money -- frankly, it is a great expenditure, because the more we spend the less we're going to have to use it, the way i looking at it. people are looking at us right now as weak and ineffective, we don't flow what we're doing, we don't have strong leadership. they have a lot of bad things going. >> but you say that the united states should not be the world's policemen. >> joe, we owe $18 trillion. >> does that put you in line with where barack obama is as far as leading from behind? >> i'm a little bit on the let's go side than that. but at the same time i love the fact that -- look. putin is bombing the hell out of somebody and the people that he's bombing right now have to be isis to a certain extent. they just probably blew up his airplane. that was a russian plane and it went down. i assume it was a bomb. i think they don't want to say it but it looks like it was a bomb. having putin dropping bombs on isis is a very positive thing. we don't have to do 100% of the bombing. >> jeb bush says that that's reckless and irresponsible. >> i think it's irresponsible