>> what is the most provocative entertainment news show on television? it is "showbiz tonight." tomorrow morning, be sure to watch morning express with me, robin mead. >> right now on "showbiz tonight," jessica's fat fury. jessica simpson strikes back at a disgusting fox football cartoon making fun of her weight. >> hey, tony. is jessica around? we could use a defensive tackle. >> jessica's furious response as stars dealing with their own weight battles rush to jessica's defense. brace yourself for a heated "showbiz tonight" debate. is jessica simpson's weight fair game? the great cougar debate. tonight courteney cox dishes brand-new shocking advice. the star of tv's hit show cougar town on how older women can get younger guys. is courtney just making women look desperate? plus s jon and kate's divorce hurting kids? the disturbing evidence that their nasty split could be affecting kids everywhere. tv's first most provocative entertainment news show starts right now. >> i'm a.j. hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from new york city. >> coming to you from hollywood and tonight, jessica fat fury. jessica simpson mad as heck and she's not going to take it anymore. she responding for the first time to a nasty, ugly and disgusting animated spoof of her making fun of her weight. what made it especially outrageous is it ran on a boy's club pregame show on fox. very funny, guys. how would you like it if the cartoon was making fun of your wife or daughter? simpson 1 silent no more. stars are coming to her defense. the latest developments made for big news. it's a fierce battle between titans at the gridiron. on defense, singer, actress and former nfl girlfriend jessica simple is hitting back hard against an offensive line. a line uttered in this animated fox sports cartoon. >> i still can't believe tony dated jessica simpson after she blew up. >> an animated short has blown up into the super bowl of weight controversies that has other celebrities screaming from the sidelines. >> the camera adds weight? i don't get it. >> in a twitter post, jessica simpson fires back at the sketch sponsored by burger king that aired on fox nfl sunday. >> hey, tony. is jessica around? we could use a defensive tackle. >> it makes fun of jessica and her ex-boyfriend, tony romo with several jokes about simpson's weight. >> unlike tony, at least jessica comes up big when it counts. >> she is blowing the whistle and calling a penalty. in her tweet she writes "i will never understand why people attack for a laugh. own your beauty and don't listen to the judgment." >> it was just in poor humor. they might as well have done yo mama jokes. >> they told "showbiz tonight" it was insensitive and a poor attempt at humor. burger king said it had nothing to do with the sketch's content, but some people aren't forgiving. >> how brutal can the media be about press and the people making fun of jessica. >> on "the joy behar show," she and valerie bertinelli weighed in on the jessica simpson controversy. >> the poor girl doesn't even look heavy to me? >> maybe five pounds and the camera adds weight. i don't get it. she is very beautiful. >> megan mccain has taken her share of cracks about her weight. she is also defending jessica simpson. she writes "the segment was disgusting for many reasons and very damaging to the body image epidemic that is assaulting young women in america." my only answer is refuse to take it. i refuse to be bully and refuse to let jessica simpson be bullied. >> you have the football team and jessica is the cheerleader and can't get on the top of the pyramid and here comes megan, the student body president and she will fight for her. >> "showbiz tonight" can say this sketch is far from the first time jessica simpson has been mocked about her weight. last january when concert video of a curvier than usual jessica showed up online, this is how she rolls. this cartoon showed an exaggerated characteristicure dumping romo for ronald donald. it's clear that simpson fines these jokes out of bounds. >> trying to use this as opportunity to get the message out that she is not letting them jokes get to her and nobody should be paying attention to them either. >> a lot of people upset by the weight slam, but taking shots at jessica's weight because she's a star? is that a clean hit? coming up, the great jessica simpson weight debate. >> tonight, a new disturbing development in the divorce fallout. "showbiz tonight" can reveal their nasty split could be hurting the kids. no, not their kids. your kids. so many people watch jon and kate plus eight as a family and now that they melted down, there troubling signs that other families could actually be affected. from jon's alleged womanizing ways to their big money showdown over who took what from their joint accounts. it's enough to make an adult's head spin. what about kids? with me in new york a psycho therapist and an attorney who runs mid-win charles and associates. we get hundreds of calls every day, but when diana from california called in, this got our attention. you have to listen to jon and kate's drama affecting her family personally. listen to this. >> caller: this jon and kate thing is hitting home. my poor child that watches this show and is old enough to watch the news, now my child is saying in tears this morning that they shouldn't have to be on tv and their mom and dad is being mean. this is terrible. icate is terrible and they need to sit down and forget about the and the money. they are way out of control. >> we appreciate your phone call. i hear that thinking she can't be alone. there have to be other families dealing with this. can you understand the effect jon and kate's drama could be having on kids and families around the country? >> sure because when you are connected to a show, they become almost a part of our extended family. that's what it feels like. when jon and kate's idyllic family breaks apart and there was fighting going on in the media, one could see where kids would get scared or start to identify with the kids that jon and had and say my gosh, is this going to happen to me? >> the kids are watching this marriage fall apart and saying i'm like their family. this thing going on is affecting families and kids have to be wondering what's going on. >> parents need to do a better job and make sure the children are not privy to this type of dysfunction that jon and displayed for the world to see. you have to remember this is not the brady bunch and everyone making nice and making cupcakes all day, every day. i don't think children should be privy to this stuff weather watching the news or the show. >> it's unavoidable. it's on every magazine cover. if they are old enough to read, they are seeing had this. we got big news about jon and kate. they confirmed over tlc that it will end next month. they are hoping to move forward with kate plus eight, the version without jon. regardless of what happens, given that parents and families are skiddish about the effects of what's going on now, should they be concerned about any gosselin show at this point? >> it's in poor taste to have a gosselin show at this point. we are not thinking about the impact of the kids. i think there will be a backlash. families are saying enough of this already. you just want to be on tv and get money and you are not thinking about the kids. the parents at home need to use this as a teaching moment to reinforce that their family is safe and secure and what they see on television is a show and even though it looks like reality, a lot of things that go on behind closed doors that we are not privy to. they make that separation. >> as has been pointed out time and time again, the whole thing turned into a nate mare and it's a stark contrast to how it began. i have been thinking that jon and kate owe their young fans and parents a public apology for turning their show into this reality nightmare and it could have been avoided. are you with me? they need to just before they shut up for good say i'm sorry. we didn't mean for this to happen. >> they should. they have been behaving badly and it's a poor example for everyone involved and the next iteration of the show should be the eight kids. just us 8 and that's it. get rid of jon and kate. >> you will get a lot of arguments saying kids should be off the tv all together. it will be interesting to see how it unfolds. appreciate t. >> i watched this new courteney cox show cougartown and it's funny, but tonight courtney is dishing shocking advice on how older women can get younger guys. is she just making women look desperate? we have the fired up cougar debate. how taylor swift may be getting the ultimate revenge and the joke may be on kanye west. >> if you hole the phone up to your ear -- >> governor arnold terminates talking on your cell phone while driving, but his wife gets caught doing it. shame on you, phony maria. >> now the "showbiz news ticker" and more stories from the newsroom making news right now. maybe kanye west will let taylor swift finish when she hosts "saturday night live." taylor said the gig is "mind blowing." he set off outrage when he interrupted taylor at the mtv video music awards. >> welcome back. i'm a.j. hammer. >> did you see this? phone-y maria shriver. the wife of arnold schwarzenegger cut on tape using a cell phone while driving. this is a big no-no since her husband passed a lay in 2008 requiring drivers to use hands free devices. we found plenty of other people had this bad habit too. >> when the governor of california's wife got nabbed on camera, many of us felt a twinge of guilt. she gets nabbed on the phone while driving. >> i just got cause myself and it's silly and not right. >> you should use a blue tooth. it's a shame she is breaking the law. >> the one banning the cell phone use while driving that the governor signed into law. he threatened to follow his two drivers of driving age. >> i will find out if you hold a phone to your ear and the car will be gone. >> instead his wife is caught holding the phone since the governor promised there will be swift action. will the threat to his daughters apply to his wife? >> the car will be gone. >> arnold schwarzenegger caused havoc in twins. >> i want you to take your foot off the gas and apply it to the brake. >> you got it. >> at least maria stayed on four wheels and hands free technology has its own drawbacks. >> i'm on my new blue tooth. it's liberating and you get so much done while you are driving. cubs or cardinals? >> maria's cell phone use was the talk of "the view." it had some lol related to the size of her phone. that's a monstrosity and reminded us of old movies. >> this is your wake up call, pal. >> we won. >> i better answer that. >> at least the newer little phones are easier to hide. >> weren't you going to use your phone just now? >> me? >> are you guilty of driving while talking on the cell phone. >> yes, i'm guilty. do you have to take my picture? >> i'm guilty. >> did you see maria shriver got nabbed? >> i'm just walking? >> you're okay. >> how do you solve a problem like maria ♪ >> maria shriver not only apologized for breaking the cell phone law, but will donate her phone to a local charity. >> if they want it. >> the phone lines have been ringing nonstop today. >> what are about it, aj? >> they are call being you and your beautiful baby, kate victoria. >> caller: i'm calling about somebody way better than a celebrity. brooke anderson, this is for you. i wanted to say how happy i was for you and your husband. congratulations on your precious little baby. although i was glad to have a.j. all to myself, i'm glad you are back and i can see you every day again. >> we appreciate your call and clear, brooke a celebrity in her own right. >> i just wanted to welcome brooke back. you look beautiful and you were missed by so many viewers i'm sure. it's wonderful to have you back and your beautifulicate is gorgeous. absolutely gorgeous. welcome back i look forward to seeing you every night. >> isn't it nice? not just on facebook, but they are so thrilled you are back and i'm included. >> it's so nice and the warm welcome means a lot. all working women know all working mothers know it's not easy to leave your child every morning to come to work. i really, really appreciate the thoughts. i love to hear from you all. give us a call and let us know what