people are doing wrong. there's this beautiful argument made that it's the state murdering rather than citizens and it's more important that the state does it. no. that's throwing a political science term around. imagine telling a woman in philadelphia who has lost two boys to gang warfare, well, that's really sad, mrs. williams, but we're more interested in what the state did. that doesn't make sense. >> i've often thought that sometimes by focusing so much on white people, it's almost sort of controlling because you're focused on what white people are doing to black people so much that you become obsessed with it. >> you create a brand new reality where to be black in 2015 is still to be living with the white person's foot on your neck. and, you know, that's an interesting idea, it can sell a lot of books but the truth of the matter is it's different now. that doesn't mean racism is gone but it's different. >> so why does this thing persist that you talk about, the