exist. we saw it with the whole charade in the midterm of people -- the caravan coming to the border, and this is that redux. i think we have to be careful not to allow donald trump too much public air times for these kind of political infomercials. >> interesting. why do you say that? i had that conversation with chris at the top of the 10:00 hour, and he said you shouldn't limit the exposure to this president. which i agree with in the sense not limiting but shouldn't news organizations be more strategic -- yes. yes. >> thousands of lives -- we haven't had a president -- if abc, cbs, and all a part of journalism and "washington post" is talking about thousands of lies from a president, how can you have a president come on lying to the american people without an instant fact check or rebuttal. and i'm not convinced the networks are going to want to lose 15, 20, 30 minutes to their programming because they've got a state of the union coming in just a couple of weeks which they've given their time