you think about my baby or anything else on your mind. the phone lines are always open. 88-sbt-buzz. >> there is a brand-new raging weight debate over the disgusting fax cartoon making fun of jessica simpson. >> i still can't believe tony dated jessica even after she blew up bigger. >> stars rushing to her defense and a lot of people saying that jessica's weight is a clean hit because she sells her looks. >> the fired up cougar debate. courteney cox who stars in cougar town giving advice to older women on how to get younger men. does this make women look desperate? now the "showbiz news ticker" and more stories making news right now. a brand-new britney spears show and a new contersy. let me tell you, this could be brit's most provocative song yet. it's all right tearing up the charts and debuted at number one and is her third career number one hit. >> listen to the words of this song. it is not g-rated. it's about threesomes. >> do you dig it? >> it's a catchy pop tune and anybody who is taking issue with this needs to take issue with half the songs on the charts right now. >> good point. i thought when i listened to it for the first time her voice is so distorted i couldn't understand the lyrics. i had to read them. some people are not going to know what it's about. >> they're know now, brooke. we spelled it out for them. to another raging debate on our facebook wall. explosive accusations about jon and kate's kids. star jones is attacking jon and kate's attacking the kids and using the word abuse. that word is getting people fired up on facebook. jon and kate are acting like idiots and i don't think they are abusing their kids. karen adds, don't confusion the sadness of abuse with dysfunction of two adults. children that are abused have parents that don't care. >> that's a terrific point. you can be a facebook fan and get our breaking entertainment news alerts on twitter. go to cnn.com to sign up right now. >> now the showbiz lineup. here's what's coming up. the jessica simpson great weight debate. >> i can't believe jessica dated tony. >> stars rushing to jessica's defense after that disgusting fox video. is knocking her weight fair game? the great cougar debate. the star of cougar town dishes out advice on how older women can get younger men. does this make women look desperate. kara on what it will be like without paula at the judge's table. >> now the showbiz news ticker and more stories from the newsroom making news right now. >> i still can't believe tony dated jessica simpson after she blew up. >> on "showbiz tonight," the great jessica simpson weight debate and stars rush to her defense after a skit making fun of her weight. is jessica's weight fair game? cougar alert. cougar town star courteney cox on how older women can snag younger men. is she making women look desperate. >> i'm like okay, how are you going end world hunger? it hit me. sell the vatican, feed the world. >> sarah silverman's controversial new spoof. not everyone thinks it's funny. tv's first most provocative news show continues right now. >> welcome back to "showbiz tonight." i'm aj hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from new york city. >> i'm brooke anderson from hollywood. the great jessica simpson weight debate over a fox skit poking fun at jessica simpson's weight exploded today. she fired back today for the very first time and some big stars are backing her up including valerie bertinelli. watch what she said on "the joy behar show" on hln. >> i don't get it. she's a very beautiful young woman. >> not everybody agrees with jessica's defenders. brace yourself. there some who are also saying making fun of jessica for her weight or anything else is fair game because she's a celebrity. are jokes about jessica's weight really fair game? >> not if you ask me, but some say yes. joins us is a publicist from hollowy wood and kim serapin with a senior editor for "in touch weekly." we will get to the debate in a second. i want you to look at what fox played in the nfl pregame show and think they should be ashamed of themselves for this. take a look. >> i still can't believe tony dated jessica simpson after she blue up. >> tony, is jessica around? we could use a defensive tackle. >> very funny. fox has now apologized for this, but jessica is ticked off and she fired back. i will never understand why people attack for a laugh. own your beauty and don't listen to the judgment. there so many ways that jessica could have respond and she handled it with great class and gave good advice along the way. are you with me? >> absolutely. this was in such poor taste and it wasn't even funny. it wasn't relevant. the last time people were talking about her weight was when she wore the mom jeans and is she wasn't fat then and not fat now and she's not dating tony romo anymore. to compare her to a 350 pound line man was not funny and i don't think a lot of people found it funny f. anything, it will will give her more sympathizers. she doing the right thing. >> here's the thing and this is what's been happening today. a lot of people out there are saying she is a celebrity and she is fair game and even jokes about her weight are fair game. do you think jessica has a right to be mad? >> certainly she has a right to be mad, but as a pioneer and a person who opened her to a reality television show, her weight sadly and unfortunately is fair game. for fox and burger king to drag themselves in the middle of something that is insensitive to people who there consumers, they are forgetting about consumers and focusing on jessica simpson, it is fair game and it is out of line and consumers will speak loud lie. >> who really gains when a joke like this is made at somebody else's expense? >> megan mccain has been attacked for her weight in the past and blogged about this point on the daily beast.com. what does anyone gain by this? the media can do better and this country can do better. if not for women like me then my little sisterer and i refuse to be bullied and let jessica simpson be bullied. i have to wonder if there is a bully mentality going on. is she an easy target for bullies and even her weight? even if it's a couple of pounds. i want to get your take. >> that's an interesting way to look at it and i think so. some people get a sick thrill out of kicking a man or a woman when she's down that. is what's happening here in some way. it's pitiful, malicious, uncalled-for and she looks beautiful. more power to her. >> we see this going on all the time. i'm hoping for the day it comes to an end. i don't know if that will take place. valerie bertinelli battled her own weight issues over the years. she is speaking out in a new interview. she makes a stronger point about the whole thing. jessica is not even overweight. watch what she told joy behar. >> how brutal can the media be about press and making fun of jessica. she put on maybe -- she doesn't look heavy to me. >> maybe five pounds? i don't get it. she's a very beautiful young woman. >> you have to take a look at what andrea t wrote on our facebook wall. it's not fair to go after her, but they are going after anyone who is famous. if she was too skinny, fat, got implants, that's just the price they pay for being in the spotlight. that was your point before, but my question is, shouldn't the line get drawn somewhere. if she had blochy skin or missing a foot, would it be okay to make fun of her? >> unfortunately it does. you open up your for ridicule when you are a public figure. it's not right, but it's the price you pay. the issue here is the example that it's setting for young women across this country and around the world that you will be ridiculed for being overweight. she is really only a few pounds over weight. this is a bad example to set and the corporate giants attached to this is startyiling and alarmin. >> parton the use of the phrase, but it should be a teaching moment. people need to wake up and making fun of people for their weight, especially a celebrity who has the last thing from a weight issue is a dangerous thing to do. here's what i want to read. lauren f writing it's not fair, but jessica simpson used her sex appeal to be famous so she has to deal with people criticizing her weight. this is more of an attack than criticism, but do you buy that logic? >> no. i disagree. she first became famous as a singer and did the newlyweds and her brand was the dixie girl. it was only in the dukes of hazard where she was known for sexiness. she known for her product line. i have a pair of jessica simpson shoes. it makes me want another pair. i will head to macy's. she is trying to be a business woman and trying to focus on her career and not trying to be a sex symbol. it's unfair and going back to the spoof they did saying i can't believe tony romo dated jessica simpson. i can't believe someone would date jessica simpson. come on. >> are there any guys if they gained a couple of pounds and cartoons like the one we saw about jessica. susan from texas makes a point about this double standard. let's look at that. >> it's getting to be ridiculous when people are picking on females for being overweight. a woman 20 pounds over weight is considered fat, but a man can gain all kinds of weight and he is stocky. there is the same double standard. always will be. >> we cover this all the time. would we have this conversation if it was george clooney? >> please. no way. i agree with the caller. the same old double standard applies. 8 man's weight can fluctuate and nobody says a word. a woman with five or 10 pounds here or there, it's the end of the world. >> nay stop soon. appreciate you guys being here. we have been asking to you vote on the question of the day. jessica simpson fat jokes s. making fun much her weight fair game. >> cougar alert. courteney cox has become the top cat in the cougar den with scenes like this from her show cougartown. >> we have these cute cracks. >> my feet had experience. they have seen things. >> i didn't mean anything bad. >> i so don't care. >> courtney is dishing about how older women can snag younger men. is courtney making women look desperate. the great cougar debate. >> kara opens up on what it will be like without paula at the judge's table. you have to hear this. plus, major controversy over sarah silverman's new spoof. >> i was like okay, how are you going to end world hunger? then it hit me. sell the vatican, feed the world. >> guess what. not everybody is laughing. wait until you hear what the catholic league has to say about sarah's new spoof. this is "showbiz tonight" on hln. >> more stories from the "showbiz tonight" newsroom making news right now. >> the hell with it. hey kid! pow! >> courteney cox is the ultimate cougar, but her new show is stirring up a lot of cougarlicious controversy. the great debate. is it sending the wrong message? >> pretty funny. i'm aj hammer in new york. >> i'm brooke anderson in hollywood. courtney's cougar advice. courteney cox is the new mascot for cougars everywhere on her new hit show cougartown. courteney cox is hot over 40 and dating men half her age. in a new interview with "usa today," she revealed her top rules for remaining the perfect cougar. is courteney cox empowering women over 40 or belittling them? you decide. joining me is the senior editor for in style weekly and an attorney for mid-win charles and associates. okay, lates. i pet there a lot of men who think she is cougarlicious in cougar town. she plays a newly divorced mother in her 40s struggling to create a new identity and dating younger men along the way. watch. >> there is a man in my house. >> should i call the police? >> no. i lied and -- just go look at him. >> come on! >> go do disgusting things to that boy. >> i need time to prepare. >> i love it. so funny. what are courtney's rules for being the ultimate cougar? number one, be your own biggest fan. her favorite cougar is herself. she is 45 and hubby david arquette is 38. is courtney the cougar sending the right message to women over 40? >> i don't know. i took a few minutes to look at the show the other day and sadly not impressed. not so much what the cougar concept is, but we all can remember samantha from "sex and the city." i don't know if she fits well into this role. she is not someone who exudes sexuality. the show or not concept, yes. >> harsh. okay. who is courtney's second