in the hole again. so i'm just -- >> well, hamilton, that veteran that you saw in the piece there, despite the government garnishing 15% of his social security disability payments for the loan that he defaulted on, interest and fees made it virtually impossible for him to put a dent in the principle. and another thing he said that stuck with me, he said he hopes he won't die in debt. he hopes to qualify for credit to buy a home, something he's wanted to do for the past more than 40 years. and that, jake, really speaks to the long-lasting financial impact that this supreme court decision could have on these borrowers. >> all right, rene marsh, thank you so much. white house officials closely monitored the supreme court's oral arguments, one source telling cnn that the biden administration believes it will ultimately win the case. but the conservative justices on the court seemed unlikely to uphold biden's plan. phil mattingly joins us from the white house. what was the mood there as oral arguments played out today? what did the white house people think was going on?

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