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Transcripts For FOXNEWSW Tucker Carlson Tonight 20180728 04:00:00


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be intimidated into accepting your fraudulent promise. it w often works and that s exactly why they do it but it only works when the rest of us play alongng with it so let s sp playing along with it. so, can you explain to me why if it s wrong to meet with russians in the hope of getting dirt on your political opponent, it s okay to pay for a national toor get dirt from russians about your political opponents which the dnc in the hillary campaign both did? it s very different for a campaign to spend money to do opposition research in a foreign country then for a foreign government like the russians to actually invest in disarming our election security to benefit one candidate, that s the big difference here. there s nothing wrong in paying
if there is perjury, convicted for perjury and see if you can convict but let s stop pretending that meeting with a foreigner is a crime. tell me if this is a crime. here s a photograph, this is chuck schumer he s meeting with vladimir putin. i can t see it. tucker: it s your former boss. it s 2002. tucker: it was cool for him to meet. so there doing secret energy deals together. i m not saying that chuck schumer should be in prison for treason. i m raising the question. you re smart enough to know what that is. tucker: the rhetoric is so crazy it s hurting the country. what happens here is congress
needs to have an investigation. if you want to have a hearing about what chuck was talking about, go right ahead and do that. we need to have a hearing right now about what happened in 2016 and what s happening right now. tucker: since we know for a fact the hillary clinton campaign paid a foreign national to get dirt from the russians, should we have a hearing on that? or is that outside of the scope because it wouldn t help your party? they ve already had numerous hearings aboutut the steele dossier butte they haven t had y hearings about what don jr. saih to his data. we both know he told his dad about his meeting. tucker: how do you know that? have you talked to them today?
how often do you assert things as fact that you don t know is fact? you say we know something, is that a tactic that youow use? it is my strong opinion. the guy whose name is don jr. whose whole life is owed it to don sr. would tell don sr. don jr. thought he could do something for don, sr., he would probably tell him. tucker: based on your intimate knowledge. i m just trying to get to the bottom of it. people should stop pretending it s real because it s fake. as you would put it we knoww th that. it s good to see you. dan bongino former secret service agent joins us now.
clintons through his lawyer, the other is connected to fusion gp fusion gps. they passed no information about actual russians or collusion. that is the crime of the century but actual russians who put together information according to their own dossier who passed it to the clinton team which wam used to spy on american citizen, nothing to see here. ignore that. but pay attention to this meeting. this is insane, i can t believe we are having this conversation. tucker: i should also note that we learned recently if you have any questions about what the government did, you are unpatriotic. why don t you take that home and meditate on it. your unpatriotic asking questions because it is wrong to question the official narrative of anything, got it? it is the very essence of the
constitutional public to question authority. this whole case is based on a dossier here s michael cohen s tweet. he called it a life filled document. their star witness called it life filled, jim comey calls it salacious and unverified, the number two in the fbi said they wouldn t have had a case without it, the head of the division investigating the case said it lacked verification in the lead investigation texted his girlfriend if there is no there there. it sound like a great case, you knocked it out of the park. tucker: i can t imagine how you wind up with michael cohen as your personal lawyer. whoever is running the hr department, you would not hire michael cohen as your lawyer. great to see you. one of the biggest tech
companies twitter was caused suppressing the accounts ofre politicians and they don t agree with. one of the lawmakers is taking action he ll explain what he s going to do until the day you leave for your trip. add-on advantage. only when you book with expedia. add-on advantage. i wok(harmonica interrupts)ld. .and told people about geico. (harmonica interrupts) how they could save 15% or more by. (harmonica interrupts) .by just calling or going online to geico.com. (harmonica interrupts) (sighs and chuckles)
sorry, are you gonna. (harmonica interrupts) everytime. geico. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more on car insurance. to me, he s, phil micwell, dad.o golfer. so when his joint pain from psoriatic arthritis got really bad, it scared me. and what could that pain mean? joint pain could mean joint damage. enbrel helps relieve joint pain, helps stop irreversible joint damage, and helps skin get clearer. enbrel may lower your ability to fight infections. serious, sometimes fatal events including infections, tuberculosis, lymphoma, other cancers, nervous system and blood disorders, and allergic reactions have occurred. tell your doctor if you ve been someplace where fungal infections are common, or if you re prone to infections, have cuts or sores, have had hepatitis b, have been treated for heart failure, or if you have persistent fever, bruising, bleeding, or paleness. don t start enbrel if you have an infection like the flu. since enbrel, dad s back to being dad.
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intentional. he has filed a complaint against thee federal election commissio, he joins us now. thank you for coming on. it s a factual question, you re certain this happen to you and it was intentional. i m certain there were only four members of congress who had their voices suppressed on twitter. that would be one hell of a coincidence. if people were sending conservative message they got caught in twitter s trap. it givesau advantages to our political opponents and gives access to the platform we don t have. if it were a billboard company and they gave democrats access to their billboards and not republicans, that would be an illegal corporate donation to the campaigns of democrats. instead of billboards it s the auto fill and function as part
of the search feature that wasn t available to me, devin nunes, mark meadows, and jim jordan and it s available to democrats. tucker: you believe the fac can remedy this? they can institute finds just like they can institute finds an punishment against any company that illegally makes a corporate donation to a political campaig campaign. here the corporate donation is allowing democrats and people running against me to have access to elements of the search feature that i didn t have access to. why? twitter has said it s my behavior that resulted in this, i don t know what behavior that is. are we going to trust tech companies to be able to adjust to decide with no transparency what behavior limits someone s ability to amplify their message? that sounds like the tear in a series you did a couple months ago is coming to life before our very eyes. tucker: twitter is a fairly small player in this world as a failing company, google dominates all of tech and it s
the portal through which all of human information flows. if google were to hold things back or put her thumb on the scale in any way they would have a huge effect in our society. congress exists to make sure the public interest is represented but i ve never heard of a member of congress say were going to get to the bonhomme best, will break up google, fulfill our oversight rule here, why not? w too many members of congres don t understand the gravity of the issue. were the ones who have the targets drawn on our foreheads. you will see more engagement coming forward. aon reasonable libertarian might ask why shouldn t i just leave twitter? it s important to recognize twitter and other social media companies use the federal government to get rid of lawsuits that they don t want to have to defend against and they requiresvision that them to hold themselves out as a neutral public forum. twitter and facebook can t say on one hand we are neutral and we shouldn t have to respond to lawsuits and on the other hand n tell me and other outspoken
conservatives that our behavior results in suppression on their platform, they can t have it both ways. tucker: google has a monopoly as does youtube. they routinely suppress political views they don t agree with and congress does nothing about it. congressman, thank you it s great to seeno you. up next, the southern poverty law center is a sham group dedicated to shaming enemies of the left. the fbi is collaborating with them. a story we have broken, we will tell you what we found next. 150 when you purchase select in stock gear. plus free seminars and giveaways. bass pro shops and cabela s- your adventure starts here.
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better things than rheumatoid arthritis. before you and your rheumatologist move to another treatment, ask if xeljanz xr is right for you. xeljanz xr is a once-daily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra for whom methotrexate did not work well enough it can reduce pain, swelling and further joint damage, even without methotrexate. xeljanz xr can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections, lymphoma and other cancers have happened. don t start xeljanz xr if you have an infection. tears in the stomach or intestines, low blood cell counts, and higher liver tests and cholesterol levels have happened. your doctor should perform blood tests before you start and while taking xeljanz xr, and monitor certain liver tests. tell your doctor if you were in a region where fungal infections are common and if you have had tb, hepatitis b or c, or are prone to infections.
don t let another morning go by without talking to your rheumatologist about xeljanz xr. tucker: you know if tucker: as you already know, the southern poverty law center is an entirely large lint enterprise, the organization has nothing to do with south or with poverty, it s a left-wing political group that uses hate crime designations to target ideological enemies and crush people. in 2012, it inspired a shooting attack on the family research council by labeling the christian organization a hate group. just last month, they paid $3.3 million for falsely calling the quillian foundation anti-muslim extremists. theyon are utterly reckless and totally dishonest. with that in mind it was shocking to discover that the fbi has a long history of
collaborating with the southern poverty law center. in 2009, they called the splc a well-known established and credible organization that monitors domestic terrorism in the u.s. the splc repeatedly has been allowed to brief fbi personnel on terror threats to this country. disturbingly, this relationship is ongoing despite multiple requests from this program, the fbi has refused to describe the extent of its collaboration, we ve asked repeatedly or to explain why it continues to work with a group like that. instead we ve received mindless boilerplate statements likeik ts one. the fbi has engaged with various organizations, such outreach is a critical component of the fbi information, and we welcome we evaluate our relationships to ensure
appropriateness of any interaction. we can report tonight that congressman matt gates of florida has sent a letter asking them to explain their relationship which is obviously very troubling to put it mildly. tonight the doj give us another statement. the attorney general has directed the fbi to reevaluate their relationships with groups like this to ensure the fbi doesn t partner with any group that discriminates. as the splc certainly does. the founder of quillian just received the settlement after they labeled him as an extremist, he is the author of a tremendous book called radical. he joins us tonight. thanks for cominghe on. it was partly from watching what they did to you that had us asking the question to what extent are they involved with
the federal government? we discovered this. tell our viewers your experience with the splc. it s curious and fascinating at the same time because i have been born and raised a muslim, i spent my teenage years with an islamist organization seeking to enforce sharia law in muslim majority society, i got radicalized. i ended up as a political prisoner. it was in jail that i reformed my views and came out bowing to challenge islamist extremists and founded coolio quillian in. the splc deemed it anti-muslim extremists and the sheer oddity of placing a muslim on a list of anti-muslim extremists is what led me to say i need justice in this case, my entire life has
been defined by my struggle and i got it wrong initially i ve been open about that in my book, my struggle s to find a place fr muslims in the west that is at home with the west. to undermine my entire life s work by placing me on the list of anti-muslim extremists i found a step too far. that s why i went to lawyers and got advice and that s why we took the action we did. tucker: as someone who has interviewed scores of people like you, i think you are one of the most restrained and thoughtful and reasonable, it s very odd and dishonest. what effect does it have on you? it s got to hurt your foundatio foundation. head places targets on the head. it s already hard enough for most of reformers to speak out against our communities, people who do are targeted and killed.
many of them were knocked off and fascinated by jihadists because they were deemed to be blasphemous and heretical. her close c friend a film direcr was murdered on the streets of amsterdam and a list was stabbed into his body ended named her as being next, that s what were up against here. the first thing it did is it placed me in grave danger, it laced her in grave danger because she was also named on this list. it also have material consequences. the reason they produce these lists is to convince media and philanthropists and foundations not to give grants to these sorts of people in these organizations and it did have those kinds of material. consequences. that s why we couldn t just lie back and take this at face value as it was, we had to take actio action. tucker: the fact that our fbi is collaborating with this
discredited and reckless is really scary, thank you for your account. there was a solid economic news today as the commerce department estimated a robust 4.1 gdp annual growth rate in the second quarter of the year, that s the biggest single quarter again in four years. america needs good economic growth to help solve the plight of young people who are suffering under much greater debt burdens than their parents were at their age. one of the reasons so many of them call themselves shoulder domestic socialists. what are they get in exchange? not much. heather hawkins is chief macro strategist, we talked to her about the growing debt crisis, here s the conversation. what are the effects of this on the country? one of the things it s doing, and the housing market it s delaying the purchase of the
first home an average of seven years. that affects not just the person buying the home but it affects all of the economy because that person isn t getting those additional seven years of wealth accumulation, as their house appreciates in value. it affects the people selling their homes because you re removing a group of buyers from the equation because they have so much death, they can t afford to be buying a home. tucker: $1.5 trillion is almost too big a number to put into any kind of context. there are very few countries in the world with a gdp bigger than that. what would happen if borrowers started to default on those loans? we take it in context, it s a truly astounding number. the economy per year generates about 18 trillion, now 1.5 trillion is bigger than everything we owe on cars, all of the car loans are about 1.1 trillion,ar credit card debt
is less than 1 trillion. these guys start to default, who was going to be left holding the bag?g? one of the big challenges is you can t actually get through bankruptcy, you can t remove this debt so what are you going to do? you re not going to pay your credit card bill, you re not going to pay your mortgage are not going to payrd your home lon because you don t have a choice even when you go to bankruptcy to not pay your student debt. tucker: i don t understand how that works. i m not advocating people going bankrupt but i do wonder why student loan debt is exempted from normal bankruptcy protections, how didy that happ happen? you could extinguish it up until 1995 when congress tightened it up making it all but impossible. they did exclude their own offspring. if you are the child of a member of congress you can t extinguish your student loan by going to bankruptcy court.
tucker: for real? that s unbelievable. was this a lobbying operation were student loan lenders decided why would we want to face the risk of not getting our money back? about who the student loan lender is it s the federal government, it s all but run most other lending out of the market, you can t compete with the federal government. you see what the result of that is. it s like what we saw with subprime housing. with subprime housing, what you saw the government deciding that more and more people ought to own homes so they made it easier and easier to borrow money, what did that do? it made the housing market shoot for the moon because more people could buy homes. they ve done the same thing here with education, more and more people to get education which is ultimately good but they way they went about doing that is to
make loans more accessible just like l we did with homes. we are making loans more accessible and what happened? you are saying the price of that education has skyrocketed. for i example, if you look from 1985 to today, the cost of education has gone up four times that inflation in general. it s not like wages have been keeping up with that. in 1971, the cost of a one year of education cost a little less than half of what the average guy can make in a year. today it s shy of two years worth. tucker: meanwhile the quality of college education has plummeted, the meaning of a degree has evaporated. this is a scam and i appreciate you calling attention to our viewers. one university is cracking down
on the phrase as you know. it is indeed offensive to students, you may be confused but liberals understand why that s exactly a good idea, will tell you why next. when does it end?! with the capital one quicksilver® card, you earn unlimited 1.5% cash back on every purchase, everywhere. it s like a cash back oasis. what s in your wallet?