favorite real life cougar. herself is number one. demi moore who is 15 years older than husband ashton kutcher. another is out there. who is it? madonna. she gorgeous and 51 years old dating 23-year-old jesus. that brings us to rule number two. embrace your age. do you think demy and madonna and courtney are embracing their age and giving them a better name? >> let's not forget halle berry. she has a younger boyfriend who is her daughter's father. any man would be lucky to be with her. this is a thing that we can get behind because really, you can be any age as long as you are confident in your sexuality and yourself and your appearance that. is a good thing. as far as cougartown goes, finding its groove. courteney cox's character is desperate and trying to find her way, but she finds herself as the episodes go along. i think that's something that is really, really relatable. >> the show was funny and made me chuckle and doesn't take itself too serious. >> it's supposed to be over the top. >> exactly. not everybody thinks courtney is sending the best message. some say her cougar character does seem desperate and insecure. way different than the real life courtney the cougar. watch this. >> i've got an idea. >> it's probably not insane at all. >> every night at 10:00 sharp, i will look out my window and if your porch light is on, that will be a signal that you think i'm attractive and you never have to say it to my face. >> you have noodles in your hair. >> somebody is obsessed with my hair. >> what do you think? is her character belittling this movement? >> i think she is. that's the clip i saw last night. i think she is only because. >> you were not impressed? >> my mom said what is this? turn the channel. the thing with her character and not the con70 cougar, but her character is she is so desperate. i think with the cougars that we have named, demi moore and halle berry, there is no desperation there. it's clear that the young men chased the older women and would love to be with them as well as a lot of younger men. she comes across as desperate and rightfully so that would turn off a lot of women. >> age is nothing but a number. she is supposed to be over the top and i think it's good when we can laugh at ourselves. we have to leave it there for now. we will continue this discussion. good to see you. thanks. >> did you see this, the 4th premier aired a short time ago. the action started much earlier in the day when tina fey got into ka noodling. meredith vieira was gunning for a guest spot and asked who she wanted to make out with on the "today" show staff. fair question. tina said al roker. do we want to see this? >> here we go. >> my gosh. >> i don't want to watch. wow. gosh. >> in other hot tina news, she said she would consider playing sarah palin again. >> sarah silverman is nurnd fire. i am like okay. how r you going end world hunger. sell the vatican, feed the world. >> sell the vatican? not everybody is laughing. wait until you hear what the catholic league had to say. time to roll out the "showbiz" news ticker. more stories from the "showbiz" news ticker making news right now. did you see this? sarah silverman stirring up big controversy. the vault scan. take a look. >> think about it. we need a hero. who is more primed to be our hero nan the pope? she is literally a caped crusader. this is great. sell the vatican. take a big chunk of money. build a gorgeous condo for you and your people to live in. with the money left over? feed the wheel [ bleep ] world. phil donahue says this is filthy and says it would never be allowed if the target were the chief rah buy. so with paula abdul out at american idle, will there be a deficit of cooky? this was a hot topic on "the view." >> you will have to be the cooky one. >> no she doesn't. >> that is easy. >> that's why -- >> who will be the crazy one? >> ellen? very she is not cooky. >> you cannot be cooky and informed. i am cooky at times but i know bhen i hear someone that is an amazing singer. >> you counter simon. >> i have no problem giving it to him. >> you are not as nice. what is the word i am looking for. paula jumped out of her seat clapping and supporting. >> she was nurturing. i thought ability that. i thought that was a very important role. these kids are coming in. they are nervous. they are singing a capella. it is -- i get nervous. you want to give them an extra shot. we are more nurturing. >> any speculation ha she pushed paula out it is redick louse. so we asked you to vote on the question of the day moments ago. i was handed the final results. mark it down. you can catch us on the 11s. we have the latest on the shocking story in colorado where the little boy floated off. women have more freedom, more education and more economic power. and brilliant play wright joins us in the studio. she earned one of the genius grapts. president obama is having as much trouble with the left as the right. and joining me in the studio. and one of the stars of nurse jacky. all that and more tonight. >> this was just crazy. nobody has ever seen anything like it. it looked like a silver flying saucer. it was reaching altitudes of approximately 8,000 feet. obviously it was just crazy and terrifying. we all thought there was a little boy inside. >> it finally landed. >> dad is eccentric times 126789 this is a guy who was a self-described inventor. he has done an ireport for cnn where he talked about life on mars. you get the idea. he appeared on wife swap with his family. >> that dup make him a bad person? >> no, it makes him a flying saucer. >> what about the kid? >> it has helium in it. it was meant to float around the the backyard. he wanted to invept a flying saucer. the kid was not supposed to go in it. he did. the last word was that the two older brothers were on top of the roof saying look at our brother he is up up in the sky. >> you have been breaking these stories for a long time. 30 years? >> yes, 30 years. >> now you are the awe t author of a new book. i want. my journey. >> whatever addiction you have golt, i had it. >> you had enough addictions for everyone in this studio. >> that is why everyone should get this book. america is an addict nation. if you are not addicted to something or co-dpept or an enabler or a gambler, everybody is addicted to something. especially food. >> alcohol was the worst one. what happen after :45678. >> do you know why you became an alcoholic? >> my dad. >> why would crow dedicate the book to him arer i love him. he did the best he could. >> and also the other thing about you, you are such an interesting person. i don't think fans understand how interesting you are. you recently came out on national tv as a leez beeian. >> it took me a long time. i tried real hard. >> how do you try? >> you date men. >> which part did you enjoy? >> i don't know if i can tell you on television? >> did you enjoy the sex? >> the thing that was lacking was the deeper emotional connection. i could leave men without feeling the tears but when i got into a relationship with a woman, those tears flowed. >> so the men were just sex objects to you. >> you know, the last boyfriend i had who is still a dear friend he gave me permission. he said you have to find out who you really are and i loved him for that. there was a missing kpoept. my basic identity. once i couldn't hide behind a bottle. when i was drinking i could drown the uncomfortable feelings. >> when you are drinking you can have sex with men even though you are a leez beeian. >> how old were you when you came out? a major adult. i have never been a major adumt. but i was beyond the age you would normally come out. i was in my late 40s. i fell in love with a woman in my late 40s and i had to -- >> were you married before? >> i am still good friends with miz husband. >> i any men can take it if their wife is a leez beeian. >> i cheese tho think sit easier. >> the reason i wrote the book is so many americans are struggling. i put them in the mind of the addict. my mind. i explained why addicts do not respond to reason. you can talk to them unill the they are blue in the face. the mind the not hearing anything that is said to an addict. you cannot scold an addict into sobriety. >> a friend of mind says that an addiction takes precedence over any relationship. >> your nurp one relationship is with the substance of choice. that is why children with an alcoholic parents grow uch bitter. >> you say it has taken decades to find out what makes you happy. >> waking up and doing something every day to try to make the world a better lace. the whole message is a transformation from being i, i, i to being of service. as part of this transition, the only thang has to change is everything. i also became a vegan which means i can say i go through the day without killing. i practice peace on my plate and every step. i try to. i am not killing to survive. that was just one of the best decisions i ever made in my life. >> you have given up all your addictions. >> do you smoke. >> you gave up your additions. >> i used the 12 steps. part of it is an r an inventory. all the plastic cups and bags and all this i can't say it on the air that i didn't need that i was bringing into my lich and that is an addiction. we are destroying the planet with plastic bags. rr okay, jane. >> i have tried to get into an addiction of sweaty yoga. >> that is uncivilized. >> you will not want to sit there in men pause. the book is called i want. go pick up a copy. up next. president obama's trouble with the right and the left. >> i thought it would be really important for the vice president to write the memoir telling us highway forceful he was in opposing the war and how story he was that he can actually do the right thing right now. >> the obama dupt heed his advice on afghanistan. and slaugerring over president bush it is refreshing to see how the left is willing to engage in an honest and open debate. joining me is actor and come mickey. welcome to the show. should biden resign? if obama sends troops into afghanistan? >> i think she is right on the money in terms on when you look back into recent history. poul should have spoken up. >> he knew. >> but colin powell became the good soldier. i agree. i think if biden threatens to resign if there is no truth reduction then we have a real country here. >> it is one thing to speak up and another thing to resign. the man could do many thengs. he doesn't have to resign. >> but the most serious thing of all is to send kids to have their heads blown off. >> you might start by voesing your opposition. >> can i move on. the thing about it? the fajt is that the left is questioning the obama. that is a healthy response. bush had yes men around him. he had cheney. >> cheney had yes men when bush wasn't the president. >> i think that is great. we should learn from europe. they have 14, 12 parties. there is the liberal wing. i think these parties should split up and have parties. the evangelical. the home phobic wing of the party. >> you don't mean that in a bad way? >> i think the two-party system is stupid. >> what happened the idea of parliament. >> when somebody said in the middle of the speech you lie, all held broke loose because we dared to question the president. >> you don't do it in that form. >> doesn't parliament do it? >> they do it in a specific place. >> are we saying there would be rules for questionsome. >> they need a time out to yell at each other. >> then there should be rules that would the rules say that when you do that it would not be racist? >> at the moment. >> also, the thing obama was talking about was immigration. here is the first mixed race president talking about mixed races. you put the math together. >> i am saying there is a place for di september. >> but not at that moment. >> but should there be? >> in england they have it. >> you cannot let one nut overrun. >> try to talk to me. i am in the room. okay? now, fox, the white house is also starting a fight with fox. >> go ahead. >> fox is making hay with this. listen to what limbaugh said yesterday about his own situation. >> this is not about nfl or the rams. it is not about me. this is about the ongoing effort by the left in this country wherever you find them to destroy conservatism. >> that was the right wing taking on the left. but glen beck has been making statements. what do you think? >> didn't you finish saying there should be many parties and voices? fox is not okay? >> they have made racist and more. they have the president, the vice president the supreme court congress and senate. they have ruined the country. >> last i checked we have a constitution that protects and has a first amendment and has a freedom of speech. >> you are condoning what? >> she has a point. >> the white house is firing back. the most dispickable things. >> calling them out is fine. >> they should be called ut. >> they are not, are they. >> they are just a tool. >> they are just a tool. >> i can't get crow to talk to me. >> it is not my fault. >> i want you to change seats. >> we are teterred to the table. >> we will be right back. they will be sitting where they are suppose fod be sitting. 