security challenge today that doesn't require input from the director of national intelligence or the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff. but you put those two together and they're just very boldly saying that politics is going to be significantly driving american foreign policy for the next four years. >> you can remember a situation, p.j., sometimes feelings are hurt because you're not in a meeting or not informed of something, but when you have what is essentially a policy that is a major departure from the way things are run and people who are at the head of agencies who will be charged with implementing it find out essentially after the fact or while it's happening. have you ever experienced anythi anything? >> in vietnam you can't understand how lyndon johnson fought the vietnam war without understanding the dynamic between how he fought that war