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terrain of modern progressive thought. thanks a lot for coming on. i m often confused by these segments but this one may be more than most because. i thougt prefacing a sentence would be a self-esteem booster, you re suggesting to the person you already know this. you re telling me it s bad for self-esteem? your causing self-doubt because i don t know, i may not know. therefore i have self-doubt and would not do as well as other students who may know. i would. feel another student know something i don t know and the diversity department has found that students that do not know find this phrase to be offensive and a professor talking down to a student and they don t do as well in their classes.
it s a phrase that specifically causes self-doubt. tucker: as you know, the research has shown there is a direct connection between low self-esteem, people feel inadequate, work harder to impress, we should inculcate self-doubt and students. as an also a reflection of reality? if you already knew, what are you doing inn college? students are ignorant, that s why they are in school to become learned. you re using unnecessary words. it may be why style manuals would say you shouldn t use unnecessary words are unnecessary phrases to make your point. using as you know is unnecessary. you re not communicating properly with your audience.er it s not needed and they are urging the professors to t use this this phrase, it s not necessary. tucker: are not urging it because i have a commitment to clear language, people who run
humanities departments, can barely speak english. this is a diversity department that surging the spirit of tucker: than everything i said times five it s even more true. don t you want to patronize her students? don t you want to make them feel they know nothing? you want to highlight their ignorance because it will inculcate in them a thirst for hunger and knowledge. it s doing the opposite, the diversity department students are saying it s causing self-doubt. we re not supposed to patronize the students, were supposed to fill them with confidence and they will be wonderful leaders in the future and we want a world like that. tucker: we have a lot of confidence students i interviewed them allhe the tim. we have too many confident students.
if you know nothing and most students know nothing, you should be deeply insecure and a silent as you learn. if a student iss so undone by having a professor use the phrase as you know, isn t that students are not really for college? shown to be selling aluminum siding or doing something useful? you re not really ready for college ifkn it undoes you. isn t it wonderful that the student is speaking up and sank to the professor you re using terms that are really not making sense.en if they are speaking down to us and as the audience, this communicator is not making sens sense. they don t feel confident and they are speaking up and telling this university, we feel more confident if this phrase would be eliminated. they are urging thel professors to get with the program, get with this new era that we are living in, that the students are diverse. tucker: join the revolution eaten.
very quickly, do you personally really want to a live in a world where college students are empowered to talk a lot? honestly. to talk a lot? to speak up? yeah. tucker: to speak up, be heard, whatever the, description of it, do you want to live in that world? i want to live in a better world, i like the world that changes with the times. tucker: i know you do, that s why we love you. that s why we are having you back on monday for a segment that s even more confusing than this one and i can t wait for that. thanks very much. the i fbi isn t supposed to be protecting americans from crime, our next guest says they may be a threat to you and me, and joined us after the break my father passed this truck down to me,
taken with methotrexate or similar medicines, it can reduce joint pain, swelling, and significantly improve physical function. xeljanz xr can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections, lymphoma, and other cancers have happened. don t start xeljanz xr if you have an infection. tears in the stomach or intestines, low blood cell counts, and higher liver tests and cholesterol levels have happened. your doctor should perform blood tests before you start and while taking xeljanz xr, and monitor certain liver tests. tell your doctor if you were in a region where fungal infections are common, and if you have had tb, hepatitis b or c, or are prone to infections. xeljanz xr can reduce the symptoms of psoriatic arthritis. don t let another morning go by without talking to your rheumatologist about xeljanz xr.
tucker: we have a public servicece announcement for you e didn t expect to be bringing you this but our control room team minutes ago spotted the creepy porn lawyer in his natural habitat on cnn. they couldn t hear what he was saying but it hurt our feelings a little bit. this is the fifth or sixth other tv network he has done in recent days we ve invited him repeatedly onto this show and he has repeatedly turned us down. were going to ask him one more time and we know that he is watching. you always have a home on this 8:00 p.m. program, any time we will clear the decks for you, hope to see you soon. the fbi has been entrusted with enormous power, he can break down your front door and put you in jail. they are supposed to use these powers to protect americans and they do to some extent. increasingly we ve seen
instances of the fbi abusing its power and depriving citizens of their civil liberties. we have an obligation to speak out against that. the most recent case is that of carter page who was labeled a foreign agent and despite on for more than a year by the obama administration based on the assertions in the steele dossier. assertions which the fbi never bothered to verify. what truly make up this? mark penn was an advisor to bill clinton he joins us tonight, thank you for coming o on. i ve been struck not by the fact that this happened but the reaction to it. you have a guy who was a naval officer, an annapolis graduate he s never been charged with anything and he was spied on for a year. the normal course of civil libertarians have been silent. people just use talking points that they had before you could actually read the warrant. any fair-minded person comes
away with the conclusion that there was no probable cause. they scared a bunch of judges with tense stories about potential russia collusion, the steeleot dossier, the yahoo stoy that was from it and even when he was fired and he was compensated he was on the payroll of the fbi, the dnc, and the hillary clinton campaign at thenc same time even when tht was discovered they continued to use this information indicating they had nothing t else. the idea that the government can spy on political campaigns with no evidence is frightening and needs to be corrected with legislation immediately. tucker:, the precedent this sets, we are all living in this moment and it s hard for us to see a week ahead. you ve been in the white house and political campaigns. there will be another administration and one after that. what does this mean for them? will any president ever be able
to trust theim fbi isn t spyingn him or his campaign? i saw in 1998 working with president clinton, the stress and strain on the president, the white house, the decisions that incur with these investigations. you can see the kind of stress and strain everyone who participated in the campaign, or an associate of donald trump is being shaken down, investigated, this kind of thing is not compatible with an open democracy where we decide things by elections. we ve got to make changes because you re going to be afraid about the fbi, the cia all of the intelligence agencies. what they can be doing and not only when you re the president but when you re running a campaign against the president. what sets this country apart its peaceful transition of government. tucker: we are playing with heavy-duty things. do you think in the next year or two there is a legislative
answer that can restore confidence in these agencies? an ombudsman has to be appointed, i think for any warrants that involve americans and particularly americans in political campaigns, special judges and procedure so that the highest the bar is established and it s unbelievable we haven t already moved to do that. tucker: thank you very much much. maxine waters back in the news, especially amazing this time. don t go away.
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right. how does she know that? because god told her so. . [ inaudible ] [ inaudible ] tucker: there you have it. maxine waters isn t really a political figure anymore. she is a theologian and that s why she fits in with the modern left which is a religious sect. the point is not to convince voters. it s to convert heretics and burn witches. progressives know before you utter a single word they are virtuous and you are sinful. in some ways it s the story of

Tucker-carlson , Something , President , Offense , Colluded , Liability , Horizo-horizon , It , Deal , Perjury , Crime , Information

Transcripts For CNNW Cuomo Primetime 20180801 01:00:00


other from controversial issues, from immigration issues, and they re doing it again. that s why we have to pass this bill so that you have clear information about who s paying for these ads and what they are. it s called the honest ads act, and it s a bill i m leading with senator mccain and senator warner. senator, appreciate your time. thank you very much. the news continues. i want to hand it over to chris. cuomo prime time starts now. thank you, anderson. i am chris cuomo. welcome to prime time. collusion is not a crime except when it is. and remember this isn t about words. it s about behavior. we have a lawmaker who is going to tell you the facts of what could be headed for anyone who did collude. he was also in that hearing today, and you will not believe what the government admitted about its plan to force families apart. there s senator coons. we ll be with him in a second. the mueller probe faces its first courtroom test today with
trump s former campaign chair on trial. we re going to give you the truth about what manafort might mean to the wider russia investigation. and with just hours to go, a judge blocked those blueprints for homemade, untraceable 3-d guns before they were published. but guess what? they re already out there, and the ruling is only temporary. so we have the man who wants all of you to be able to make your own gun. he s going to argue his case, and i am here to test it. i missed you, my friends. what do you say? let s get after it. so today the president tweeted, collusion is not a crime. but that doesn t matter because there was no collusion except by crooked hillary and the democrats. now, of course, the president has repeated his no collusion mantra many times. what matters in all this? let s bring in democratic senator and member of the judiciary committee, senator chris coons. good to see you, sir. great to be with you again, chris. what do you make of the
confusion over collusion? well, i think it s perfectly clear in federal law, and in fact i ve got the statute with me. it s title 52, section 30121, that says it is a crime to solicit or accept anything of value from a foreign national in order to influence the outcome of a federal election. it s a longer section. i m taking a sentence here and there, but that s the outcome. that s what it means. you can t accept or solicit a cash contribution or a thing of value from a foreign national in any way related to a federal, state, or local election. that s clearly a crime. and elsewhere in the criminal code, conspiring in order to commit a crime like that is also, itself, the crime of conspiracy. so while i m not using the specific word collusion, i ll remind you what the whole mueller investigation is about is whether or not the trump campaign worked with russian intelligence officers to solicit or accept a thing of significant
value. thousands of hacked e-mails that might have been used in order to determine the outcome or influence the outcome of the federal presidential election. now, while you started off there being a little narrow, right? you were being a little generous in terms of what collusion can yield as a crime. it actually starts to get very broad depending on your facts. look at paul manafort. you got 30-plus charges there. it can go lots of different directions depending on money, activity, and intent. so then you get to, what s your bar for mueller? i would argue that the mueller probe is supposed to be about what happened with russian interference, who helped, and what crimes arise in the pursuit thereof, right? that s his mandate. if the bar is whether or not the president or any of his people were involved in those russian efforts, don t you think whoever wants that to be the bar is going to be disappointed based on what we know so far? well, we don t know what the mueller investigation is ultimately going to produce in terms of clear, dispositive,
public proof. but it has certainly gotten closer and closer in recent months as the mueller investigation has produced indictments both of russian nationals, of specific gru military intelligence officers, and he has called out in great detail how they conspired, how they worked in order to undermine our election in 2016, and the manafort trial has already begun. there s been a series of indictments for other related actions by senior members of the trump administration or the trump campaign team. do you think manafort means anything to the wider russia probe? he may very well. manafort, as you know, is in part being accused of failing to report and laundering millions of dollars from a kremlin-supported ukrainian president, a strong man, leader of ukraine who was closely allied with the kremlin. there may be ways in which that relationship and the ongoing payments that he received from
ukraine is connected. it might end up being independent. that s really the challenge in front of special counsel mueller is to connect all the dots. then you have this broader array of influence that we see in facebook today, them shutting down accounts that they are now identifying, which you could argue they could have been doing all along. the idea that they don t know who s doing what on their platform is denied by the reality that if you and i were on facebook right now talking about what type of bass rigs we re using, all of a sudden i would get an ad for them popping up on my screen. that s right. so they can know, yet you have the vice president saying we know the russian interference didn t alter a single vote. no. we know there is no proof that any of the tabulation machines and the voting machines were affected by the hacking. but we don t know the impact of the propaganda. it s impossible to know. are you concerned about where we are in the next election and what might happen from the same people? i m very concerned, chris. i worked hard in a bipartisan way to get $380 million in
Chris Cuomo asks the tough questions to newsmakers in Washington and around the world.