6 i'm back with my political panel sitting in their correct seats. now, we touched on rush limbaugh in the last segment. i want to bring you up to date on something else about him. he has lost his bid to buy the st. louis rams. okay? a radio host stood up to him last night on anderson cooper. >> there are people out there, especially some st. louis sports writers, who don't like rush limbaugh's politics. and they make unquotes and do anything they can do to besmirch the man, to defile him, so that they make it as -- as awful as possible so that the nfl says, this is too toxic, i don't want to touch it. this is a high-tech lynching. >> before you respond, listen to limbaugh's reaction yesterday. this is not about the nfl, it's not about the st. louis rams, he said. it's not about me. this is about the ongoing effort by the left in this country, meaning you richard, wherever you find them, in the media, the timmic party, wherever, to destroy conservatism to prevent the mainstreaming of anyone who is a prominent as a conservative. is this a conspiracy? what's going on with him? he's really taking this very personally. >> clearly it's embarrassing. but i'm shocked that rush is upset over this decision. it's -- this is a capitalist country. his business partners have determined that he would be a liability to this business deal. so he's out. isn't that capitalism? capitalism is a shark. he's a victim of it. it wouldn't have been a good deal so what's he complaining about? >> did they know who he was when they had him to begin with? >> it's a good point. >> clearly they knew. >> i'd like to know who else in the whole nfl, what silent partners are out there, what they have said -- >> that's a great idea. >> i'm not a sports reporter. >> it's beyond sports though, that story. >> isn't rush limbaugh in the mainstream? >> this whole thing of conservatives saying they're not in the mainstream, as we all know, it's the biggest crock. they have the courts, they had the presidency, they had the congress, they have their own network. >> but he's not a politician. i guess that's what he means. just like glenn beck there, kind of on the sidelines provoking and provoking. >> fascist stooges who in the true sense of that word, that's not hyperbole -- >> why should he not own a team? >> they don't want him. >> they did want him, actually. they knew who he was in the beginning. >> he not only has said things about -- that could be construeded as racist he also attacked the nfl. they don't like him, they don't want him to be part of the situation -- >> he said things that are considered racist about a certain player in the nfl if i remember correctly. >> donovan mcnabb. you're talking about reverend al sharpton was one of the luddest people crying for him not to have -- >> right. >> i think it's because of al sharpton that he lost the bid to tell you the truth. >> the players were coming out. the players association -- two of them. >> had a lot to do with it. >> you don't need al sharpton in a case like this. he was just as always showing up at the scene -- >> i'll have to call adrian peterson sharpton, see what he says. we have to go. >> the show's over? >> quick, quick. >> why are we talking about limbaugh and beck? >> why not? >> so much. >> because they're fire brands. thanks to my panel for joining me. we'll talk a little girl pow where we come back. we have to change the subject. >> i want to talk girl power. >> you're coming back tomorrow. % we've come a long way, baby. was it worth the trip? that's the question being asked in the latest issue of "time" magazine. men aren't the only ones asking. joining me to discuss why, with all the gains we've made, women are less happy today than we were 30 years ago. our sirius xm radio shaw toe host and karen jenkins, president of the women's media center. welcome to the show. >> hi, joy. >> thank you for coming. now, since 1972, this is a study that's been tracking us for all these years. we are living longer, we're making more money, we're more educated. i mean, for example, 32% of women are now lawyers. in 1970 it was 3%. 28% of mds are female now. in 1970, only 8%. we've really made tremendous strides i think in the past 30 years. and yet the information is that we are not happy. why are we not happy? >> because men are still not doing the housework. they're not taking care of the kids. >> that's true. >> they're not in the house. >> they're not, yeah. >> they're absent. but first of all, i don't believe this. >> you don't believe it? >> no, i think -- >> why not? >> these surveys are skewed in a lot of different ways. number one, women are a lot more verbal than men so they complain a lot more. they don't have any problems telling you they have a problem. my daughter and my son, ten years ago, you will never hear a complaint from my son, never. you talk to my daughter, the sky is falling, it's a disaster, it's a drama. same with my mother and father. my father, very stoic. he doesn't say, i suffer. so men don't tell the truth about their suffering. they consider it a sign of weakness. they're not going to tell you they're miserable and unhappy. >> my father used to grunt. that was miss main form of communication. >> on the other hand, i have a very vocal son. my son complains much more than my daughter. i wouldn't want to fall quite in those stereotypes. >> i understand what you're saying, though, about how that might tilt a poll when they're being asked the questions. >> you know, in 1970 when i guess the second wave of the feminist movement began, 1970, women decided, we're not just staying home and having children, we're going to go out to work. over these last 30 years we've been working and taking care of the kids and cleaning the house and doing everything. do you think we're just overstressed and that's the problem? >> look, i think we're very overstressed. when i look at my life, my mother's life, my grandmother's life, my grandmother came to this country as an indentured servant from sicily. her mother died in childbirth. came here without an education, couldn't write her name. she married, had nine children. she had no washing machine. she had no money. she lived through the depression. but my grandmother did not have the expectations that i have. she was a woman who was dedicated to her children, she had 100 virgin marys around the house. she was deeply religious. and she was a happy person. because she believed that her family would fulfill her. she believed in god. she had a different purpose. my mother had five children. she graduated -- >> wow. very fertile, your family. >> she was number one in her class in high school. but women of her generation and in her family didn't go to college. so she had a life of some disappointment. because of that. right? she struggled -- >> she was in the middle there. >> you have to take into consideration, though, that many women in this country today are poor, are raising children by themselves, are not making what men are making doing the same work, have a great deal of difficulty fulfilling themselves. and it is stress. i think that if we just look at health disparities of women in color in this country, we've got a major problem. i don't think we can quite say we've come that far. there are so many women and so many children, mostly women and children, living in poverty in this country today, who don't have medical care. >> and don't have food -- >> i don't want to diminish that that exists. but joy -- >> we have made progress. >> it's across the board, this study. >> it's across the board but i think -- >> some of it is an exist terrible malaise that's going on. >> it is. and i believe that women and men by the way, the thing that makes them happy is relationships. material things do not make people happy. health care, yes. >> are you sure? >> no, i am sure. now, having money does not make -- >> i know so many happy label whores you can't imagine. >> it doesn't make people happy. not having money makes people miserable. i've been rich and i've been poor and rich is better. the truth is what fulfills human beings at the end of the day? it's relationships. relationships become so fractured in this country. because families are broken. you know, parents are living here, they're not married, the family unit is broken. there's really no communities -- >> to that point listen to this statistic. 54% of the women believe it is possible for a woman to have a fulfilling life if she remains single. >> of course, and i've been single for 17 years and i've had a very fulfilling life. >> so you're saying you need a relationship, you might not. >> not a male/female relationship. people need to have relationships. >> friends. >> aunts, uncles, neighbors, lovers. >> a community. >> wait a second, okay. >> our relationship, joy. >> i understand that. >> in that case women should be happier. we're good at that. the men are the ones who have trouble with relationships. with friends and colleagues and everything else. we're the ones who have the community thing going on. >> one of the things that we have is that, you know, in many -- with many of my friends, even in my case too, what we find is that our children will not have as secure, as good of lives as we've had, that because of the economy, because of the social fabric that we have, they're not as well-educated. they're not -- they don't have jobs. they don't have fulfilling lives. >> look, carol -- >> so i think that if you're looking at women and you're looking at what they project for their project, here's a piece of it. if they can't project as fabulous a career, a future, as you've had -- >> i see. >> that impacts your happiness. >> i did not have money when i was a kid. i grew up in a tenement in brooklyn. >> but happy. >> although indentured servants as little bit much. that was extreme. >> my grandmother had my mother when she was 47. she was very, very old. >> oh, my goodness. 