to be public, that is the only part of value in terms of dirt. >> absolutely. and it makes the point you made earlier, nicolle, which is it erases any defense that donald trump's motivation was corruption in the ukraine. because if your motivation, if your intent, is to stop corruption, you wouldn't be satisfied solely with announcement from the ukrainians that they were opening these