tricky when something can be true and untrue at the same time, and yet both aspects of it matter, right? we re going to explain right now. here s your premise. collusion does not equal a crime. here s what rudy giuliani, lawyer to president trump, said to cnn. which i don t even know if that s a crime, colluding about russians. you start analyzing the crime. the hacking is the crime. the hacking is the crime. that certainly is the original crime. the president didn t hack. of course not. he didn t pay them for hacking. collusion is not a crime. rudy s right. collusion is not a statutory crime under the federal code in this context. there will likely be no charge of simply collusion. now, one fine point for you legal eagles out there. yes, collusion is a crime for the sec and the ftc, proscribing certain antitrust behavior. but like i said, that s out of context, okay? what we re dealing with here is a distinction, okay, without a
extension of acts of collusion. aiding and abetting, okay? now, aiding and abetting has its own section under the criminal code, okay? why? because it goes to all types of being too helpful to the wrong people in the wrong types of situations. all of that is in the family of collusion. all right. now, what about money? money takes us into a whole other universe of when collusion becomes criminal. how was any money used in an exchange? how was it sent? how was it accounted for? bank fraud, wire fraud, laundering of money. many of mueller s team are experts in these areas. why did he pick them? so these laws, the statutes you saw, all stem from behavior that is collusion. so collusion is not a crime, sure, by name. but the behavior of collusion
can get you in a lot of deep water. what s the conclusion? keep your eye on the ball. collusion isn t a specific crime, per se, but it s not okay, and it leads to all of this mess and more depending on the facts and the proof. and that s where we must always stay focused. that s why i was talking to coons about what the bar for the mueller probe is. what can they show that is the only thing that we will know? that s the bar. nothing else matters. so there you have it. so what rudy said, what the government admitted about tearing families apart today, catastrophes or non troversies. it is a great debate, and it is upon us next. fruits and veggies are essential to your health,
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does your business internet provider promise a lot? let s see who delivers more. comcast business gives you gig-speed in more places. the others don t. we offer up to 6 hours of 4g wireless network backup. everyone else, no way. we let calls from any of your devices come from your business number. them, not so much. we let you keep an eye on your business from anywhere. the others? nope! get internet on our gig-speed network and add voice and tv for $34.90 more per month. call or go online today. today was jam-packed with news, but what does any of it mean? the president tweeted that collusion is not a crime for the first time, and a health and human services official testified that he warned the trump administration that family separation at the border would happen and would be dangerous. let s get to the great debate. we ve got jennifer granholm and
david urban here. dave, let s see if i can shortcut this. you saw the whiteboard. admit that i am right about all of it, that this is just wordplay, and that the behavior of collusion at the end of the day can get you in plenty of poo-poo. chris, you re right. the behavior of collusion and the right set of circumstances obviously can, right? but as you pointed out correctly, it s all about the facts. it s all about the facts, brother. brother cuomo, right? we could hypothesize about a lot of things but let s wait and see what director mueller uncovers. conspiracy is a pretty broad word, and as you point out correctly in this case that s being tried in chaalexandria against paul manafort and conspiracy there to defraud the government, there s an overt act. it s pretty easy to prove. it has nothing to do with the russians. so we ll wait and see. we ll just have to wait and see. it s all about the facts. well, we don t know that it has nothing to do with russians. it s just which group of
russians and what they were doing and whether it really has anything to do with the probe is what we don t think we ll see. no. chris, in this case we do know because on july 10th, in response to a motion filed by paul manafort right. the government here, you know, director mueller s probe, they replied in a response in their brief saying this has nothing to do with russians or collusion or russian interference. right, in the election. right. but that doesn t mean that no russians were involved with what happened with him no, no. absolutely. that s the distinction i was drawing. all right. let me get you in here, jennifer granholm. the idea of what the president is tweeting about and whether or not it matters, matters to you why? well, because we have a president who is constantly gaslighting the american public. he says that something is when it is absolutely not. i just it s so it s beyond words how horrible this
president has been to the truth. we all know that. so when he says, oh, there s no collusion, and he tries to get his followers to believe that the word collusion is not going to appear in an indictment when manafort issues one against somebody, well mueller. excuse me. when mueller. you re right. when mueller does. so maybe the word doesn t admit, but you had as professor cuomo up at the whiteboard a list of actual laws that could be broken if there s a conspiracy. right. this is just engaged in semantic play. and when the president tries to pull the wool over america s eyes in so many ways, it just proves again and again that honestly, i can hardly wait till november comes so that we can give him at least the first taste of the back of our hand. in 2020, the rest. dave urban, you see the back of the hand coming?
listen, unfortunately i do in these midterms, right? midterms aren t necessarily these are a snapshot as the governor knows and you know, chris. look, congressional districts are very small, very insular little islands of the population. so, you know, the president s going to do poorly in places like new jersey, the new york suburbs, the philly suburbs. i don t think the president s going to do poorly in kind of the, you know, down in florida, in pennsylvania, in iowa, michigan. the president s not going to do poorly there. so the midterms are going to have an effect i don t know. well, that s your. we ll see. look, all of this is speculative. it s all about turnout. that s what s going to determine the midterms. it always does. well, but it s manifest intention of the reaction formation. i know those are all big words, but what we saw in 94 and 2010 is i know you re upset about what s in there right now. here s what i want to offer you that s better. now get out there and vote for me. that s the equation, and we won t know until the polls open
and close wait, chris. it s very true. but let s be clear that when you see russian interference like we saw today through facebook, russian interference against claire mccaskill and russian interference writ large in 2016, getting out the vote is going to be super important, yes. but there was a poll out today that showed that there are some republicans who think that interference by the russians to help the republicans is not such a bad thing. oh, come on, governor. come on. come on, governor. if you re going to blame the democrats for poor performance. you can t blame you have to accept some responsibility for not having a coherent message across your party. there s a whole array of things. we don t have to relitigate this. you can t blame the russians for the democrats failing. yes, i can blame the russians for interfering in this election. you can blame them for trying to interfere. they did interfere, and they
sent thousands and thousands of ads to social media in places like detroit, where they held up pictures of aziz ansari with a text saying, hey, avoid the lines. text your support here. if that s not a voter suppression ad, i don t know what is. oprah winfrey, photoshopped, holds up a sign let me just finish. when oprah winfrey holds up a sign that says, first-time voter, you vote on wednesday. those are voter suppression ads. those were issued hugely in 2016 in michigan. hillary clinton lost by 11,000 votes. the purpose of the russian intervention is to cause people to be not just divided but to cause them to stay home. right. and you know what? that s what happened. in the obama administration, the democratic barack obama administration should have shut those down. it would have been easier if mcconnell would have worked with them. so should the trump
administration. [ overlapping voices ] obama should have done more, but mcconnell shouldn t have blocked his efforts. and now trump, it s on him now to see what he does. he s the president. you re right. and today secretary of dhs, kirst kirstjen nielsen said we need to prepare for a category 5 event. what is he doing? so, governor he s been saying he doesn t believe there was a storm coming. he s been doing that for a long time, dave, and now they re starting to change their tune in the administration. we ll see what they do. can i just say i got to go. this is another case of classic incompetence. he had incompetence in puerto rico. he has incompetence incompetence in the obama administration and you re going to see another i hear you. dave has a point to. governor, incompetence of the obama administration? dave has a point. my head explodes when i see james clapper and all these former intelligence officials on this network complaining about russian interference when they were at the wheel when it all
happened. we re talking about 2018, dave. you cannot continue to look in the rearview mirror. if you re talking about the past election here s the thing. we got to end it here. but, chris, you can say dave urban has a point. i just did. i said it two points. you don t hear me because you re yapping. what i m saying is this. it all is true. it started in 2016. the obama administration didn t do enough. why? they didn t know as much as they eventually would know. they were worried about outcomes, and mitch mcconnell was pushing back on them. they weren t going to get cooperation. it was going to be a partisan move. then the trump administration had this ball in their hands a long time. trump wanted to pretend it doesn t exist because he thinks it s bad for him. and now the election is upon us, and we ll see how safe they can make us. we need to protect americans democracy. we ll see. they got to do a lot more than they ve done. we can agree on that. let s end on that. thank you very much. thanks, chris. last minute, federal judge puts a block on print al
blueprints to make untraceable 3-d firearms. the founder of the group that wants you to be able to make your own weapons with a click of the mouse wants you to hear his case. we re going to test it next. they work togetherf doing important stuff. the hitch? like you, your cells get hungry. feed them. with centrum micronutrients. restoring your awesome, daily. centrum. feed your cells. new laptop with 24/7 tech support. yep, thanks guys. i think he might need some support. yes start them off right. with the school supplies they need at low prices all summer long. save $200 on this dell laptop at office depot officemax.
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poo poo the 3-d gun dispute. here s what happened today. a federal judge stepped in with a temporary injunction, okay? that s what it sounds like. this is not over. but for now, there will be no more blueprints to make 3-d printable weapons online but only for now. now, what s the white house position on this? they say the guns are already illegal, which is true. however, it is also true that the federal government settled a lawsuit that allowed these instructions to be posted online. alan gottlieb s second amendment foundation was part of that lawsuit. he joins us now. alan, welcome to prime time, and thank you. the government role in this is very confusing. i say we focus on what is more simple for people to absorb. you tell me why is it good for
people to be able to download blueprints to make 3-d printable weapons? why is this a good thing? well, first of all, chris, this is a first amendment issue that just happens to deal with firearms that are protected by the second amendment. putting computer code on the internet is a language. a language is speech, and speech is protected by the first amendment. you know, the reason why we re so concerned about being able to do it we ve got places like san francisco now where there are no gun stores now for people to be able to buy a gun or places like alameda county in california where zoning ordinances put gun stores out of the county, or places like seattle that put taxes on guns and ammunition. what this does for the future is allow people to ensure a way to be able to have a firearm. you know, if you re allowed to own a firearm in your own home, you should be able to make the firearm in your own home if you can t buy one locally because of crazy restrictions. okay. so two arguments.
one is if anybody right now and they should not while we re speaking of course but in the commercial, google availability of firearms in california, they will find nothing that is speaking to a shortage of weapons in california, okay? plenty of guns. plenty of guns per capita. plenty of gun crime in that state as a result. and you re leaving something out in your first amendment analysis, which is the right to have what you re dismissing as speech. not everybody has a right to a gun, right? certain people fall into categories where they can t get them. certainly people fall into categories where they should not get them. and what you re trying to do apparently is give everybody a chance, even if they re in those categories. is that good? no, chris, that s not what we re trying to do. in fact, all the laws that prohibit that stay on the books. we re not removing any of those whatsoever. you re not removing the law hold on. you re removing the mechanism for enforcement because you re
giving people an ability to cut out all the necessary middlemen so they can t be vetted. they just have to take the blueprints. they make their own weapon. that s the point. chris, a criminal who is going to break a law or commit mayhem is going to get a gun now anyway like they always do or there would be no gun crime right now. but they re probably not going to make a very expensive 3-d printable gun. they ll just get one off the street. a few years ago when cody wilson put these plans on the internet, there were 100,000 to 200,000 downloads of the plans to do it. lots of people have already made these guns. not one has been used in a crime. not one. so a lot of this is hysteria out there do we know that or we don t know that any have been caught committing a crime with a gun? well, we know it because they d have the gun and be able to show it, and here s a 3-d printed gun. that s if they were caught. there s no crime report anywhere in the united states where anybody has misused one of these guns to begin with. but how would you know unless somebody were apprehended and
was proven to have used one of th them, right? well, you would know it by the ballistics or the bullet and everything else. it tells if it s a ghost gun? you mentioned, chris, in california, there are guns all over right now and this gun crime. there s also a lot of self-defense with firearms in california as well, which you don t want to talk about. but the truth of the matter is we both know in california every year the restrictions get tighter and tighter and tighter. there s less places to buy guns and less guns for availabilitity in california because gun we re looking to protect second amendment rights in the future by using first amendment rights to do so. it s a need that outweighs the national security interest, which is what we ve seen different courts say now. you have to balance it. how it will come out, wul see on the merits. i ll tell you what bothered me about this, and it wasn t you. but when one of the designers of the code, there was a restriction. why is it illegal? well, you ve got to be able to
detect these weapons when they go through a metal detector, and these have no metal. so they made a part that was metal in the weapon so it could be detected. however, that part is removable, and the weapon sometimes still functions. what the hell is that about? why would anybody want to make it so that you can remove what makes it detected and the weapon still works? why would you do that? well, first of all, if the weapon had a bullet in it, it would still be detected because the bullet would be detected. so again this is a little bit of hysteria. it s not hysteria. it s a question. what if you transport it without the bullets and you get the bullets somewhere else? well, if you re in a secure area where you re not supposed to be with a gun but why would you do that, alan? why would you stand behind somebody doing something as pernicious as that. i don t. i hear you on the first amendment. i get that. but that just seems so afoul of what we want to protect against, which is a deceptive practice. why stand behind well, this is not a deceptive
practice. if somebody breaks the law, they should be prosecuted for it. by the way you gave them the plans to do it is what i m saying. go ahead. what s your last point? the tro is not against defense distributed, cody wilson. it was against the federal government. right. actually these plans can still be put on the internet because there is no tro against us doing it. well, what the judge said was for now he wants this held in abeyance so it should stay according to the reckoning of the washington state attorney, where it was before all of this. that s what they re hoping for right now, but in any case, it s certainly temporary. the plans have already been up and downloaded several thousands of times. that is true. like 2,500 times they ve already been downloaded, and the question is how does this make us better and safer? we ll see how it plays out in the courts, and then you, sir, are welcome to come back and tell me why it s a good thing. thank you. be well. i ll do that. thank you, chris. appreciate it. all right. so what happens now to anyone who has already downloaded these plans for guns?
you get the flaw in the argument. well, we haven t seen any used in crimes. that s assumed that they were caught and apprehended as such. what are the legalities? what are the ramifications? cuomo s court in session, next. 7 tech support. yep, thanks guys. i think he might need some support. yes start them off right. with the school supplies they need at low prices all summer long. save $200 on this dell laptop at office depot officemax.