47 is a chicken nowadays. >> i know. but back then. >> i went to queens college. it was $24 a term then. >> right. >> you know, you didn't really have to have a lot of money to go to school. it seems like it's costing too much money now to be an american. i think you have a point with that. >> our prospects are dim. for the moment we're a country with dimmed prospects. and i think a that what we're looking for is that hope to make possibility again. >> doom and gloom. >> i don't know what you did but i had a child first, then i had a career. i think that it was a little bit easier for me in that sense of not being overstressed by the burden of both at the same time. women are trying to do everything at once. it's a little tricky. >> i think that the issue there -- >> you had the job first? >> i had the child and the job. i raised two kids by myself, i did everything by myself. >> you know what you are, you're an indentured servant. >> i'm an indentured servant to my children. i've been a slave to love. >> i've heard about that. >> why not, a girl has to have fun. >> i had the job and the parents because i was in that sandwich generation where for 30 years i was raising small children, having a career, or attempting to have one, and taking care of ailing parents. >> okay, i think one of the important things is my grandmother took care of me when i was growing up. she helped my mother. we all lived in the same house. my mother helped raise my children. she lived with me. >> that's important. it takes a village. >> it takes a village. it's a really unusual thing to have that in this day and age. i think the central thing that is stressing women out, when they have little children, is child care. >> that's right. >> we do not have access to affordable child care in this country and it is a disgrace. >> they're saying in this study too that the fact that we have the children is a real factor in the unhappy innocence a certain way. >> because there's no support. >> there's a biological my mother helped raise my children. she lived with me. >> that's important. it takes a village. >> it takes a village. it's a really unusual thing to have that in this day and age. i think the central thing that is stressing women out, when they have little children, is child care. >> that's right. >> we do not have access to affordable child care in this country and it is a disgrace. >> they're saying in this study too that the fact that we have the children is a real factor in the unhappy innocence a certain way. >> because there's no support. >> there's a biological imperative that only women seem to have. and men get off on this point. >> that's because men can go on and on and on. >> there's no way to get around that though. we want to have children to keep the species going. >> that's why we have to have affordable child care. >> exactly. >> it's extremely important to support -- >> this country is not a reality about things like that. >> they have to get into reality about that. >> i'm a new grandmother and i'm opting for curtailing one's work life and going back in to help the children. >> you have done that. >> i have done that. >> thank you for doing that. >> i'm with my granddaughter on fridays and soon it will be two days. >> do you really want to do that 17? >> i do, i do. >> you want to go back to that? >> it's the most important thing to me. >> seriously? i don't know if i would love that now. >> my son just got married, i don't know. >> my carr got married last year too. she's taking her time so i don't know. there's no nana in my future. >> it's the best. it is the best. to make up for all those working years when you didn't have time to go to the classes. >> a lot of people don't have the luxury of that. >> it's a fortune if you want to send them to private school. if you can't send them to a good school you have to come up with the cash for that. thanks so much for doing this. it's a very interesting subject. thanks to my guests. fascinating topic. more on the subject of women's happiness on monday's show with marcus buckingham, author of "find your strongest life: what the happiest and most successful women do differently." that will be interesting. my next guest is one of the stars of tv's "nurse jackie" and also a brilliantly wright. her latest work is "let me down easy" where she plays a bus load of real-life characters from lance armstrong to lauren hutton. now that's talent. police help me welcome anna deavere smith. hi. >> how are you? my next guest is one of the stars of tv's "nurse jackie" and also a brilliantly wright. her latest work is "let me down easy" where she plays a bus load of real-life characters from lance armstrong to lauren hutton. now that's talent. police help me welcome anna deavere smith. hi. >> how are you? >> anna, you have taken a play to another dimension. you interview all these people. then you basically recite what they say verbatim from your interviews. yes? >> right. >> and you actually become the character. i saw you become al sharpton. and i've seen you become a lot of different people. in this particular show, you're talking about body image, death, and health care. not exactly an up show. but it's interesting. >> you don't think it's up? >> well, it is, but the subjects are serious topic yeah. >> do you think it's an up show? >> i think it's up that in the end it celebrates life. maybe that sounds not even authentically up. but i think that in the end it's about the good part of life. >> i mean, you talk -- a few of the characters i want to talk to you about, ruth katz. she as patient at the yale new haven hospital. >> or she was. >> tell the audience about her. >> what happened? well, she -- they lost her records. and the young lad who was the doctor didn't seem very interested or care very much that he lost her records then asked her in the normal course of events what she did for a living, which would be part of the rote thing she does. she played along with it, in the end she said, i'm associate dean of the medical school. they went around and found the records within half an hour. >> so suddenly they paid attention. >> paid attention. >> what does that say about the health care system in this country? >> it said two things. one, that even a person like ruth katz who has a lot of advantages and was getting great attention while she was at yale and yale is an extraordinary institution, even she was a victim of sort of carelessness. >> negligence. >> until she had to speak up and, you know -- >> throw her weight around. >> throw her weight around. >> eve ensler. she's the creator of "the vagina monologues." she's talking about skinny models and how they can't eat because they can't think -- >> anorexic girls. >> what was her point? that was quite interesting there. >> i think that she's tying the fact that in our culture we don't want to look at the fact that the rumor is true. like we're not going to live forever. our inability to look at that. you know, she's tying that to some other kinds of behaviors that we have. in this case the obsession with the body. and she talks about -- >> so the obsession with the body is like a distraction from this horrible truth that we're all going to die. >> right. >> i see. that was very -- yeah. she made that jump. there are other things that distract us too. shopping is a distraction from death also. comedy is a distraction from death. dancing. >> comedy's probably the most about death, right? >> well, it's the antithesis of death. laugh or cry. so i choose comedy. i like that. that's my defense. >> it's some of the funniest people who i talk to, two of them, one governor ann richards -- the late governor ann richards, and the other the late joe segal. both, even though i talked to them when they were close to death, get the biggest laughs in the show. >> i know they do, i know. >> what does that mean to you as a comic? >> it means we don't change that much at the end. which is one of the things that eduardo bruera, a palliative care physician, he is dealing with the dead -- deadly -- what is the word, people who are dying, all the time. and he makes a very interesting point that if you look back on your life and you see how you've handled loss over your life, divorce, parents have died, other tragedies, you will see -- this was so interesting to me. you will see how you behaved in those situations, and you can almost predict how you're going to behave at the end of your life when you get that final, you know, what's the word -- >> bad news. >> bad news. do you think that's true? >> i think it is true. i mean, i don't know. but it made a lot of sense to me and i interviewed over 300 people to make this project. and so i only performed 20 in the show. so anybody who shows up in the show is somebody who made a lot of sense to me. >> yes. now, do you think that this show -- a lot of it is about the health care industry. which we're all talking about right now. >> yes. >> and we're having a little trouble getting that health care thing through. the baucus bill is i guess it's one thing that's on the table. it eliminates the public option, which would allow poor people to buy inexpensive insurance. what do you think about all of that? >> well, i think it's a disgrace that we even have an argument about whether or not we should be having a culture and a country where everybody can be taken care of. everybody needs to be taken care of. we have the money somewhere in this country to take care of people. >> if we're afraid of dying which is one of the themes of your show, why not deal with it in a realistic manner? people die, everybody has an end. why not make that as easy as possible without destroying people's financial lives and everything else? why are people resistant to that? you're an artist. >> yeah. well, i think that one of the other characters, a dean of medicine at stanford medical center, you know, sort of says, we're going to have to look at this. because it goes right to the economics of what we're spending. we're going to have to think about not just how we live but how we die. but we don't do that in this culture. in the show he's followed by a musicologist who talks about schubert. she points out in vienna when schubert was alive and writing music, whenever somebody died, they would ring these bells so that everybody in the parish could stop and pray for whoever it was. they wouldn't know who it was. and i think, you know, in this culture, we -- there are lots of ways that we avoid death as you've mentioned earlier in our conversation here. so for us to get our head around living better, i think is going to call for a real cultural shift that's pretty substantive. >> it's interesting that schubert who died i think at 31 in a way it was logical she would go out -- she wasn't afraid of death. one of my favorite things she ever said was george w. bush was born with a silver foot in his mouth. she was funny. >> she was very funny. >> you were, too, at that very same convention. i remember you going up to al sharpton, al, you do all these march, how come you never lose a pound? >> i did say that to al. you know what he said to me? he said joy, joy, that's because i eat after the march he said. >> i thought that was -- the way you remember the silver foot. >> do you remember that? >> i remember that. i'll never forget it. >> i think he remembers it too. we'll be back with more after this. we're back with one of the stars of showtime, nurse jackie. anna smith. you co-star on "nurse jackie" with edie falco. let's look at that. >> what is that? >> tweetner. i have been looking for sweetener all over this place for three days. >> struck you funny, huh? you know, falco's character is a pill-popping nurse. i like the show very much. i'm really a fan of yours. >> thank you. mutual. >> but the american nurse's association is in a tizzy over this. they say you're making nurses look bad. >> i don't write it. i'm not making nurses look bad. >> but you're there. >> i'm probably making hospital administrators look bad. my character is a little looney. she's like the authority figure in the circus. she has no real authority. it's about the clowns. edie falco really runs the hospital. >> do you think that as an artist, you have an obligation to fulfill the image that a nurse, let's say a real nurse has of herself or a hospital? >> that's a really great, deep question. i don't think so. i mean, i guess that's really a heavy question. on the other hand we would say as a black woman, do i have a responsibility -- i mean, that's a deep question. i think in this case, this show is really about moral ambiguity and people stop me on the street and love the show. it's because they know they live in a world where things just -- >> nothing's perfect. >> people are not perfect. >> yeah. >> and she is a very good nurse as a matter of fact. >> she's a good human being. >> and a good person. but she commits adultery, pops pills. she's not perfect. when you played the national security adviser in "west wing" that was a great part for you, too. did you think at that time you would ever see an african-american become president in this country? >> no. here's the interesting thing. when i got cast in that as the national security adviser, it was right before bush -- he was running, and there was little chatter around that condoleezza rice might become national security adviser and i knew her because i taught at stanford while she was provost. and i walked up to aaron and i said, gee, by putting me in this role are you thinking about condoleezza rice. and he said who? so my little joke is i'm the first black woman national security adviser. but i did not think we would see the day of having an african-american president. i couldn't be more pleased and happy that it has happened. >> a one-woman show is "let me down easy." thank you. and thank you all for watching. good night, everybody. breaking news tonight, satsuma, florida, a 5-year-old little girl tucked into bed, five hours later, she's gone, vanished. the