e-mail from shinseki's office and himself, they closed the case, they found nothing wrong, do not contact the office. i have that e-mail. so when i saw the president praising him, i think it's despicable. i think he's disgraceful, the president. personally, president obama should be accountable for his actions as well. accomplice, knew what was going on. shinseki knew what was going on. that is not politics no more. this is criminal. it's criminal. >> one thing that's been said though is eric shinseki, this is a man who's at the top of the food chain, if you will, and there may be 12 different layers of people who will go down to someone would will be initially examining someone, for example, your father-in-law. could you give some credence to the fact it's difficult to maybe go from that level all the way to the top, the man who's the secretary of veterans affairs? i understand your anger. i get it. but is there something -- >> it's impossible. impossible. impossible. he is the secretary, correct?