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all right. this 3-d gun thing, the fundamental merits of the case were not argued in court. so let s hash it out in cuomo s court. we have the perfect counselors. cnn legal and national security analyst asha rangappa and harvard law school professor emeritus, alan dershowitz, author of the case against impeaching trump. for the prosecution, rangappa, why is this wrong? well, this is wrong on so many levels. so first there is a law that prohibits the possession of undetectable firearms, so these plastic firearms. so as you noted, chris, in your earlier discussion, by definition, anyone who is downloading these instructions and actually makes these guns is going to be an illegal gun owner of said gun. the first amendment argument, i don t think really goes anywhere. there are public safety exceptions.
in 1997 after the timothy mcveigh bombing, senator feinstein passed an amendment making it illegal to post bomb-making instructions. so there are public safety exceptions to this. but i think really the practical effect is every day when you get on an airplane, you now have to worry about someone who may be sneaking in a plastic gun, and this is really just asking for potentially another 9/11. and i think that should be concerning to all of us. alan, the man who was just on argues, no, it s about speech. you should have the right to these ideas. these words are speech. these prints are speech. these designs are speech, and they should be protected. well, this is a terrible form of speech. these blueprints are awful, and i want to totally dissociate myself from what your previous guest earlier said about this is good speech. it s terrible speech. but the question is, is it terrible speech that s protected
by the first amendment? and the answer is clear. we don t know. we don t know. we ve never had a case like this go to the supreme court. the earlier case called the progressive case, where they wanted to print instructions for how to make a hydrogen bomb, ended up being moot, and being moot for the reason that will probably make this case moot. by the time the case came to the court, the instructions were all over the place. anybody could easily find how to make a hydrogen bomb. how about the argument that they haven t seen it used in a crime? well, you know, that s not a good enough argument. look, the answer is that the court may very well say the instructions, the blueprints, are protected by the first amendment. but you should disable any machine from making this kind of weapon, not only prohibit the weapon, which we ve already done, but also prohibit any 3-d machine from being capable of making the weapon. that would raise a second amendment question. yeah. but second amendment issues are easier than first amendment issues. so in the end, i think the
blueprints will be allowed to be shown, and that s a moot issue because they ve already been shown. and anybody who wants to have access to this is going to be able to get it one way or another. and you have all the terrorist handbook stuff that s out there that falls into the same kind of categories. they re already out there. i don t want to compromise the first amendment. chris, can i add one thing here? yeah. you know, right now federal law protects gun manufacturers from tort liability, from being sued by people who get shot by the weapons they make. that s right. terrible law. these people are putting these instructions on, there are now reasonably foreseeable consequences to what they re doing. i think if any of these guns end up being used in a crime, they can expect to have their hands sued off of them and they should. that s an actually interesting point. we got to leave it there. i was doing some research on this, and there was some
jurisprudence early on in discussion of the first amendment that the first amendment s purpose isn t just to justify the most ugly and vile things that can be said. that that s not the standard always for enforcing the first amendment. it will be interesting to see if a judge takes that on at all. i think it is. but we ll see. thank you very much. don lemon is standing by with a preview of cnn tonight just minutes away. you know, this case really does strike at what could be so frustrating about the first we often ere on the side of allowing things into the public discourse, even if we hate them and what they re about. but this is an interesting twist, because this isn t about just what you re going to say to me. it s about what you allow me to do. uh-huh, and we do that because honestly, it protects what you and i do. i m sure you ve been watching with jim acosta what he s dealing with and what we deal with all the time. this is quite different.
i don t know how to categorize this one. i m just going to sit back and watch. it s frightening. it needs to be protected. to the original first amendment about what we say and what we do, can we talk about the president a little bit and talk about lebron james? i missed you yesterday. i love what he s doing. i loved the interview. it was a great interview, and i expected well, a lot of people attacked him, but the question is why is the president attacking him? that s part of his strategy, we ve been told by the folks at the trump administration, and sources that he s going to continue to use this whole athlete s thing and kneeling as a wedge issue up until the midterms. is it freedom of expression? does it go against the athletes? i don t know. but i think lebron james is doing a great thing. he speaks his mind. he knows what the first amendment is about and what it means to him. what i loved was what a
demonstration of putting your money where your mouth is. it s a common criticism of athletes and entertainers and boy, is he showing people that i ll put my money there and it will be great to see if people follow suit. good job, don. thank you. i got to tell you quick before you go, i like that he s not concerned that he s going to tick some people off. he just feels that this is the right thing for him to say and do and that s what he s doing. i ll see you in a little bit. all right, bud. immigration officials were grilled on the hill over family separations. we learned something i knew was going to come out. it s been denied and now it s known as a fact. i m going to give it to you in the closing argument. it raises a fundamental question about who we are. fruits and veggies are essential to your health,
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save $200 on this dell laptop does your business internet provider promise a lot? let s see who delivers more. comcast business gives you gig-speed in more places. the others don t. we offer up to 6 hours of 4g wireless network backup. everyone else, no way. we let calls from any of your devices come from your business number. them, not so much. we let you keep an eye on your business from anywhere. the others? nope! get internet on our gig-speed network and add voice and tv for $34.90 more per month. call or go online today. 559. that s how many kids are waiting for their mommys and daddies. but at least it wasn t intentional.
right? wrong. today we learned the government apparently knew it was coming. knew full well it was heading down a reckless path of inhumanity. how do we know? a top hhs official. he has served three presidents. he told the senate judiciary committee about red flags raised. during the deliberative process over the previous year we raised a number of concerns in your program about any policy which would result in family separation due to concerns we had about the best interest of the child. there was plenty more he said that made it clear that they knew what would happen. he was told simply family separation wasn t an official policy. nope? true. the official policy was to deter. that s what ag sessions said as much on tv. and deter how?
fear, trauma, taking kids from parents. the message in never come back and let others know they will get the same. think about it. deported and your kids kept by the usa. we don t care if you are desperate for a better life or desperately fleeing a dangerous home or fleeing a community or government. you came illegally. that s all you are to us. that s the response from the administration. deny the act, deny the severity. the intention and the outcome. we just saw it today. from the head of enforcement and removal operations for i.c.e. listen to what they told the committee. the best way to describe them is to be more like a summer camp. these individuals have access to 24 /7 food and water. they have educational opportunities. they have recreational opportunities both structured as
well as unstructured. there s basketball courts and exercise classes and soccer fields we put in there. they got all those things in prison too, like a summer camp. giant windowless former big box store in texas. doesn t look like a summer camp i d send my kid to, and i get these are different situations. think about it, diminishing those conditions, how do you justify it? easily if you don t care about the people who are in there. the u.s. attorneys are told to use the back handed legalese slur of alien as in illegal alien. i know it s in the law but it speaks to something else. why don t they want to say undocumented? not harsh enough. that wording was important enough for the justice department to send out an agency wide e-mail. so here s our argument. if the trump administration wants to make america the home of the highly educated and the
land of the economic engines, is that the only people you re going to welcome? then just say it. now, mr. president, don t try to sell that where we both come from in queens, new york, because it s filled with the people that you don t seem to want anymore. so take down the words on lady liberty. your adviser steven miller said the poem was added on later, that it isn t a statement of policy, and you know what? miller is right. those words are more than policy. they are the core of who we are, our kwiessence. we are the unclean, the unwanted, the poorly bred, those yearning to be free, and we will do whatever the hell we can to make it if we re given a chance. it is the exception among us who doesn t have that in their blood. remember who we are because who

Crime , Collusion , Behavior , Words , Facts , Lawmaker , Hearing , Anyone , Isn-t , Government , Mueller-probe , Families

Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20180731 10:00:00


Former GOP representative Joe Scarborough and Mika Brezinski interview newsmakers, politicians and pundits about the issues of the day.
Former GOP representative Joe Scarborough and Mika Brezinski interview newsmakers, politicians and pundits about the issues of the day.
days before according to the leak, he says there was a meeting with donald junior, with jared kushner, with paul manafort, with yates and possibly two others in which they, out of the presence of the president discussed the meeting with the russians. we checked with their lawyers. the ones we could check with which was four of the six. that meeting never, ever took place. it didn t happen. there s no second meeting here? it s highly unlikely. i always have to leave the option open as a lawyer. in case they come across something that startles us or feels some of the things we feel are important. what s he saying? what s he saying? run that clip again. i actually, the words. try and listen to exactly what he is saying. and what s he saying here? we ll hear it. let s look at it again. maybe it will make sense.
there s no second meeting here? it s highly unlikely. i always have to leave the option open as a lawyer, in case they come across with something that really startles us or feels some of the things we feel are important. another round? yeah. i think willie can translate wlarch . what a journey. my drinks are free. rudy giuliani is debating himself. he is debating himself. so in the morning on cnn he raised the idea of the second meeting. that came out of the blue to a lot of people. what second meeting? he put that on the table. he says to preempt the new york times story we haven t seen yet and maggie haberman says she doesn t know what he s talking about. 12 hours later on fox news, he s shooting down the idea that he raised earlier that morning on cnn. it s a debate all in his own head. the best part, he did it to kill a story he single-handedly brought to life. right. none of us were talking about that story. he is talking about the story. again what he says, well, we
shoot it down just in case we don t know about something that they they know wevhether the did it or not, mike. like donald trump lying on air force one to cover up the real meeting of the don junior meeting which don junior said his father didn t know about. a little perjury issue if we find out that donald trump all of these no big deal, if donald trump knew about the meeting. it s a big deal for don junior because he committed perjury, if that s the case. it s just like trump lying about that meeting means that something went on in that meeting that they wanted to hide. and now you ve got rudy saying, well, but you know, we re not going to say it didn t happen, because we don t know if it did or not. yeah, they do know whether it did or not. it s incredibly taxing and tedious to have this put on us,
this early in the day? begins one segment talking about meeting that took place in the very same segment, same 30-second clip goes from there was a meeting a meeting that occurred we wanted to get out to get ahead of the news and 10 seconds later called it along alleged meeting. as if the meeting he referred to didn t take place. what time of night was he interviewed for that? that s my question. i don t know. i will say, we have there s that question. a good one. some of the worst v.o. of rudy giuliani i ve seen, i think. we need come on. look at that. get some good shots of the guy. what s he doing with that ring? world series ring? pulling it or something? heidi, do we need to play it again? do you have any idea what he was saying, and what would your follow-up have been if you were interviewing him? play even more. not only did he confirm a meeting none of us were talking about but actually flashed out some of the details in those meetings. that apparently michael cohen
may have been in donald trump s office when don junior came and said, hey, we re about to meet with the russians. so he seemed to corroborate that. that s not good. is it? he also put gates potentially in the pre-planning meeting, which would be huge, if true, since as we all know, gates, rick gates, paul manafort business partner, has been cooperating with the special counsel for several months, which means we don t have to rely just on michael cohen for this information, that rick gates may have confirmed it and mu mueller known about it a long time. bottom line, the number of conspiratorial meetings around the russians is increasing and so is the circle of trump officials, trump campaign officials, who participated in these conspiratorial meetings. at least he has paul manafort s innocence. well, there s that. the first trial in the special counsel probe kicks off today
with jury selection for paul manafort. the president s former campaign chair is accused of hiding at least $30 million that he made before his days with trump as an unregistered foreign lobbyist for ukraine, and its former pro-russian president. told the prosecution plans to call 35 witnesses including agents from the fbi, treasury department and irs to show how he stashed his wealth in overseas banks to avoid paying u.s. taxes. last week a member of robert mueller s team said he does not anticipate a government witness will utter the word russia during the trial. but if manafort is convicted, they could use it as leverage for him to talk about anything he knows pertaining to the trump campaign and russia. the trial is expected to last about three weeks. manafort face as similar trial in washington in september. richard a long haul for him.
yeah. and the question everybody has is, why has he not pled yet? absolutely no defense. have him dead to center. after he goes through this in virginia, he ll go through it in d.c. short answer, i have no idea. but there s so much apparent evidence against him that you either he s going to spend the rest of his life in prison or he s going to have to do some sort of a deal and i don t know i m not a lawyer. like you, i am not a lawyer. what the sequence has to be here. clearly they have a lot on mr. manafort. clearly they do. it s interesting. when everything seems to collide with donald trump and things start going really bad. he deflects. he decides he s going to take a meeting with a group of tirendtir tyrants. it s a playbook. it is. and at a particular time, stormy
daniels was about to hit the front pages he went there. now he s open to meetings with the iranians. after this, when he gets in trouble, he ll talk about meeting with the martians. let s take a quick look at the president of the united states doing what he likes to do most. deflect. i ll meet with anybody. i believe in meeting. i would certainly meet with iran if they re ready to meet. i don t know if they re ready yet. they re having a hard time. i ended the iran deal. it was a ridiculous deal. i do believe they will probably end up wanting to meet, and i m ready to meet anytime they want to, and i don t do that from strength or weakness. i think it s an appropriate thing to do. if we could work something out that s meaningful, not the waste of paper that the other deal was, i would certainly be willing to meet. do you have preconditions noor meeting? no preconditions. no. they want to meet, i ll meet. anytime they want. anytime they want.
good for the country. good for them. good for us, and good for the world. no preconditions. if they want to meet, i ll meet. so the reason why we needed, the world needed to have someone at the meeting with vladimir putin and donald trump is because in the past week or so, since helsinkhelsinki, donald t has, one, sent a signal he wants to lift sanctions on an oligarch who s close to vladimir putin, that we just put on a couple months ago, and, two, now he s talking again from a position of weakness. wanting to meet with iran. it s a it s a complete 180 turn. there s very little, actually, to explain that, richard, but there is a playbook for donald trump. threatened to bomb a terrorist state. say you want to meet with the terrorist state and then capitulate to the terrorist state.
are we going to see what happened in north korea happen with iran now? almost certainly not. if the administration were serious about meeting with iran, they would have done it before they unilaterally got out of the nuclear deal, that by the way iran was what if foot eputin asked hi reach out to iran? another reason the iranians want no part of it. the secretary gave a big speech calling for regime change. the administration is ratcheting up sanctions. got out of the nuclear deal after the president said he s meet without preconditions. the secretary of state started listening to preconditions on nuclear issues, iran regional behavior, how they re treating their own people. look what we ve been saying about north korea all along and you have donald trump declaring victory in north korea, when the north koreans now, we keep finding out, in more ways, that they re cheating and, in fact, their nuclear program is more dangerous today, u.s.
intelligence officials tell us, than it was when donald trump first started negotiating with the north koreans. a front page story in the washington post today, after last week s story about their nuclear program, we learn now their missile program, intercontinental ballistic missile program is continuing. the only word i take exception with cheating. we don t know if north korea is cheating because we don t know what north korea and the u.s. agreed top it s like a piece of swiss cheese. the holes were bigger than the cheese. we know this. donald trump said americans can sleep at night. that nuclear weapons were no longer a problem with north korea. we know that s a lie. we know that s a lie, and nothing like that was accomplished. what we re seeing is a pattern of summits where the promise is great. we don t really know what was agreed on wrong at both ends. there s no preparation and there s no follow-through. no engine, no caboose.