back door propped wide open. daddy comes home from the nightshift to find not a trace of little haleigh. the last person to see the 5-year-old alive that night, the stepmother, misty croslin. just hours after croslin handcuffed by cops on alleged road rage, she flies to new york, taking to the air to declare she's innocent. but even in one brief interview she can't keep her stories straight. first, claiming she knows nothing about haleigh's whereabouts, then blurting out the other side of the family took haleigh. then, a 180 on the failed lie detector, claiming she passed. then admitting she failed. after her brother tells cops he was at the home that night, no sign of croslin, completely debunking her story. her own mother, says croslin's not coming clean. croslin's tv response, they betrayed me. they're the bad guys. look at them, not me. minutes after croslin's debacle on national tv, her lawyer dumps her. bombshell tonight, croslin's mother now transferred from a tennessee holding cell on forgery to a florida jailhouse. at this hour, she faces police interrogation on just what she knows about haleigh's disappearance and her own daughter's alleged involvement. and why, police want to know, is she so convinced croslin's lying? will she crack behind bars? also, whenever the investigation heats up, croslin goes awol, but now we know her wing man, the woman who took her to orlando and new york, was undercover to befriend croslin and get the truth. did it work? this, while haleigh's father publicly stands by his new bride in a fit of depression over haleigh, cummings reportedly threatens to shoot croslin dead if she's involved. croslin and cummings now file divorce papers in a florida court. what does it mean to the investigation? croslin claims the holes in her story have nothing to do with the split, but have cummings' worst fears been confirmed, that his new wife, misty croslin, implicated in the disappearance of his own 5-year-old girl? >> misty croslin's mom was to be questioned by florida police, what does she know? >> she told me when she woke up she always keeps the lights out. she said she woke up and she noticed -- she was going to the bathroom, and she noticed that the kitchen light was on and she said she made it around the corner and because she went around the corner she noticed that the back door was open and that's when she ran back to the bedroom and haleigh wasn't in there. >> changes, even subtle, small changes in misty croslin's story about the night haleigh went missing bothered you. what changes, if any, do you recall? >> yes, ma'am. there's -- i can't really recall the exact changes and they're real small. it's not like she -- she pretty much tells me the same thing each time she -- i ask her about it. >> they keep saying that you failed. >> i know. >> do you want people to know something about that? >> they're going to no, they're going to know. >> are you saying that you didn't fail the polygraph like people in law enforcement are kind of claiming that you did? >> no, i never done. >> does it disturb you that misty croslin's story actually changed? >> yes, ma'am, it did. and tonight, live to wisconsin, a gorgeous young newlywed bride in extreme danger. the bride with "cover girl" good looks vanishes from her own home without a trace after calling 911. tonight, where is 31-year-old stephanie fischer? >> 31-year-old stephanie fischer was last seen october 6th, after reporting a domestic abuse claim against her new husband. she hasn't been seen since. in that claim stephanie says her husband, dennis moe, beat and choked her. moe admits to punching and strangling stephanie and says he did it because she was talking to guys on the internet. law enforcement desperately searching for stephanie as the alleged victim in several domestic prior incidents involving her husband and police say is armed and dangerous as law enforcement frantically search to bring stephanie home safely. and tonight, mommy at a local l.a. bus stop waiting for the bus. her 3-year-old boy asleep beside her. the bus pulls up, mommy gets on, drives away, leaving baby alone at the bus stop. she never comes back. sex predator, stalkers, dope addicts, who knows who would show up on the next bus but mommy didn't care. she just kept on riding. >> los angeles police are investigating the case of a 3-year-old boy abandoned at a bus stop in the middle of the night whose mother is now missing. 3-year-old xavier nelson was left by an unidentified woman. at a south los angeles bus stop after midnight on friday. >> lapd released this video to the media in hopes someone would recognize this toddler and someone did. angela thomas says her mother called her from the southland saying she saw her grandson on tv. >> my heart dropped, i was about to cry, not just because i saw him, because of the story that they were telling. >> a witness observed the child sitting next to the woman when the bus arrived. the woman then got onto the bus and left the child behind. the witness yelled to the woman to tell her she forgot the boy but the woman just waved him off. >> angela says the last time she saw her daughter victoria nelson and grandson xavier was a week ago. >> the grandmother says 17-year-old victoria may be in danger and could had been forced to abandon her child. >> victoria would never, ever put her child in harm's way like that. she would never do that. unless there was a reason and the reason was somebody has caused harm on her. >> good evening, i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being with us. croslin's mother, now transferred from a tennessee holding cell on forgery to a florida jailhouse. at this hour she faces police interrogation on just what she knows about little haleigh's disappearance and her own daughter's alleged involvement and why, police want to know, is she so convinced croslin is lying? will she crack behind bars? >> more details emerge in the case of missing florida girl haleigh cummings. misty's mom, arrested. >> this mother came out against misty and said that she believed that her son was telling the truth and that misty was not. maybe they want to put her in jail so they can ask tough questions about why she came to such a conclusion. >> lisa croslin told fox affiliate wofl -- >> yes, i think that my daughter's holding something back. i think they are both holding something back. that's just in my heart. >> when did you last see her? >> what we need is for misty to come out here and tell us the truth. >> i'm trying to do everything to find her, you know, i'm answering any questions i have to cause i know i didn't do anything with -- to that little girl. >> i don't think that she holds anything information that's going to find haleigh. >> ronald cummings, ever disturb you that misty croslin's story actually changed? >> yes, ma'am it did. >> if i knew where she was we wouldn't be sitting here today. we'd have her and i don't -- i don't know where she is. >> straight out to investigative journalist art harris at www.artharris.com. art, you've been on the story from the very beginning and spent months down in satsuma, florida. now the mother, misty croslin's mother has officially been transferred from tennessee on, what i believe, to be a trumped up forgery charge. yes, she did it, but you rarely see people thrown behind bars and this kind of bond on forgery and now she's been transferred to florida. she's on the turf with the local police department. and she's facing questioning tonight. what will happen? >> nancy, they're anticipating, asking her to compare the story that misty told her, according to what lisa, the mother, told me on my website on artharris.com, comparing what misty told her the night haleigh vanished with what misty has said since then. so they have a number of stories they're going to compare. plus, they want to know why the mother believes her daughter was not telling the truth in her heart of hearts. that's what she has said. >> well, art, what i want to get down to, the nitty-gritty, is what do we know, if anything, about what croslin told her mother? now behind bars and facing florida police interrogation. what do we believe she told the mom versus what she's told to the morning shows, what she's told to the husband, ronald cummings? she's tripped up on her own story several times that we know of. >> well, nancy, she has gone over what happened that night in that she woke up, saw a light on in the kitchen and went in to check and then turns around and saw haleigh missing. so there are some specific steps during that night that she took that are a little off than what she said before. >> take a look at misty croslin and her debacle on national television. how does what she say he says here line up with what she told her own mother at the time haleigh went missing. >> the last time you had seen her before then was when? >> 10:00 when i laid down for bed. >> you had put her to bed? >> uh-huh, she went to bed at 8:00. >> but your brother had told police that when he went to the trailer that night that you were supposedly putting hailey to bed, you weren't there. did you go somewhere that night? >> no, i did not. i did not leave my house at all. >> why did he tell police that you weren't there? >> trying to get out of jail, that's what i think. >> so your brother was in jail? >> yes, he was in jail. yeah. >> your own brother would betray you like that? >> that's how my family is. i mean my story's not changed. it's same, it's the truth. >> can you sit here and tell me with 100% certainty that you had nothing do with haleigh's disappearance? >> 100% positive that i didn't have nothing to do with haleigh gone missing and i don't know who did. >> you're seeing misty croslin on cbs's "the early show." we're taking your calls live, but first let's unleash the lawyers. joining me tonight sue moss, child advocate, family law attorney, new york. mickey sherman, criminal defense attorney, author of "how do you defend those people?" new york. and renowned defense attorney, former prosecutor, darryl cohen, atlanta. sue moss, brother? hey, what about your mother? this is very rare that somebody's own mother speaks publicly against them. >> look, forgery mom is going to either give up her girl or give jail a whirl. they aren't letting this woman out until she spills the beans. she knows something. she wouldn't have come on national television and implicate her daughter if she didn't know something and they're going to get that out of her. >> darrell cohen, come on, you and i practiced in the same courthouse. since when do you have a mom come out against the alleged perpetrator, the suspect, that never happens. usually they're crying and screaming and waving the bible at you, throwing things at you from the front pew right behind you as you are trying the case. >> nancy, that is so true, but as i like to say sometimes, welcome to never. there's something going to here and we're not sure what it is. is mom trying to get off trumped up charge? i agree with you, something's going on. and mom may just have this heartfelt sympathy for this poor child that's now disappeared. >> what about it, mickey sherman? >> i don't know the mom doesn't look like a criminal mastermind to me. these people are stupid and creepy but does not necessarily mean that they are murderers. >> is there any possibility that she left the home that evening and hasn't told you? >> if there is a possibility of it, i don't know anything about it. ings ron and misty headed for divorce. what does that mean? in the search for little haleigh? >> the papers are all filled out. misty's -- misty's lawyer has been in hand. >> it may be in her best interest -- both of their best interests just to sever the ties and move on. >> they got married. they went on their honeymoon to new york city they were on a couple of tv shows and came back to reality. >> if i find whoever has my daughter before you all do i'm killing them. >> this is what haleigh wanted. she's always talked about it and even if she's not with us, she's still here with us. >> there's really no privilege here that can prevent ron from testifying against her. just because they're married. so if that what was they were attempting to do and then they certainly missed the mark. >> i would sure hope that -- just -- with the family problems and everything else, it's just too much