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they pull the lever is someone who we actually want to be president of the united states? now, we've seen trump level off a little bit, but recently in the light of the terrorist attacks in paris his numbers have started to go back up again. because you have president obama, the juxtaposition between president obama who is so weak and so passive on things and americans are looking at this going this guy's incompetent, what is going on? then you have trump come in and say we're going to win. and we're going to blast isis back to hell. so people look at him and say, yeah, yeah, that's who we want forgiving him for his other transgressions which i think is not necessarily good. >> jennice, one of the really fascinating parts of athena's report there was that she sort of lays out the state of the race here on thanksgiving keeping in mind that some of the dates for these early contests have changed since 2008 and 2012. but 2008 rudy giuliani was leading nationwide. mitt romney was leading nationwide in 2012. romney won the nomination, giuliani completely cratered.
republic and we have to respect it, but that doesn't mean you can't nominate judges that could potentially overturn it, you can have an activist court. he's going to have to answer for it. that's what campaigns are about. there needs to be some clarity on that, but i think he'll do just fine. >> a majority of independents are in favor of same-sex marriage so we'll see how he explains that moving forward. if he gets that far. tara, jennice, thanks to both of you. up next, there's new video of a scene of a deadly shooting that has a white chicago police officer charged with murdering an african-american teenager. innovative sonicare technology with up to 27% more brush movements versus oral b. get healthier gums in 2 weeks guaranteed. innovation and you. philips sonicare save when you buy the most loved rechargeable toothbrush brand in america.
people for example in focus groups think of him, they do like that he's direct. but they hate that he's a bully. and you have to see that he's been more and more attacked. and the more attacked he gets, the more he will react. and i think that reaction will turn off a lot of the core of the 50% of gop vote who are have not yet decided how they're going to vote. >> tara, what do you think? >> well, i think this is typical trump. he's uncouth, unapologetic and obnoxious. and people like that, you know, jennice is correct in that. the people who like trump like the fact that he says the hell with political correctness i'm going to say what i want. unfortunately that's changed the bar, the level of decency it's lowered it considerably. because i think, you know, him going on and continuing these antics and making fun of people's looks, handicaps, their weight, their face. i mean, this is a comedy routine. and not very presidential. but at some point i think it will reach a point where people are going to have to decide when
to ignore that. >> so real quick, tara, which is it? and might he in a general if he gets that far be accused of flip-flopping? >> just really quick. i found it interesting that jennice said people who are supportive of trump are ze zenophobes yet ted cruz is pretty tough on illegal immigration as well. people are tired of illegal immigration being shoved down their throats. it's about we want to follow law, want to secure the southern border, don't want a massive flow of illegal immigrants taking jobs from americans, bidding down wages and the host of other things that go along with -- it's about sovereignty and rule of law. that's an interesting perspective. and about marco rubio -- >> really quick, tara, i have minus 15 seconds here. >> this is an issue marco rubio has to have some clarity on. you have to consider the audience on this. he has said that he feels as though he is -- that the ruling in june was -- we're in a
and i think i couldn't agree more with the rnc chair who basically has said that you're shrinking the voters of the republican bales are shrinking. if you do not reach out to more diverse and win the next election. >> i don't know it is the next election that has to be won. big train coming and once it hits we will see. last word? >> the democratic party is more diverse than the republican party. republicans who are christian put religion at the top. hispanics, women, blacks do not that is why they self-identify with the progressives. progressives put government before god and more secular and put free goodies, the facts back me up, jennice big time. >> that may or may not be true. >> becoming more multicultural and diverse as a country. >> let me finish jennice. >> we are running out of the time here. you know what computer is it zas
and liberals don't. i'm just kidding. we are losing our religion. we are becoming a more secular nation. and people who identify as more religious are republican. >> yeah, identification for democrats, jennice has fallen about 20%. in just a few years so the democrats are becoming more secularized and what does that mean? does that mean anything? >> it means we are going to win the next election. i'm kidding. what it means i still want to point out that although the numbers are down, they are there are more christians in the united states than anywhere else in the world. >> about 80% are self-identified. >> yes. but there are numbers that are troubling. like a lot of people are choosing none over like 2007. >> why is that? are they all watching bill maher? why are people throwing religion out the window? is it the internet or what is it?
really effective. >> it's also expensive, jennice, it's also very expensive when there is two or three or 400,000 people coming across the border illegally and then we have to pick up the healthcare for them and we have to pick up food stamps for them. go ahead, mercedes. >> well, and they are also aware that if they come to this country and this is primarily for central america, which has a different policy than the mexicans coming in is the fact that they do have a legal right to deportation hearings. guess what, there are these backlogs, right in the mere fact that they know they can stay here and wait and don't have to go through the legal process and the fact that our government and this administration is sending them mixed messages which even the central american presidents who come out and have said you know what, president obama, your policy is ambiguous. >> stay with me for one second. think about this. in order for the republicans to win the presidency, you have to nail down somewhere between 35 and 40% of the hispanic vote. >> absolutely. >> so is it -- >> -- even higher than that. >> so let's say 40%. how is a republican ever going to win if you have
>> it's also expensive, jennice, it's also very expensive when there is two or three or 400,000 people coming across the border illegally and then we have to pick up the healthcare for them and we have to pick up food stamps for them. go ahead, mercedes. >> well, and they are also aware that if they come to this country and this is primarily for central america, which has a different policy than the mexicans coming in is the fact that they do have a legal right to deportation hearings. guess what, there are these backlogs, right in the mere fact that they know they can stay here and wait and don't have to go through the legal process and the fact that our government and this administration is sending them mixed messages which even the central american presidents who come out and have said you know what, president obama, your policy is ambiguous. >> stay with me for one second. think about this. in order for the republicans to win the presidency, you have to nail down somewhere between 35 and 40% of the hispanic vote. >> absolutely. >> so is it -- >> -- even higher than that. >> so let's say 40%. how is a republican ever going to win if you have hillary clinton demonizing
really effective. >> it's also expensive, jennice, it's also very expensive when there is two or three or 400,000 people coming across the border illegally and then we have to pick up the healthcare for them and we have to pick up food stamps for them. go ahead, mercedes. >> well, and they are also aware that if they come to this country and this is primarily for central america, which has a different policy than the mexicans coming in is the fact that they do have a legal right to deportation hearings. guess what, there are these backlogs, right in the mere fact that they know they can stay here and wait and don't have to go through the legal process and the fact that our government and this administration is sending them mixed messages which even the central american presidents who come out and have said you know what, president obama, your policy is ambiguous. >> stay with me for one second. think about this. in order for the republicans to win the presidency, you have to nail down somewhere between 35 and 40% of the hispanic vote. >> absolutely. >> so is it -- >> -- even higher than that. >> so let's say 40%. how is a republican ever going to win if you have
have. and she is as highly public a figure and a spokesperson or symbol for this type of change and for people widening their horizons. laverne cox, who is an actress on "orange is the new black" is another person who has been out there for the last couple of years really being a tremendous role model. my kids love her, not because of the show but they see her as being a new type of hero talking about defining your own identity which is an important issue for young he people these days as well. so seeing caitlyn jenner out there, laverne cox, it's really quite, i think, inspiring to see their courage. >> first they ignore you. then they laugh at you. and then they attack you. and then you win. it's so true of life. thank you, david corn. we're going to learn. learning is the best part of life. >> she looks beautiful, doesn't she? >> jennice, thank you. i may not go that far but i do