all of these summits essentially leave us worse out than where we were before them. think about it, willie. the north korean leader leaves far stronger than when he first met with trump. putin, much stronger than made donald trump look like, you know, his patsy on the world stage. he s much stronger than he was before, and now trump is saying, we don t negotiate from a position of weakness or strength. no. if you re the united states of america, i m sorry. you always negotiate from a position of strength. as richard points out, the president is supposed to come in end of the process. dot handshake, sign the declaration. not come in at the beginning making promising and declaring victory at the end of a press conference where nothing was actually achieved. one of the patterns of the trump administration, the president make as grand public declaration, the rest of the administration comes in to reshape it or clean it up.
yesterday mike pompeo talked about all the preconditions he would need to see before a meeting with iran. if iranians present a commitment to change how they treat their people, that it s worthwhile to enter into a nuclear agreement that actually prevention proliferation, the president is prepared to sit down and have a conversation with him. one of the things they tried to get in at the senate hearing. who should the american people, the united states senate listen to. you have president trump saying one thing on the big stage and then people like pompeo, bolton and others coming in after the fact, saying something completely contradictory? the answer is clear. listen to the president of the united states. that s what the rest of the world is figuring out. as much as they may respect the secretary of defense or the secretary of state, end of the day, if they don t speak for the united states and it doesn t appear they do, how can you listen to them.
the two summits we had, there was no staff in the room. they weren t in the room. the president of the united states has become the chief different mat of the united states. we have to learn, that s reality. so the secretary of state and others can come in before or afterwards and try to clean it up, but we he is look, i like mike pompeo. don t get me wrong. i think the president is putting him in an extraordinary difficult almost untenable position like with rex tillerson. if you re not in the room and don t know what transacted, how can you authoritively say this is the policy of the united states? and talking republicans trust donald trump more than their family, more than they trust the media. so at what point do republicans visit at what point do republicans, the question we continue to ask, at what point do republicans say, wait a second. we were anti-putin and anti-russian. didn t like him shooting down commercial aircrafts or invading other countries.
poisoning people, assassinating but now donald trump says he s okay. so he s okay. and rewriting 70 years of policy that republicans champion and then makes nice with north korea. and now he sounds so weak. basically begging the iranians for a summit. at what point does somebody like nikki haley go, i m out. i m running against this guy in 2020 before he ends up, like, turning u.s. foreign policy over to all of our enemies. i was if he hasn t already. if you remember, i was critical and every other conservative was critical of barack obama being so focused on dealing with iran and cuba. that was child s play. donald trump is north korea,
russia, now iran. there is not a tyrant, not a terror state that this guy doesn t want to cozy up to. i think the answer is, at least all the evidence we ve seen to date is never. never. that s what i can t stress enough, there s no evidence whatsoever that his base supporter or any member of congress is actually turning on him in a public way. i d say the opposite is true. he s growing more powerful. his sway is growing more powerful. because conservatives now like iran and now like north korea and conservatives like russia? i don t think people pay that close attention to it. i think people look at him and say, he s doing it different. the old way didn t work. i don t believe any of you guys on the set. they don t trust us. they trust him. heidi, they could go on the google machine 30 seconds. you don t have to trust me. go to your neighbor s google machine and type stuff in. the truth is out there, but this
isn t the x files. russia was the perfect example. right? it never happened. can t sit alone with putin for two hours, meet with him. treat him like the pope when standing next to him. surely republicans will turn on him. nobody turned on him. even the couple of congressman, kel, concerned about that. within 24 hours, all ran for the hills. why? because they fear the base. it s painful. the base loves trump. somebody needs to tell the base the truth and could that, go to town hall meetings and actually tell the base the truth, heidi. they ought to try it sometime. you have, again, with donald trump, you have him capitulating to terror states, and then you have steve scalise actually joining in. somebody in the republican majority joining in, signing on to impeach rod rosenstein, because they re trying to get to the bottom of vladimir putin and
his attempts to undermine american democracy. well, that is a republican leader. not abencher. that is a republican leader who is actually working hard to subvert and investigation already indicted several dozen russians, and we have the the u.s. military, the u.s. intel community, has the goods on the russians. they tried to subvert american democracy in 2016, and steve scalise is signing on with freedom caucus back benchers to try to actually subvert and investigation over someone actually trying to undermine american democracy? joe, i saw your tweet yesterday about how this election in 2018 is going to be the most important of our lifetimes for a lot of people, and i think that is your answer. whether you want to go down whether it s foreign policy or
it s guns or it s the tax cuts. there s going to be another proposed round of tax cuts for the wealthy now. at the same time that president trump s base is closing ranks around him, look into the poll numbers, and see what s happening with the intensity of the disapproval on the other side of the ledger, and that s why this election is so important, but that s also why it s so hard to tell exactly what s going on has to match those numbers up, because what we could see here is a repeat of what happened with barack obama, which is that when barack obama was not on the ballot in the mid-terms, his people didn t come out but an intensity on the other side of the ledger that swept democrats, and you could see the same thing happening here, just because those numbers are becoming stronger with each one of these examples that you cite. the intensity of the disapproval on the other side is strengthening.
manifold, twofold, threefold. one more point about iran before we go to break. yes. often ask, what if obama had done this? we don t have to ask. he did it during the debate almost to the week in 2007, 11 years would meet with ahmadinejad, savaged by republicans and hillary clinton and democrats as well. still ahead on morning joe, president trump heads to florida to stump for a candidate who s stumping for trump? we ll explain. plus, two weeks ago republican senator rand paul announced he was concerned about president trump s choice of brett kavanaugh for the supreme court, but yesterday paul wrote on twitter, i have decided to support his nomination. who could have saw that coming? and when we look at the senators who may or may not support kavanaugh, jim vandehei, let s not even put rand paul on this list. he does this every time. i m going to vote against that.
i m going to vote against that, and he always ends up lining behind the president, supports donald trump blindly. he s going to vote for kavanaugh. it s a joke for him to even any reporter that thinks he s not should really seriously look into another profession. he s going to vote for kavanaugh. let your perfect drive come together at the lincoln summer invitation sales event. get 0% apr on select 2018 lincoln models plus $1,000 bonus cash. but prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered. in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory.
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that s a new ad from congressman ron desantis in his bid to become florida the nominee for governor. president trump will rally in florida today where desantis who endorsed a tweet last december helping him move ahead in the polls of former front-runner adam putnam, the state s agriculture commissioner, and i am behind donald trump every step of the way. wow. i guess he likes the putin stuff. likes changing u.s. foreign policy. it s a big fan of iran, i guess. i guess a big fan of north korea. the party s changed so much. i mean when i was a republican we liked balanced budget, when wheeze balance a budget, actually. we liked paying down the debt. we liked keeping in entitlements solvent. let s see. what else? oh! we were against tyrants in iran and north korea. that s changed. all of that has changed. it s so funny. i mean you can t i used to say that
the party is not conservative anymore. but we are so far beyond that. they are they are they ve adopted vladimir putin s foreign policy. donald trump has adopted vladimir putin s foreign policy. you have people on russian television every night saying, the soviets. we could never do this when we were the soviet union. donald trump is doing it for us. that s what russian television commentators are saying. then you look at our domestic policy, our foreign oepolicy. stalin wishes he had the ability to impose tariffs and then pay farmers $12 billion that a lot of farmers are saying, we don t even need. as ron johnson said it is a soviet-style-type economy when you start when donald trump starts talking about picking winners and losers. i don t know if it s soviets
sell, it is socialism, though, and that used to be, at least where i m from, that used to be something that conservative voters were against. maybe it s a selling point now. i don t know. so let s talk about your former political party, which changed drastically, i submit, since you were last a registered member of the republican party. right. and jimmy pointed this out earlier. this poll who would you trust for accurate information? among trump supporters the result, trump, 91%. friends and family, 63%. mainstream media, no surprise, 11%. so if you re running for governor of florida, if you are ron desantis you clearly seek his fave perp understandable. you want a favorable tweet from the president of the united states. rockets him ahead in the primary, but among the base we continually talk about, how deep and lasting is the fear, the clear fear that many of elected republicans have about the president of the united states?
i mean, i think it s i just the fear is there. what i don t understand is, when leaders of my party did something i disagreed with, i went after them. went home and explained to my constituents why i went after them. they re spending too much money. newt s talking about they re spending more now. just saying. i could go home, voted against the bill because they re spending too much money. i voted against the bill because newt s talking about getting rid of the tax cuts. jim, that s what i i don t understand is, i d hold 100 town hall meetings a year. you can explain to your constituents and i can tell you my constituents way back then always understood. yeah, okay. don t go along with the party, then. if the party s going the wrong way, go your own way and found it strengthened me, not only among independents but among
party members who trust immediate more because they didn t blindly follow party dictates. but fear is an exceptionally powerful motivator. step back one second. georgia, basically a swing state. florida, basically a swing state. the president of the united states weighs in on both of those races, and takes trump candidates who were way behind in the polls and instantly makes them such favorites that people are telling putnam to get out of the race. it s insane. instant, overnight. that s power. adam putnam, one of the most able leaders in the state of florida. republican or democrat. florida voters would be a fool to not vote for adam putnam. but they don t agree with you by a 12-point margin and think the establishment is foolish to back putnam. that s the pow are he has and why it outlast it s the thing trump proved all the things we thought the republican party stood for, didn t necessarily is what the base of the party stood
for. turns out they get more jazzed about immigration, about the changes face of america this is exactly i remember driving over with with my former chief of staff, driving over after katrina hit, and we were dealing with, richard, just extraordinary incompetence, not only at the federal level but the state and local level. now, my chief of staff said, you know what? this is what happens when you go down ideological check boxes. by the way, he s a very conservative republican. in fact, he s he s he s an elected official. he said, we check off, are they pro-life? are they pro-gun? are they pro-this? pro-that? and we get the candidates we want, and then a katrina comes. and ideologically they re lined up but don t know anything about leading. here you have ron desantis, dressing his baby in make america great outfits and reading bedtime stories, it s
cute, clever. he s playing the trump card. what s going to happen when a category 5 storm goes across the i-4 corridor? will desantis be able to deal with that as well as putnam? no. nobody would begin to think that. it s lunacy. not just talking about this race, but this is how people ask, how do we get the katrinas, the poor leadership we get? and it is the stupid, dumbing-down ideologically on the democratic side and on the republican side. are they pro-choice? are they anti-gun? whatever on the democratic side? and same thing on the republican side. and nobody s looking for, are they a leader that can get my family evacuated when a category 5 hurricane comes in tampa bay? just to say we re going to have that problem, and didn t we already have that problem for two reasons? one, the risk of sounding wonky, severe weather, cost of climb
change is the norm, no longer the exception. look what s happening around this country. and our infrastructure combined with that means we can t cope. so this is governing s hard but we are making it harder because we re not serious. not serious about climate change or infrastructure. this country face as crisis economically, socially in human terms and are simply letting it happen. by the way, not serious about elected serious leaders. best leader i ve ever seen and wasn t warm and fuzzy, jeb bush. never seen anybody lead on a state level as effectively as jeb bush. not a close second of all the people i ve seen over the past 20, 25 years and jeb wasn t warm and cuddly. you know? he just did his damn job. anyway still ahead, president trump is awake. good morning, don. and tweeting this morning. he s taking a shot at the coke brothers. oh, my god. taking a shot at the coke brothers. yeah, a smart move. you re so powerful.
hey, keep attacking the coke brothers. attack them every day. year so powerful and strong. by the way, also senator enough to sit down with bob mueller. e really should not listen to all of those people because you went to princeton and you fordham you re not smart enough to sit down with him. i m not sure where you went to high school but smart enough to sit down with him and keep attacking the koch brothers after the network announced it wouldn t support some republican candidates this november. willie it is a veritable war of words out there. yes, it is, and the koch brothers are happy to have it. as am i. we ll be right back. let s fly, let s fly away just say the words and we ll beat the birds down to acapulco bay it s perfect for a flying honeymoon they say
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officials overseeing billionaire charles koch will not be supporting republican congressman kevin cramer against incumbent democrat heidi hide kamp in north dakota. supporting those outside the republican party seeking to distance itself from president trump over disagreements on trade and immigration. the decision deals a big hit to cramer, who s already being out-fund razed by heitkamp. on the heels of that the president is tweeting this morning saying the globalist koch brothers who have become a total joke in real republican circles are against strong borders and powerful trade. i never sought their support because i don t need their money or bad ideas. they love my tax and regulations cuts, judicial picks and more. i made them richer. their network is highly overrated. i have beaten them at every turn. they want to protect their companies outside the u.s. from being taxed.
i m for america first, and the american worker. a puppet for no one. my god. ooh. except for vlad. two nice guysideas. make america great again. god. i don t know where to start. there s a lot there. jim, first of all, there s no reason why charles koch a classical liberal, no reason why charles koch would support donald trump, would support the protectionism. they obsess over government spending, they want not balanced budgets but rational budgeting and you got the biggest spending bills ever, trump going on the biggest trade war we ve been at since herbert hoover was president. you can go down the list. economically there s really no reason for charles koch or any libertarian or in his case
classical liberal to support donald trump, is there? no. i think you outlined perfectly what the koch brothers stand for and it s more traditional republican party topics on recognizes, taxation, even immigration is a different place than the president. charles koch probably likes this tweet because one of the things that the koch network is trying to do is rebrand themselves. they know how radioactive they are in politics. david koch has stepped back from political operations. charles koch is the leader of that organization, probably happy to have this. but, again, i think he s definitely speaking for a distinct minority inside the republican party. but speaks for what we thought republicans stood for pre-trump. heidi, they always have been very uncomfortable with some of the more hard core republicans views on immigration.
