otherwise. that's the issue. and that's what was -- in fact, on the president himself has said he is outraged and opposed to this. and even added that is the attorney general. who, of course, signed off on it and discussed it. so he can't say i can't remember, you know, as everybody else is saying. this administration. >> so, we know what the rules are. yes, there is -- the administration clearly went over the line. deliberately in the case of the attorney general. and he cannot investigate himself. it's a farce. >> joanna, i want to make sure we get on to the irs issue as well. admissions that they startinged certain conservative groups for tax exempt status. we have had testimony and the fifth taken where do we go from here. >> i think the smart thing to do would be give lois lerner loose immunity. we are not going to prosecute you for anything you say to congress. the tension right now between the people let's call them republicans and conservative was which is