russia might feel compelled to take a retaliatory step in response. >> but it's not just a lack of leadership by the president, right, guys? i mean, we have actually the exact opposite. i mean, this is a president, as "the washington post" reported back in september 27th who told two senior russian officials in a 2017 oval office meeting that he was unconcerned about moscow's interference in the 2016 u.s. presidential election because the united states did the same in other countries. this is somebody who has put forth a debunked theory that it was actually ukraine and not russia that -- >> chris, i think chaos and destabilization are kind of a -- a hallmark of donald trump's strategies. and if you think about it, this fits into the larger narrative of who he is and how he leads as a president. he has led by questioning media, questioning every institution that people in the country, for years and decades and since, frankly, the beginning of the country have relied upon. where it's the media. whether it's members of congress.