they ve been concerned about exploding military budgets. they ve also been concerned by protectionism. this was before trump. and don t know they have much of a choice but to do what they have done here if they want to stay true by the way, donald trump can t make the kochs any more money than they already have. they never liked trump. they didn t support him in 2016. they held out for quite a while. and, yes, the issues range the gamut from the deficit spending to the muslim ban. charles koch was on the record likening that to nazi-style racism. but here s the thing. mark short is tightly aligned with the koch network and he was right there in the white house as a legislative director and they took away the crown jewel of their agenda which was the tax cuts.
so surprise, surprise, now mark short is leaving. he s gone after the tax cuts have been enacted and i know personally from speak with the kochs and the representatives that as early as january they started to become very uncomfortable, they started to pick up whiffs of the protectionism that was about to come with the tariffs and the trade wars and were very concerned about this, so they ve been kind of in this position for several months. not surprising they would come out at this point, that they are comparing this to depression-era tariffs and trade protectionism. but i do think this is significant because, joe, so many times we ve sat in this chair and talked about what is it going to take the republicans to stand up to trump. well all along it s been who behind them. it s been the donors threatening them on the tax cuts, for instance. the donors have outsize influence over a lot of these
republican representatives. so i do think that this is an important moment, and a potential change, and strategy that could, could show some fractures in the party because donors are so powerful in this party. it s a great point to make. by the way, i know the koch network is still working with the white house when it comes to criminal justice reform, but willy the president launching this war against the kochs this morning, you wonder where paul singer is going to be, where other republican donors will be. because heidi is right, the only thing that these republican candidates would fear more than donald trump s wrath are a lot of traditionally republican donors saying you re just not conservative any more, i m cutting off the spicket. donald trump doesn t consider any of that when he sends out a tweet like that. as heidi points out they did not
support donald trump financially. they sat out the 2016 election. he never forgot that. they came out the koch brothers and criticized him about the muslim ban. steve bannon talked about the koch brothers quote shut up and get with the program. steve bannon to the koch brothers. but this is at the end of the day for the koch brothers about trade. this is what pushed them over the top, the idea that trade somehow bad which is the message that president trump put out there. they see these tariffs, the bail out of the farmers as fundamentally contradictory to everything they stand for. so they say of course we ll back republicans as we always have but we also might back a democrat who stands up to things like this. that s great. free trade, immigration, they have been drivers of american economic success. so trump is all about cultural republicanism. these guys are much more about
classic economic republicanism, a small state and openness which again has been the real engines of america s success. great to see people standing up to this. thank you all for being on this morning. coming up all right you two. let the past be the past. exactly what i ve been trying to say for 2000. donald trump s new defense strategy in the mueller probe is not new. but it continues. utter confusion. we ll have the dizzying new comments from the president s lawyer rudy giuliani, plus from fire and fury to a meeting with no preconditions the president sets the stage for a north korea style shift with iran. we ll talk about that ahead on morning joe . and packages. and it s also a story about people. people who rely on us every day to deliver their dreams they re handing us more than mail they re handing us their business and while we make more e-commerce deliveries
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that ted cruz s father was part of the assassination plot along with lee harvey oswald. he s just citing a report what people say. i know you worked for ted cruz so i m not going to have you answer this question, but i m just saying, just it s true. an announcement okay, good. an announcement to anybody out there, if you accuse my father of assassinating the president and then make fun of my wife and say she s ugly, all i can say is duck. not only duck today, duck tomorrow and duck every day for the rest of your life because i m going to be coming after you every day and either you re going to be finished politically or i ll be finished politically and chances are good i ll have a lot more hate in me
oh, my lord, no hate in your heart. you re reduced to dust. that said that s shocking i m looking past a guy that worked for him. i m looking at you walter. how shock that ted cruz is to donald trump after donald trump accused his father of being a part of the assassination of jfk and suggested that ted cruz s wife was ugly. the obsequitous of republican leaders to donald trump is something history will be baffled about. you go up and down the line. as you said earlier in the show there were times as a republican you had to stand up to a republican president, whatever. the fact that nobody will stand up to him shows that they care more about their primary than they do the example you bring up with ted cruz, it s taken to the lowest level. he wrote the piece in time
magazine for donald trump. for time 100. i would write the piece too but i would say something else. it s just your father. what s the big deal? go down the list of republicans, only those retiring, like corker and flake are standing up. here s the problem, though, howard decent i ve noticed some people who are retiring, to borrow a term i ve already borrowed a term from walter isaacson and others are borrowing regularly, even those retiring are going to be lobbyists. they won t say anything negative about donald trump even when it has to do with u.s. foreign policy that has tied this country together with our allies for 70 years. the political system is broken. i m going to blame the republicans but i m sure the democrats have some skin in this
program. you see a total lack of statesmanship. we see goldwater and nixon and you can even get the republicans to vote against trump. susan collins has no business for voting for brett kavanaugh and she s going to do it. it s ridiculous. no willingness to stand up for your constituents. it s all about being re-elected. it s only about being re-elected not about exercising the mandate that the voters gave them to do something. which you would think is an incredible opportunity for the democrats. we ll get to that. we re not so much better. i need to ask, willy, if somebody attacked your father and your wife and i m dead serious at nbc news, the way that donald trump attacked ted cruz s father and wife, would you ever work with him? would you ever write a time 100 piece about saying how great
they are. i would not go out of my way. i understand on the one hand he s a republican senator who wants to get things done and may require the support of the united states, but on a personal level i wouldn t do all these other things and lavish him with praise in the way ted cruz has. to the governor s point. remember we had mark sanford the day after he lost his primary. what did he say when i asked him what was your advice to republicans running this fall? he said simply pledge allegiance to donald trump. so whpeople are scared for thei jobs. fear and quivering. they are quivering. as opposed to some back bone, some spine and some belief that you put country ahead. really quickly as a public service announcement, i mean this for kids who are running, who we think they want to get into politics at some point, i m dead serious. nothing sells. nothing sells with voters like
being yourself. for standing up against something that everybody thinks you need to fall behind. voters love independents. i know you ve seen it before. it s conviction politics. it s what they like. conviction politics. i m telling you, when gingrich was man of the year, and he was supposedly the most powerful go after him every time. and constituents would say why are you doing it? i would explain it one, two, three at a town hall meeting. okay. got it. you can do it. that s why we love stories like profiles in courage, the kennedy book. also with us for the conversation, we have staff writer for the atlantic, an nbc news and msnbc contributor. good to have you on board. the intros are not happening today, joe, just not happening. but i will get to the news. we do know each other.
president trump s lawyer rudy giuliani is not ruling out the possibility of a second 2016 meeting about russians peddling dirt to traufump campaign. something he raised then denied in television appearances yesterday. giuliani said he was heading off a story from the new york times quoting from the report he said journalists included maggie haberman. giuliani said he and trump attorney spent a great deal of time on sunday trying to run the story down. giuliani said he believes he managed to shut it down and how to kill the story but yet speculated you re using your outside voice again. the journalists found other reasons not run the item. maggie haberman said i lost the thread of what the former mayor is talking about.
[ laughter ] not the only one. in his third and final fox interview, if you call it an interview, giuliani backed off his flat out denials senior trump aides discussed the russian s offer in an earlier meeting. there wasn another meeting that hasn t been made public. three days before. according to cohen or according to the leak he says there was a meeting with donald jr., with jared kushner, with paul manafort, with gates and possibly two others in which they out of the presence of the president discussed the meeting with the russians. we checked with their lawyers, the ones we could check with, the four of the six. that meeting never ever took place. it didn t happen. there s no second meeting here? it s highly unlikely.
i have to leave the opening open as a lawyer in case they come across with something that startles us or we feel is important. natasha, giuliani introduced this meeting in the morning on cnn and over the course of the dave he says there was another meeting three days before and then at night he said i m telling you that meeting did not take place, it never happened. again having a debate with himself. the most salient line of all his interviews, quote, nobody can be sure of anything. do you know anything about this other meeting he s talking about? it certainly makes sense. i want to step back. i think this is really now it shows it s very obvious the trump team strategy is to get ahead of stories because if it s true that the new york times was planning to release a story about this june 7th meeting that occurred two days before the trump tower meeting then that s obviously what giuliani was trying to get ahead of and that s what he told the daily beast last night. we don t know if this meeting
took place yet but that seems that would make complete sense given up to everything we know the days leading up to the trump tower, the famous speech that donald trump gave about hillary clinton, the dirt that he s previewing about hillary clinton and her ties to russia and her work at the state department was that night, paul unanimous fortfort manafort and jared kushner were with him when he gave that speech at that rally that night. it s very obvious what happened here and donald trump learned about it on june 7th the meeting and probably approved it and gave the go ahead and i couldn t resist bragging about it that night. i m not a real lawyer but i played one in law firms for about five or six years. and the thing that was most fascinating is when you would be around somebody that was a great trial lawyer, and you did discovery and everybody started pulling pieces together, there
was always, always the most exciting thing to see would be a great timeline coming together. and i got to say, of all the cases that a lot of prosecutors i talked to have ever seen, the timeline that is coming together in this case against donald trump, against don jr., against all of them, whether you re talking about the proactive statement on air force one, go back to the campaign where donald trump on the very day said russians if you re listening go after these 33,000 emails, the russians start working on it that day. the timeline from beginning to end is pretty extraordinary, and it s going to look very stark inside a courtroom. so, i think that rudy giuliani has the same crisis communication correspond school online that carter page did.
you re absolutely right. because the public communication on how this is going, i mean giuliani is incoherent. i don t know from one day what s going on. you were communication director what s he doing. nothing we learn. you would say normally, okay, this is wrong, go out and clean this up. then you go out and clean it up. reporters report it and the story dies. they don t do that. they go out and confuse it more and confuse it top of that. giuliani talks about what you would not normally talk about. all lawyers would like to preserve a defending for future use. that s what they do. except he talks about it. i told sean hannity, well i don t want to say i have to keep that open as an option in case his client lied or it is revealed as we ve seen all along which was pointed out this morning. it keeps advancing. no we met with no russians.
we might have met with russians. we did meet with the russians. there was no collusion. there might have been collusion. there s no crime. it is a crime. collusion and conspiracy are interchangeable words. incredible. devaluing the truth. look what rudy giuliani is doing and mumbling words and doing a great disservice for his client. look what his client is doing. he s just babbling. michael cohen is hurting to get a plea deal by having lanny davis go out and put it all out there in the immortal words of the fantastic mr. forks it s amateur night in dixie. it s bad. michael cohen has stopped looking for smoke signals from the white house. i want to pick up on your point about the timeline. while all this is going on, this is noise they are creating, mueller is putting together a timeline and it has real dates and real witnesses and real logs and real evidence about what
actually occurred. so by the way donald trump may not care about what the facts are. he may be in the white house that talks about an alternate version of facts. 91% of republicans may be the same way. bob mueller cares about facts and so do the judges deciding these cases. meanwhile, walter, you have rudy who is not just clearly is going rogue on the white house press office and just calling up his mega phone to make an announcement on fox news, not to be grilled in anyway or given a tough question in anyway, allowed to make announcements and then change those announcements and then devalue the truth, transform the truth, change the facts, bring in more alternative facts what ever you want to do, whatever he chooses. what s the point of the press briefing at this point? the white house press briefing where reporters wait every day to try to understand what s
happening in this white house, to try to understand what s happening in this world, to try and get closer to the facts? you re right. giuliani is totally unhinged. he has been for a while. what he s doing, as rick said, is undermining the case so badly that i don t know why they are allowing it. there s no control at the white house. it s not just the press briefing, the chief of staff, general kelly, these are probably people who would like to reassert control but can t. on the final point i ll make is we really have to give respect to bob mueller at the moment. robert mueller, despite all these incoming missiles and attacks so methodically, carefully kept his eye on the ball and laying things out, doing it in a way that makes it clear this is no witch-hunt, not leaking, you know giuliani is leaking the possibility of a meeting that he says might leak.
but mueller is a man of deep and true integrity and the attacks on him are appalling. you know, willy, while the reason why robert mueller doesn t care what rudy giuliani or the freedom caucus or donald trump say is donald trump is playing ping pong in queens with his phone spurs, mueller was running through the jungles of vietnam and saving men there, and came back highly decorated guy. could have cashed in and made tons of money but he dedicated his life to public service. he s the antithesis of donald trump in every way. robert mueller is not listening to this noise. he s not watching rudy giuliani on fox three times contradicting himself. when you hear rudy giuliani the other day say robert mueller doesn t have a damn thing. rudy giuliani doesn t have a damn idea what robert mueller has and neither of us eritrea.
