that's one area in our economy where your right to be heard and have public interest in is embedded into the regulatory system unlike the oil industry and gasoline provision which is a utility function. it isn't regulated in the public interest. to come back to this price discussion here, the history of oil and gas prices, the history of commodity prices in general is that they fluctuate. they go up and down, and on the base of price signals, people shut down wells when pieces are too low, supply contracts, prices go up and people boom. >> it's a classic boom/bust thing. >> you can't build pub policy on the basis of extrapolating from the present. to go back to the idea that we need a carbon price, which we do, the implications is that politically you ought to enact it when prices are low so you do relatively little damage to the economy. >> now is the time. that's a great thing, steve. we should do it right now. >> right. >> and everyone knows it's coming. that's the other thing. it's not as though -- >> do they?