people are like, no, it's a white man's nation that used to be not something you could rhetorically enunciate the last several decades but is now frankly a thing being enunciated by republican politicians. >> i think there's very few people in the republican party today that believe this is a creedal nation you heard blood and soil rhetoric from the republican party. there's a lot of culturally conservative immigrants. the last election should have put to bed the notion that mass immigration is going to ensure a permanent democratic majority, and so in some ways it is not even about politics. it's about an attachment to a certain kind of racial make up in this country. >> yeah, i think that's the key point. there's a certainly amount of instrumentalism here, but there's also just deeply held horrible racist beliefs that people have and there's some pandering that's happening, but it's also like people have terrible views, and that's a huge part of what's driving this