meaning wealthier americans should pay more. they've already lost the tax argument. so trying to go back to the '90s, '80s strategy of tax and spend liberals isn't going to work because that's not where americans are now. >> i'm not so sure she's right. i think because they lie consistently and say it over and over again, i think it has a tendency to take hold. susan didn't lie. she did an artful job of answering your question. but she forgot to mention that the supreme court tax said was a tax affects less than 1% of americans. and they only get taxed if they don't sign up for health care. it's a minute tax that has no implications -- >> so then if a person -- >> it's not just raising taxes. he's cut taxes on the average american family by $3,600. two tax cuts. in the stimulus, making work pay cut and the payroll deduction tax cut. if you're an average working family that makes $75,000 under