it didnoesn t appear the presid of the united states objects to the way rudy giuliani defends him. remember during the stormy daniels payment story of a couple months ago giuliani told a couple different versions of that story. he s the kind of guy, new york guy that creates this fog machine that donald trump likes. right, exactly. it s unclear whether there s any coordination going on outside of donald trump and giuliani. i think giuliani mentioned he had discussed this potential story leaking with jay sekulow who was a tv lawyer going out and being the pr person for the president last year, anyway. this is i want to go back to the timeline for a continue that rick talked about because i think that s really, really important to judge whether or not this meeting is likely to have occurred. i think that this knowing a pre-planning meeting happened, knowing the trump campaign was very eager to get this dirt on hillary clinton has to be looked at from the perspective of,
okay, well the campaign actually already knew or at least one member of the campaign already knew rurchs had dirt on clinton in the form of thousands of emails. remember george papadopoulos had been told by russia linked foreign national that the russians did have this dirt on clinton. so if you use common sense and if you say it s very likely that papadopoulos told the campaign about these emails beforehand and you look at their eagerness and willingness to accept this meeting with the russians on promise to obtain dirt on hillary clinton and don jr. didn t seem surprised at all, that it makes total sense they would be very, very eager to take this meeting and that donald trump himself would be in on it. the wall street journal editorial board south with a new op-ed entitled trump s lose the house strategy. it reads in part mr. trump might
not welcome the democratic house but he also might not fear it as long as republicans keep the senate. even more than most politicians mr. trump always needs a foil and speaker nancy pelosi would be from central political casting. mr. trump could cut deals with democrats on paid family leave, public work spending and trade protectionism. house democrats could start up the impeachment machinery and once under way the momentum would be hard to stop. but as long as he s safe from conviction by the senate mr. trump might figure he can benefit from a backlash against impeachment the way bill clinton did. the president may think a democratic house may improve his chance for re-election as
independents conclude he s the only barrier to a left wing government led by elizabeth warren. that s pretty insightful. i do not read wall street journal op-ed. haven t read it for 30 years. that s very interesting thinking. so on point. i mean, this is exactly what could happen. i don t think trump s support is not there. the interesting thing is what it captures is trump s amorality. trump has no loyalty to anybody but himself. but how do you feel about that, that s a reality that could play out, whether he s moral or not. but you re right. the fact that he s so amoral the thing about the republican party he s a democrat. please. a democrat please. you mortally wound me. gave money to the dnc when you were there? i don t think so. if he did that wasn t a fair question.
he always gave money to the dnc. i never called him, that s for sure. a lot of democrats did. i actually don t think i think trump may be thinking that s what i thought was insightful. this is a mirror into the thinking of a csociopath. there s a little we hate nancy pelosi in there. but nancy pelosi would make a good, a good counter point. you can say anything a lot. you can say anything about nancy pelosi but one thing she s not stupid. she s a smart political operative and smart enough to know whatever her numbers may be, unlike many people in washington, she s not driven by ego that needs to put her in front of the television cameras every day. if she thought that was a possibility she would be much lower profile. my only problem with that
editorial is that it s 7:21 on july 31st, you know what donald trump is thinking about? 7:22. it s true. that could happen by default. second of all, mika, i don t think democrats will impeach trump unless there s a real reason to do it. hating donald trump is not a reason to impeach him. i think manafort, i mean the manafort trial will be an enormous problem for donald trump. and that is a piece of the puzzle that is, in fact, connected to the collusion. really clear we re all acquainted with trump s m.o. in new york. there s no chance that donald trump, his total top down command control is the way he runs. no chance he didn t know about the meeting. good chance he sat in on one of the meetings with the russians.
the guy knew everything. that s how he ran the campaign. it was a mom and pop operation without a mom. he knew absolutely everything that was going on. but, if you just look at the history of it, it is true, walter, that we can go back to 2010, tea party comes in, in essence re-elects by overreaching re-elects barack obama in 2012, we all got elected in 94, overreached, got bill clinton re-elected in 1996. this happens all the time. and there is no doubt for donald trump s re-election, nancy pelosi, speaker of the house is much better than a republican because right now he s blaming the democrats for not being able to build the wall. republicans are in charge. you know, he would swing this is why he goes and meets with north koreans. begs the iranians to meet with
him. he would certainly sort of play with the house democrats and i think that, you know, he would change his stripes as he s often done. the weird thing about it, though, i think natasha had a wonderful line which is tv lawyers. i mean people who aren t real lawyers but the giulianis and lanny davis that s out there for tv. this is what happens when you re not sort of having a strategy for the long run, and you re just dancing for the 7:22:00 a.m., 7:23 a.m. tweets you re going to do. howard decent thank you very much. still ahead on morning joe it s clear that the russians used social media to attack the american election. but it doesn t stop there. natasha has new reporting on how moscow has now weaponized the american court system against the kremlin s enemies. she ll take us through her new reporting on that. an update on the start of paul manafort s criminal trial. you re watching morning joe .
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the first trial in the special counsel probe kicks off with paul manafort. he s accused of hiding $30 million he made before his days with trump as an unregistered foreign lobbyist for ukraine and it s former pro russian president. the prosecution plans to call 35 witnesses including agents from the fbi, treasury department and irs to show how manafort allegedly stashed his wealth in overseas banks to avoid paying u.s. taxes. joining us now, washington bureau chief susan page and former assistant u.s. attorney in the southern district of new york. good morning. what should we be looking for? give us a preview of the
manafort trial. this will be a classic fraud trial in many ways but for the fact that manafort is a high-profile defendant and a lot of attention on it for ext extraneous reasons. he made a lot of money, spent lavishly. the trial will be very dry and burglary. when gates was the that will be the most compelling interesting part to the rest of the world. but, you know, it s a strong case. i think there s a very good chance that he s going to get convicted. always hard to make those predictions. opening arguments, which will be after jury selection which can take a couple of days in a trial like this, the opening arguments will be to lay out both the government s case in a nutshell, and what some of the defenses might be which are hard to see right now what those might be.
manafort is interesting because he was obviously donald trump s campaign chairman. this trial has to do with before he had that relationship with donald trump. do you see a nexus here at all of the russian investigation and what this trial is about? i think the new york times headline was perfect, actually how it s not explicitly part of the trial but looming over it. the prosecutors have promised the judges, this is a no nonsense judge and he wants to keep the russian investigation out of this. manafort has asked to barney mention of the fact that he was even trump s campaign manager. that was granted with the exception there was one bank loan where the person who loaned him the money was basically offered a job on the campaign in exchange. i believe it s going to come in through that. but, no. i don t there s not going to be explicit talk about it. the real issue is in the jurors. and this was manafort asked for the trial to be moved to another location. that was denied. as i think it should have been
because it s a very tricky thing to try and find jurors who can be completely impartial in any case. everybody brings their own biases to any trial. maybe they don t like the police. maybe they were a victim of a crime and think any defendant who was charged must be guilty. so prosecutors and judges and defense attorneys are always trying to weed out biases like that. here that s going to be even harder, because we re in such a politically charged divisive time, and so even if the campaign, the fact that he worked for trump is not explicitly part of the trial it may be in the back of jurors head. you do run the risk, if i were a prosecutor i would be worried about jury nullificationullific decid deciding the case other than on the facts of the case.
i wonder how important the outcome of this or even the revelations along the way are to the mueller probe? you know, i think this is an important test for robert mueller as well as something of really consequential problems for paul manafort and that s because this is the first trial from charges he brought as special counsel. if he has a trial that seems very authoritative and feels like a strong case and paul manafort is convicted it makes it harder for critics of robert mueller to say he s on a witch-hunt. this is one more example of the consequences of the meticulous investigation that he s done. of course, we ve been waiting to see if it s possible paul manafort might be pressured to cooperate in the probe that does have something to do about russia, about collusion and obstruction of justice and that s something that could be an outcome of this trial even if it s never mentioned in courtroom. you and usa today have been checking in with your trump
panel to see how they feel about the state of affairs in washington. does russia register with them, more or less now than it used to and more broadly how are they feeling about president trump? it s interesting because some of the trump voters that we ve been talking to think russia did meddle. some think they didn t. they believe that the assertions that president trump has made in opposition to the conclusions of his intelligence agencies, we found some trump voters do view russia as an enemy not as a competitor. some of them were a little uncomfortable with that press conference with vladimir putin. but this has not shaken their support in donald trump or their faith in him. they are ias though the attacks against donald trump just make him stronger with them. they see him as standing up for the things he said he was going to do in the campaign on things like that, even building the wall and shutting down the government as a threat to do it, something that shows he s doing
what they said he ll do. he s pursuing the issues that prompted them to vote for him. your latest piece for the atlantic how russias punish dicy dent using u.s. courts. how russia has weaponized red notices and the u.s. judicial system against its enemies. tell us more about that. yeah. over the course of my reporting i found ice as been detaining asylum seekers on the basis of these red notices which is not an arrest warrant but the closest thing to an international arrest warrant that exists today. russia is the top abuser of interpol in terms of issuing these red notices which are politically motivated. what i.c.e. is doing is cracking down on visa overstays and using that as jumping off point as an
excuse to detain these individuals who are then denied bond hearings because of these red notices that have been issued by russia against primarily dissidents and kremlin rivals. the red notices are being given a lot of weight by the department of homeland security even though they have no independent value of their own. sign court filings, for example, the dhs has argued that arrest warrants issued by russia are valid because of the red notice that has been put out by interpol which, of course, only require that russia fills out the right form. interpol and red notices have no independent value of their own. what we re seeing these people are detained and are kept in detention and ultimately they are facilitating these back door extraditions because the u.s. does not have an extradition
treaty with russia. lawyers have been appealing that decision because their argument is that these individuals would essentially be sent to their doom if they were sent back to russia, but it is it is kind of a way to facilitate these back door extraditions which is a disconnect that we don t have an extradition treaty with russia because we don t trust their system of justice. natasha, thank you very much. still ahead on morning joe i will have mexico pay for that wall. mark my words. mexico will pay for the wall. believe me. and whose going to pay for the wall? mexico. 100%. we heard that throughout the 2016 campaign but now trump is threatening to shut down
congress if congress doesn t fund the wall. the government democratic senator will join us next for that. we ll be right back with much more morning joe . en? liberty mutual doesn t hold grudges. how mature of them. for drivers with accident forgiveness liberty mutual won t raise their rates because of their first accident. liberty mutual insurance. liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty
security, after many, many years of talk within the united states, i would have no problem doing a shutdown. it s time we had proper border security. we re the laughingstock of the world. we have the worst immigration laws anywhere in the world. i would be certainly willing to consider a shutdown if we don t get proper border security. is the funding of the border wall wait until after the mid-term elections? probably. that s something we do have a disagreement on. you re not worried about a government shut down? no that s not going to happen. i twhohink it would be bad politics for the republican party. we would get blamed. there s a way to get wall funding and deal with the daca population. if the president wants to shut down the government, that s his prerogative.
i think it would be a mistake and i don t think it would be necessary. president trump and republicans on capitol hill at odds over whether a shut down over immigration border wall funding should be on the table. joining us now a member of the judiciary committee, senator hirono. there s a hearing on child separations at the border this morning. senator, thanks for being with us. i want to get your view on this idea of a government shutdown, the president who for years has promised mexico would pay for it. now says he ll shut down the government if democrats and republicans in the senate don t agree to pay for it. what s your reaction? the president could have gotten his border wall funding months ago when he was presented with a bipartisan bill to protect the 800,000 daca participants and he kept saying he would sign such a bill and he did not. so the president says a lot of things. he changes his mind. he governs by chaos, which he
mainly creates himself. senator, is there something you would offer, put on the table in a larger package for border security? i think we should have impressive comprehensive immigration reform. i don t hear him talking about daca that he created a huge vulnerability for. the president goes from issue to issue. it s always about himself all time every time. he throws red meat to his base every time he feels threatened or insecure. that s something we can couldn t on from him. he came back and said let s take care of the daca kids if you give me border wall funding what would you say? i remember the meeting i participated in where he said send me a bipartisan bill i ll sign it. by the time we got back to our offices that was off the table. so how can we even couldn t on this president to maintain his position on anything? as i said the one thing we can
couldn t on is when he feels threatened he ll go on attack and continue to throw red meat. one of the red meat is always to attack immigrants. i want to get to the hearing we advertised the judiciary committee on which you sit will have a hearing on family he new if i if i occasion efforts. incredible outrage, well founded outrage and confusion, frankly about why these families have not been reunited. what do you hope to find out today we ll find out why some 7/eleven children have been deemed ineligible to be reunited with their parents. what happened to the 400 children whose parents are already deported. what about some 40 children they don t even know where the parents or who the parents are. so this is total chaos. we need to find out specifically what do you have in mind, how do you plan to reunite these people. i find it incredible in the
hearing before the judge, thank goodness this judge in san diego is keeping the administration s feet to the fire, is to, for them to say well we did it, we accomplished what we needed to do in your time frame and yet there are 7/eleven or so of these children who are deemed ineligible to be reunited. really what constitutes ineligibility to reuniting these traumatized children with their parents. walter? i want to raise this to a larger issue because when you said trump was willing to accept a bipartisan bill and maybe calm down the immigration thing, and he reverses himself, he does so because he s so infected the republican party with an anti-immigrant sentiment that he got backlash from republicans. do you see any way that you and the senate which is supposed to be the deliberative body could be working with republicans and maybe could spill over to the house to sort of say we can
actually do a bipartisan thing without the right-wing of the republican party rebelling against that? there s always hope. as i said the senate actually had a bill. this was about the fourth iteration of a bipartisan bill that we thought the president would be willing to go along with because that s what he said he would do. you know, i look at it is the senate is the one body and while it would being a great for the house to wake up to their responsibilities, i think that we should do what we need to do in the senate to pass a bipartisan bill, which we came up with. so, i m hopeful that we can do that again. but at the same time if we wait around for the president to make up his mind what he deems acceptable, we should live so long. that s my attitude. senator hirono of hawaii. report back to us after that meeting. so let s bring in susan page right now.
