finally the president himself saying there isn't a smidgeon of evidence that any wrongdoing occurred. all of that looks to be an attempt to cover up something very serious going on to shut down these groups. >> james, i think you've spoken to lois lerner's lawyer. >> yes. >> what is her defense? >> it's surprising. obviously she hasn't made a public defense. what he's told us was not that different from the original sort of cover story. rehashed, lower level people making honest mistakes. then questioning whether targeting had been reported by inspector gernl even though he used the word when he testified. it was a bizarre meeting, nothing new in terms of exculpatory evidence. >> do you have any idea who pays his fee? >> that's a good question.