on the relationship. >> he's not as strong at home as he is on tv. he does the best that he can and just tries to make junior happy until haleigh comes home. >> isn't it true, mr. shoemaker, that ronald cummings -- let's take a listen to exactly what misty croslin's mother had to say on camera about her daughter. >> deep down in my heart, yes, i think my daughter's holding something back. i think they are both holding something back. that's just in my heart. >> i'm going to tell her i love her and if you know anything at all, please tell me. we can work through. i'll be right there by your side. we'll get through it. but just please tell me whatever you're holding back. >> that's misty croslin's mother lisa croslin, she was on wofl, fox 35, saying she believes croslin may be hiding something. schiavo, marlaina schiavo, our producer on the story, i understand misty croslin has a response to her mom. now, as of tonight behind bars in florida facing police questioning regarding haleigh's disappearance. >> yes, i asked misty, why does she think her mother would say something like that? her response? she was mad at me. i said, she would say that on national tv or even local television just because she was mad at you, misty? yes, that's why she said it. that was her response. >> okay, repeat? >> she basically said that her mother was mad at her and that was her revenge, by telling everybody on, you know, that was watching television that her daughter was hiding something. it was revenge for getting this injunction against tommy, her brother. >> and elie jostad, our chief editorial producer on the story, she took on the airwaves. croslin took on the airwaves herself on national television and said, her brother and her mother are the bad guys, look at them, not me. and said they betrayed her. that's her position. >> right, she said that her brother tommy told this whole story about going to the trailer the night haleigh went missing, knocking on the door, nobody being home. she says the brother told police that because he wanted to get out of jail. >> let's go to the lines. joanne, pennsylvania, hi, joanne. >> caller: hi, how are you, nancy! >> i'm good, dear, what's your question? >> caller: well, first tell you we love you. got your book, your babies are beautiful. i'm so happy you finally got a piece of happiness in this life. >> i really did. two pieces, and three if you count that husband. >> caller: that's right. >> but two for sure. >> caller: uh-huh. my question is out here in pennsylvania, we have children in youth services. how come they haven't gone to the police and possibly arrested her if anything for child neglect? >> excellent question. >> caller: when she's the last one who had the child? >> what about it, darrell cohen? >> i think if there's a scintilla of truth whether she had to say and then she fell asleep and the child disappeared. the reality is i'm stunned that child services, protective services haven't been there and just annihilated her with questions, because, nancy, you and i both know, if you tell the truth, you don't have to remember what you said, it doesn't matter how many times that you say it. it's absurd. >> mickey sherman, come on, how many stories have we covered where mom fell asleep and the baby wandered off into a pond, into a forrest, into traffic, and all of those moms were held responsible? >> yeah, there's no facts to support it. we were all guessing -- >> the story is she fell asleep and the baby went missing. >> hey, the lindbergh child was kidnapped from their home, they weren't prosecuted. >> you're reaching back several decades, mickey. good try, though. >> it's a good analogy. >> just divorced. i mean, i don't want a divorce, but hey, that's what he wants so it's whatever. i'm not going to fight him. after the divorce is final, do you believe ronald cummings will have more to say to police? >> i don't -- i don't believe so. i know that in all of the times that we've met with law enforcement, which really hasn't been that many times, i know that he is -- he's been very forthright on the number of times he called her, when he called her, what the conversations were all about, so i don't think that he's really going to come without any bombshell as to, well, i was holding this back. >> help me out, misty. why were there inconsistencies? why did you say one thing one time and one time the other? >> um, i don't know. >> but you -- but you know that you did do that? >> yeah. >> and you're not sure why? >> no. >> that was croslin on nbc's "today" show back in march by giving some pretty vague answers. we're taking your calls. bethany marshall, weigh in. >> i think that misty and her mother both have something in common. they're both good at pointing fingers, and saying you know what they think went wrong. but neither of them have offered very good theories about what happened to this little girl and they haven't offered theories in empathetic ways. for instance if the little girl was a wanderer in the night or somebody who might be a child predator who was trying to befriend the family. and misty's mom hasn't said she had a lot of party friends and there were parties in the neighborhood that night, so the fact that misty's pointing to other people and her mom's pointing at her in an accusatory way but they don't seem to be empathetic about this little girl. they don't seem to be spinning out theories and helping law enforcement. it makes me suspicious that they're just mired down in their own quarrels and contention and family drama and dysfunction and that they're not going to aid at all in the search for haleigh cummings. >> tonight, croslin's mother behind bars in florida facing police questioning on haleigh's disappearance. >> do you feel that misty is a key in this investigation? >> no, i don't. i think that they're barking up the wrong tree. dddddddd% what time was haleigh last seen by anybody other than cummings and croslin? >> the last time i'd seen her was -- >> i didn't ask when you saw her. certainly you, as the biological mother, know the facts of this case. so when was she last seen by someone other than the father and the stepmother? >> that i don't know. >> have you asked her what happened? what does she tell you? >> i ask her, but i don't get any answers from her about, you know -- i don't see -- what she's telling me is not inconsistent. >> bottom line you don't know where haleigh is. >> to art harris investigative journalist at artharris.com. what more can you tell me, art? >> i can tell you that that night, or that afternoon, haleigh was seen playing with her cousins at the trailer riding bikes, running around, having fun. and then at 6:00, tommy comes over to see misty. they hang out for a while. and then 7:00 to 7:30, law enforcement tells me that her grandmother came over and with a clean batch of clothes. which raises question, why does misty have to wash a blanket later on and ronald is saying there was no detergent in the trailer anyway. >> what more can you tell me about the brother and what, if any, advice does croslin's family give her about speaking to cops? >> initially when i spoke to lisa croslin the mother and the sister-in-law, they were warning misty to be careful about what she said because she was tripping up on herself and people were attacking her for inconsistencies so this was early on, nancy, at the house. and they were also pointing fingers at a cousin trying to -- whether to divert attention, they believed this young man from tennessee who was there that night and left the next morning had something to do with it. he's been interviewed twice by police in the last two weeks and has not been -- and has been ruled out as in any way connected. >> but right now he's not a suspect nor is misty croslin been named a suspect in this case. >> correct. >> and, art, i want to go back to the wing man, the so-called "friend" who was actually working undercover who befriended misty croslin. took her to orlando, went with her to new york for her tv appearance. >> right. >> what can you tell me about donna's time with misty croslin? >> she was told by tim miller head of equusearch to get close to her. possibly any clues that would lead to haleigh, what happened to her. in hanging out with her, gosh, several weeks, she got close to misty and said there were more inconsistencies that came up. nothing specific but she shared that with investigators, sat down with them several times and recently after she dropped misty off for the last time on saturday, had the falling out, misty learning that she was a "double agent," she then went and told police further what she knew. and one thing that came out, nancy, that was very interesting to them, she has an explosive temper we have not seen in public. so whether that has anything to do with what could have happened to haleigh, we don't know. but that is something that donna brock reported. >> with me now marc klaas, president and founder of klaaskids foundation. what do you think, marc? >> first of all, i think that this seasoned wing man that betrayed misty, i think we have to -- we have to consider this woman. of the hundreds and thousands of cars that are driving on the roads of florida, this is one that gets in a road rage situation that's so serious that the other person feels they have to contact law enforcement. and as for misty's explosive temper, my goodness you find out that somebody you've befriended is working behind your back for somebody else to betray you, i would get explosive as well. i think what we're dealing with here with misty and her mom are some pretty shallow people who don't really think much before they speak and they pretty much blurt out anything that comes to mind. they are focused on each other. nobody seems to be focused on the little girl but as mickey said, charles lindbergh and also poly, elizabeth smart, van dam. jessica lunsford were all stolen from their homes as family members slept nearby. >> marc klaas, you're absolutely right on that point. everyone the tip line. right now we're going to wisconsin and a missing mother, beautiful with "cover girl" good looks. disappeared immediately after calling 911. take a listen. >> police are desperate to find 31-year-old stephanie fischer. stephanie was last seen with her new husband dennis moe, who authorities say, is armed and dangerous. stephanie reported domestic violence incident against moe and hasn't been seen since. dennis moe drives a gray, 2006 dodge charger with wisconsin plate number 272pxt. stephanie stands about 5'10" and weighs about 180 pounds. she has blond hair, blue eyes and has a large rose tattoo on her back. >> straight to dan o'donnell with newsradio 620, wtmj. dan, what happened? >> well, near as anyone can tell, she went missing, as you heard, just after calling 911. just after police interviewed her new husband. there has been a constant stream of domestic violence incidents before they were married just a couple of weeks ago dating back to july. he's been arrested several times all with the same basic premise. he's been attacking her. he's been attacking one of their young daughters. in fact, back in july, twisting her arm. the little girl behind her back. and in this latest incident what we know from the police report and the criminal complaint that he actually stuck a shotgun in her mouth and said he wanted to use the biggest shells possible so she would die a slow and painful death and he said she wanted to -- he wanted to see her choke on her own blood. so obviously this is a very dangerous situation. >> to detective michael hartwell with the west bend police department joining us from west bend, wisconsin. detective, thank you for being with us. what was the nature of her 911 call? what was she saying? >> that initial call was to report the initial domestic violence. there were actually two incidents that were reported at that same time. and so we sent officers up there to investigate it at that point, and that's when we learned of the incident that dan o'donnell just spoke of involving the shotgun. >> with me a special guest yvette cade joining us from washington, d.c. you remember her and her brave fight against domestic abuse. she was actually set afire inside a phone store by her ex. she suffered terribly as she is with us tonight. you're seeing video of that. the store surveillance right