>> we've lost a number of fights. >> a little bit of punting there, too. >> we have. but i want to get to the point, and i think the fundamental question for the democrats was, i have for chuck schumer and the president and others is, should we at some point actually balance our budget? and if you're going to do so, how are you going to do that? because at least we're putting something on paper and introducing it. democrats haven't done that in the senate for now close to four years. >> what is going to be the big ticket? it's not going to be obama care which means the message is there's got to be some big ticket item that is going to be in place that will balance the budget. obama care is not going to be it because you don't have the votes for that. >> we do -- >> who says that we have to balance the budget? lots of economists say that we don't. but this is a complete and utter waste of time. that it's much better to get the economy moving so more people are employed. you bring in more revenues. instead of trying to cut, cut, cut. and besides, even talking about households, how many households today have balanced budgets? most of us carry debt.