a way we cover most things in the media, which means there is a biracial spectacle. when people say something, that means something. this presents great difficulty for those of us who are concerned about the force of races in the american life, because much of it is not spectacle. >> your character interest is not the stuff of headlines? >> not at all. even race that does get attention, we see that old footage of bull kaan, or we see kids getting high pressure. that sort of thing is not evoked by the stuff i'm covering in this story. >> it's very black and white. >> very true. i think that's the challenger of any story teller. you have to find a way to bring that to life and get across to people what's actually happening. >> you're getting across sterling, bundy, these are stories that can make people feel good because they can easily condemn them.