now. ms. cade, it's -- first of all, welcome. it's very rare for domestic violence to go away. in fact, most typically it escalates. >> thank you for having me, nancy. yes, it does. once stephanie put up a protective order out on her husband potentially the stakes went higher. it skyrocketed for risk for extreme bodily harm. what i suggest the family to do is to go to the police department, the mother, father, siblings and children and take a swab test kit from missing persons. >> well put yvette. yvette having to live through the nightmare of being set afire. you're seeing video of it right now by her ex. and in that case, there had been so many prior incidents. to ron shindel. weigh in, ron. >> nancy, domestic violence that doesn't stop, initially goes past the first incident, escalates, escalates and keeps escalating until we have consequences that sometimes lead to a very serious injury or sometimes homicide. >> and elie jostad, where's the husband, the groom? >> nancy, we don't know where he is but police say he's armed and dangerous as they explained before, he's known to have a shotgun in the house. they did find a 12 gauge in the house. they believe that the victim, the alleged victim is likely with her husband right now and they're looking for their vehicle. >> if she's still alive. everyone, the vehicle, a gray dodge charger wisconsin license 272p, peter, x, x-ray, t, tennessee. a special thank you to dan o'donnell and detective michael hartwell. as we go to break, happy birthday to florida friend, fran newton. proud mother of three. not only works side by side with her husband, she volunteers for years at the local hospital. never misses a show. loves sewing aprons for friends. she's 88 today. happy birthday, fran. and happy birthday to my brother, mac. here he is with his wife, jan. besides from being one of the top sales reps in the country, a husband, a father of two boys, both of whom they're putting through college, he's an avid runner. he survived a heart attack at an early age. aside from all of that, he's the greatest brother i could imagine. always there in the good times and the bad, through thick and thin. happy birthday, mac. breaking news, a missing person's alert has gone out for 31-year-old stephanie fischer. police say stephanie taken by her new husband dennis moe. a man who's had multiple domestic violence abuse claims against him. those claims including beating, choking and even putting a gun in stephanie's mouth. police say moe is to be considered armed and dangerous. stephanie believed to be in extreme danger. >> straight to elie jostad also on this story. elie, what more can you tell me about this guy? he's disappeared too. >> right, nancy, i'm counting at least five alleged incidents involving these two, alleged domestic violence, that dennis moe is claimed to have perpetrated on the victim. going all the way back to july as the other reporter explained. he's now facing this laundry list of charges, battery, strangling and suffocation, second-degree reckless, endangering, intentionally pointing a firearm at a person. he's looking at at least 20 years, if he's convicted on all of these counts. >> dr. bethany marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "deal breakers." what do you think? >> i'm concerned about the escalating pattern of violence, but i'm also concerned that he may have kidnapped her or absconded with her in order to convince her to drop the charges and women, if you are in a domestic or violence abuse situation and you call 911 and the police tell you to press charges, press the charges. do not let your husband or boyfriend convince you otherwise. and if there's a tro, respect the temporary restraining order, because the biggest mistake that women make is they feel guilty. they go back. i'm not suspecting that that's the case in this particular situation. but the husband tries to get them to drop the charges and that's, you know, could be a part of the picture in this -- in this situation. >> with me, dr. marty makary, physician and professor of public health johns hopkins. dr. makary, you know i remember when i first became a felony prosecutor, and we don't deal with simple batteries or simple -- it's got to be bad by the time it gets to felony court. i remember a woman coming into court with a broken leg and a cast, her hand was in some kind of a -- not a cast, but something else. she was dragging her leg along behind her with the boyfriend. and she wanted to drop charges, all right? >> yeah. >> you must see it all the time. >> we do see this sort of allegiance to the abuser, and domestic violence is called the silent killer because women are often silent about it. there is this sort of allegiance or feeling of guilt that they don't want to turn in the person who sometimes can redeem them. we see these characteristic fractures, dislocations, burns and lacerations where the mechanisms just don't make sense and we know it's domestic violence. we're often limited in what we can do but this is a good example of a situation. >> doctor, you're so right. back to detective michael hartwell with the west bend police department. detective, isn't it true that, in fact, on earlier occasions, police would come to the scene, after a 911 call from her. she would be horribly beaten and both she and the new husband would say, she fell down the stairs. come on? >> yes, that is part of the reports that we've had, you know conflicting information regarding how -- you what is told to us after we get up there and do an investigation and in some cases she's changed the story and told us what truly happened and how she became battered and we've seen this continuing escalation. >> to the lawyers, sue moss, mickey sherman. darryl cohen, i don't know if you were prosecuting with me at that time, i think already a defense attorney, but when the lady dragged in with the broken leg, i said, to the witness stand, we did not drop the charges. and he ended up pleading guilty, darrell. i mean the problem is if your witness, your victim won't testify, you really don't have a case unless you can make it without the victim. >> how do you do that, nancy? you do it with photographs. do you it with her outcry witnesses and you do it and make her feel guilty, if nothing else, and you make her testify because if she's not saving herself, perhaps she's saving another woman somewhere down the line. >> right. >> somewhere down the road. >> to lori in new york. hi, lori, what's your question. >> caller: hi, nancy. nice to talk to you. >> likewise. >> caller: first of all i want to say your twins are gorgeous. beautiful. and i'm glad your mother is feeling much better. >> thank you, i saw eleanor today. took her another casserole. she's on the mend. go ahead, dear. >> caller: i do have a question. this woman, do they have any idea where his relatives may be? >> excellent question. >> caller: where he is? >> to you, detective hartwell, where are his relatives? >> we're working on that time with them at this time with other law enforcement. where we've had some contact with the son and we're doing some other follow-up with other relatives here in the state at this time. >> to christine, illinois. hi, dear. >> caller: hi, nancy. how are you? >> i'm good, dear. what's your question? >> caller: very good. i have a comment and a question. >> okay. >> caller: i'm a victim of extreme domestic abuse. >> yes. >> caller: and i have to tell you why these women that have broken legs and are battered bad, the reason why they don't say anything is they know that they will kill them if they say anything, number one. and my second question is if you have three domestic charges against you the state can pick that up even if the victim does not do that, and he actually should have been in jail. >> good question. mickey sherman, what about it? >> you know the problem is that so often it's the wife who wants to -- or girlfriend who invites herself back and i'm not casting stones at her, it's an addictive personality. and they just can't seem to draw themselves out of these horrendous relationships. as dr. marshall said, and that's a real problem for the prosecution. you've got to put them on the stand in spite of themselves and bring in an expert, and i've seen it done, saying, she's lying to you because of this, that, and the other thing and you need a psychologist to get up there and say that. >> everyone, we are switching gears and still taking your calls. i want to tell you about a story we reported on the other night. a 3-year-old baby boy left asleep at the bus stop by his mother. mommy gets on the bus and drives away. to stacey newman, our producer on the story. stacey, what is the latest? >> well, a brand new development has come in as we go to air, nancy. lapd is telling us right now, nancy, that there has been a sighting of this mother literally just hours after she abandoned this boy at a bus stop. she was spotted in south central, l.a., by someone who did not know she had abandoned her child. >> to misty reef, reporter. what can you tell me, misty? >> i can tell you what she's saying is correct. the person that saw her on saturday did not know that xavier had gone missing or not really missing but it was abandoned. that's the last we've seen of her so far. she was actually described as the five feet 4 inches tall, the woman who left xavier at the bus stop. in fact, victoria has a light complexion but she's actually six feet tall with burgundy or red hair. >> misti, what was the mother doing when she was spotted on saturday? this after having abandoned her child, her 3-year-old at the bus stop. a homeless guy tried to say, "hey, you're leaving your son." and she shoed him away, got on the bus and kept on riding. what was she doing when she was spotted? >> when she was spotted, police have just told us, it was -- they haven't told us what time of day it was. she was just walking the street of south central l.a. they haven't told us any more beyond that. >> victoria loved xavier to the point she will not place him there. if she would have wanted to do something like that. she would have left him with me. at the top of the hour, jessica simpson furious about making fun of her weight. "jon & kate" divorce, are they hurting other kids besides their own. and starting cougar tips for women. >> a brand-new development has >> she abandoned him at a bus stop. to caller, michelle. >> caller: thank you for taking my call. >> thaw for calling. >> caller: i know she had the boy when she was tuned for recently had another child at 17. maybe unbeknownst to her mom or sister because they don't want to 53s the truth, maybe she's closet drug people. is that possible? do they know for sure? >> michelle, anybody could be on drugs. but under the law, mickey sherman, that in no way is a defense. voluntary use of drugs or alcohol, unless you are comatose, if she got on the bus she's not comatose, is not a defense, ever. >> there's no defense. >> everybody in the jailhouse would say, i was drunk. >> to me it's a level of insanity. how do you -- >> there you go. you know what? i can't hear you. >> how do you leave your 3-year-old child on a bench? >> i was speaking figuratively. i can actually hear you, i'm sorry to say that. sue moss, help me out. >> oh, my goodness. two kids, an abandoned child, 17, this woman's a bad decision-making machine. she wasn't insane, she knew what she was doing. this isn't the first time she abandoned one of her children, hopefully it will be the last. >> to ellie, very quickly, a discrepancy in the descriptions of the woman that got on the bus and the woman. >> right. the grandmother of this little boy continues to insist that although the person leaving the boy on the bus is described as 5'4" and black and hispanic, that the mother of the boy victoria is 6 foot, very skinny. everyone, let's stop and remember army private first class william lee meredith, 26, virginia beach, virginia, second tour, also served afghanistan. awarded bronze star, purple heart, iraq campaign medal. army service. video game, music, favorite band tool. he leaves behind parents, brother is marcus, michael and tyrone, best friends chris and eddie. william lee meredith, american hero. thanks to our guests but especially to you. i'll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp eastern. until then, good night, friend.