saw san, let s talk about the politics of this. hearing today, obviously a lot of fireworks, got democrats that to abolish i.c.e. and you also have a lot of people wondering where these remaining children are and why the trump administration lost them. this is one of those issues that divides the american public along the lines that have become pretty familiar since the election of donald trump as president. this is something that is moving suburban, better educated suburban voters towards the democratic party and as it solidified trump s support among his core supporter. we ve been talking this morning about president trump, now rules a new republican party. that s not only because of the issues he s presented, it s because he s changing some of the demographic nature of the republican party and i thought david wasserman made a smart
point yesterday when he said one of the things going for democrats in the mid-term election better educated voters are more likely to vote. that has been a good thing for republicans in mid-terms. this time it s going to be a good thing for democrats because these are the kind of voters that have been in the past predominantly republican but disturbed and moved away from the gop because of issues like these family separation policies. i want to ask you something, the reality of separating children. seems to me that the administration may have run afoul of current law. talk about the aspects of separating immigrants from children, is there a criminality there? i think extreme view of it that some people have taken is that it s akin to kidnapping. i think that is pretty extreme. i don t think anyone would
actually pursue that theory of criminal liability. it talks to the point of this is unheard of before. the way in which childrenbeing, ripped from their parents hands and the real the issue about the laws is whether children will be held in some kind of custody. you know, that s what the trump administration tried to challenges and undo, was that children until recent under the law now cannot be held in jail basically for any extended period of time. so that was that, combined with this unprecedented policy of prosecuting every immigrant that came over the border regardless of the circumstances, you know, which had never been done or their legal status, if they were seeking asylum. exactly. is there more that judges can do? i know some judges are being tough, but it seems to me that the only help for these children
are these judges who can start holding the administration in contempt if they don t start moving faster. right. and you see this over and over, both in the immigration front and, frankly just to circle it back for a second, in the with the, quote, witch-hunt. you see judges over and overlooking at the facts, looking at the law and holding this administration accountable in a way nobody else either seems willing or able to do. so, yes, i think the judges in the immigration world right now are sort of the unsung heroes because they are trying to enforce deadlines that they ve set that the trump administration, you know, there are very low consequences if they ignore them. you know, i think we ll see more of that going forward. mimi, great to have you at the table. thanks so much. coming up on morning joe , the latest by the push by some republicans to impeach the deputy attorney general, the effort that has the support of the third ranking house republican, majority whip steve
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walter, kwifrg quislings, it will be used moving forward. what are your final thoughts? i was watching that congressman i know well from the new orleans area, steve scalise, talking about disappointing to me. republicans used to be very much about the rule of law, about law. here you have a deputy attorney general who is a republican appointed by a republican with a special prosecutor who has served this nation who is a republican. and they re methodically laying out a case. when you talk about quislings,
that s where you really, really cross the line, is when you are no longer in favor of the rule of law. my question is what do people in louisiana the good people in louisiana, the good people in northwest florida, the good people in this country, what do they think when their representative is trying to stop, derail an investigation that actually benefits vladimir putin, the stopping of that investigation and his interference in american democracy? it is that simple. we have the evidence. you know, i have been down living in new orleans now. it is surprising how things are beginning to turn among conservative republican business leaders. yes. and that s where you are getting a bit of a divide between the sort of hard-core trump supporters that have nailed russia. i don t get it. by the way, look at the polls. they have announced they ve become pro russia, pro putin compared to where they were a
couple of years ago. used to be for the rule of law, used to be for standing up to russia, used to be for free trade, used to be for balanced budget. used to be. walter isaacson, thank you so much. still ahead, rudy guilliani muddies the water again in the special council probe, revealing the possibility of a second meeting it trump campaign officials regarding russians offering dirt on hillary clinton. we will go through his latest cable news rambling session straight ahead. morning joe coming right back. d age-related macular degeneration, amd, i wanted to fight back. my doctor and i came up with a plan. it includes preservision. only preservision areds 2 has the exact nutrient formula recommended by the national eye institute to help reduce the risk of progression of moderate to advanced amd. that s why i fight. because it s my vision. preservision. also, in a great-tasting chewable.
the president s made it clear through his tweet and there was nothing as far as we know that would lead anyone to believe that there was anything except for discussion about adoption. looking back on it. i think donald trump jr. would tell you it wasn t the right thing to do but it wasn t a big deal because nothing came of the meeting sfw meeting. if he s proven to have not told the truth that campaigns look for dirt. there are some things in politics you take for granted. i have been looking at the federal code trying to find collusion as a crime. it is not. collusion is not a crime. there s so much going on there. i mean there s the lie, there s the lie that the president of the united states actually concocted on air force one when his lawyers weren t around, where he said it was about adoption. so they were all trotted out and they lied about that. so, you know, it was all about adoption.
and then, of course, we find out that the president did lie about that. correct. and that he was the one that actually drafted the lie. but then you actually go on and i ve got to say and i see my good friend jim who was such a sucker, he would regularly taken negative stories written about me and put them on the front page of roll call. oh, no. it is so great to see you back. it is ridiculous. my life is like one rolling déjà vu. i don t remember it though. you know you let these little resentments pileup. no, i don t. very nixonian. my middle name is millhouse. anyway, so darrell issa, i ve heard darrell issa say it now. who is the other republican said it? oh, dana rorhbach. of course, he said it in russian so it took me a couple of hours to get the exact translation. right. but both of those guys said
everybody would take dirt from a foreign power who is an enemy. i can tell you, if somebody from the republic of iran said we have dirt on your opponent, again, i have said it before, you knew like stafford, you know. you knew rachel, all of my chief of starts, bart, they would have immediately picked up the phone and called the fbi. right. immediately. there s no question! you see somebody run over, you re going over to vote at the capital, by a car, you would immediately call the police, call 911. it is the moving of which has been first, for trump supporters answer me that question. right. would anybody other than donald trump do this? have you ever heard of anybody in all of your years on capitol hill taking dirt from foreign enemies? well, no.
not only wouldn t they, i think everyone would respond exactly democrat or republican the way you are talking about. i think it is always the moving of the goalpost, right. it is always saying first, we never had any contact with the russians. okay, maybe we did. we never had any collusion with the russians. okay, maybe there was some collusion. even if there was collusion, it is not a crime. the next one will be, if it is a crime everyone does it. i will say you see it is contagious. not just trump does it but trump supporters to it in congress, and then the trump true believers who are the voters do it. that s why he has this mesmerizing power over the party. right. where people look to him for truth. they see his truth superior to their family s truth. yeah. we ll talk about that in a minute. but, mika, that s it, where they lie about the meeting, then they lie and say everybody would do it, and now we ve gotten to the point of even if he did lie. uh-huh. big deal, it is not a crime.
and then guilliani said, he finishes it by saying, well, my client didn t commit a crime, but if my client committed a crime it wasn t a crime. well, this is them reacting to what seems to be just coming out like a waterfall day by day by day and deflecting. usually trying to, like, transform world events to deflect against whatever is going on. heidi przybyla is with us as well. you see richard and along with willie, joe and me. we will get to our top story, which is that, president trump s lawyer, rudy guilliani is not ruling out the possibility of a second meeting in 2016 about russians peddling dirt to the trump campaign. come on, come on. honestly, his family should step in. throw grandpa from the train, all right. he needs to go home. that was a good movie, by the way. the family needs to step in. someone needs to step in. you know what, just let it ride. remember when ferris buehler,
save ferris. somebody close to rudy needs to take him home. if you are interviewing rudy, you really need to be embarrassed if you don t have a follow-up that makes sense. i watched a couple of the interviews, and it has been painful. i m sorry. it s pathetic. i don t know at some point you need to get your self-respect back. i thought one was actually good. really? that s all they had. do you like purple? i love the laughing nervously, wondering how they can let him get away with it because it is so obviously painful. anyhow, that s a five-minute wind up for us to give you the news. i did four-and-a-half. let s go. numerous television appearances yesterday by rudy guilliani. he told the daily beast last night he was heading off a story from the new york times. quoting from the report, guilliani said that journalists included maggie haberman who reached out to the alleged premeeting meeting. guilliani said he and trump
attorney jay sekulow spent a great deal of time on sunday trying to run the story down. he says he believes they managed to, quote, shut it down and helped kill the story, yet speculated the journalists found other reasons not to run the item. for her part, maggie haberman said we don t talk about source but i have lost the thread of what the mayor is talking about. yet in his third and final interview yesterday. it was like a trilogy. guilliani rambled on and out without much follow-up at all. he backed off his flatout denials that senior trump aides discussed the russian s offer in an earlier meeting. there was another meeting that has been leaked but hasn t been public yet. okay. that was a meeting, an alleged meeting three days before according to cohen or according to the leak. he says it was a meeting with
donald jr., with jared kushner, with paul manafort, with gates and possibly two others in which they out of the presence of the president discussed meeting with the russians. we checked with their lawyers, the ones we could check with, which was four of the six. that meeting never, ever took place. it didn t happen. there s no there s no second meeting here? it is highly unlikely. i always have to leave the option open as a lawyer in case they come across something that really startles us or fills some of the things that we feel are important. what s he saying? what s he saying? run that clip again. actually, listen to the words. try and listen to exactly what he is saying. i was trying. what is he saying here? well, we ll hear it. let s look at it again. maybe it will make sense. here we go. there s no second meeting here? it is highly unlikely. i always have to leave the
option open as a lawyer in case they come across with something that really startles us or feels some of the things we feel are important. another round. i think willie can translate. what a journey. a friend of mine, my drinks are free. rudy guilliani is debating himself. yeah, he is debating himself. so in the morning on cnn, he raised the idea of the second meeting. that came out of the blue to a lot of people. they said, what second meeting? he put that on the table, he says to preempt a new york times story we haven t seen yet and maggie haberman says, i don t know what he s talking about. then 12 hours later on fox news he s shooting town the idea he raised earlier on cnn. it is all in his he was killing a story he single-handedly brought to life. none of us were talking about the story. he s talking about the story. he says, again, we shoot it down just in case we don t know about
something they know whether they the it or not, mike. it is just like donald trump lying about adoption, getting everybody together on air force one to cover up the real meaning of the don jr. meeting, which don jr. said his father didn t know about. got a little perjury issue there if, in fact, we find out that donald trump all of these people say it is no big deal if donald trump knew about the meeting, it is a big deal for don jr. because he committed perjury if that s the case. but, you know, it is just like trump lying about that meeting means that something went on in that meeting that they wanted to hide, and now you ve got rudy saying, well, but, you know, we re not going to say it didn t happen because we don t know if it did or not. well, yeah, they do know whether it happened or not. this is both incredibly taxing and incredibly tedious to have this put upon us this early in the day. i mean he begins one of those segments by talking about a meeting that took place, and in
the very same segment, in the very same 30-second clip we played he goes from there was a meeting that occurred that we wanted to get out to get ahead of the news on, and ten seconds later he is calling it an alleged meeting as if the meeting he just referred to didn t take place. i mean what time of night was he interviewed for that, that s my question? i don t know. there s that question. it is a good one. some of the worst of rudy guilliani i think i have ever seen. we need some glamour. come on, let s get some good shots of the guy. by the way, what is he doing with his ring. i have seen it for a couple of weeks. he is pulling at it or something. heidi, do we need to play it again? do you have any idea what he was saying and what would you follow-up have been had you interviewed him. i think we can play even more, because not only did he confirm a meeting none of us were talking about but he actually fleshed out some of the details in those meetings, which was that apparently michael cohen may have been in donald trump s office when don jr. came and said, hey, we re about to
meet with the russians, so he seemed to corroborate that. that s not good, is it? he also put gates potentially in the preplanning meeting, which would be huge if true, since as we all know gates rick gates, who is paul manafort s business partner, has been cooperating with the special counsel for several months, which means we don t have to rely just on michael cohen for this information, that rick gates may have confirmed it and mueller may have known about it for a long time. but the bottom line is that what we re seeing here is that the number of conspiratorial meetings around the russians is increasing and so are the trump officials who participated in these meetings. coming up, when stormy daniels hit the headlines president trump was all about north korea. with michael cohen on the front pages, suddenly a meeting with iran sounds good to the president. we are going to talk about the
real impact of the vague proposals or deflections straight ahead. first, bill karins with a vague check on the forecast. bill. vague deflection, an excellent weather person. today is the last day in july and the peak of the hurricane season is august, september and october. so far, so good. knock on wood somewhere around here. i will show you the fire videos. this continues to be the story of the week, maybe the story of the summer out in california. still coming in from the carr fire, over 100,000 acres burned, there have been eight fatalities in california, two of them firefighters, and we have also seen hundreds of structures burned. that fire, by the way, is like 25% contained so they still have a lot of work to do. here is a look at the map that shows the fires. here is the big one, the ferguson fire in california, the mendocino and the carr fire near redding. this is all smoke, just horrible air quality. the temperatures, still continuing the soar. near carr fire, imagine being on the fire line putting out the fires, 103, 101 to 100 over the
next three days. in the east, the opposite. flash flood watches from winston-salem to atlanta. we will pick up significant rain in the next couple of days, through friday as much as two, three, four inches. aisles lated areas on have five inches. for flooding, most concerned with the north georgia area. minneapolis looks great. dallas, we ll take 90. that s 100 times better than the 110 you had only a couple of days ago. new york city one much the spots, you ve been dodging the rain tropes so far. i think wednesday after will be the first shot of thunderstorms. you re watching morning joe. we will be right back. the fact is, there are over ninety-six hundred roads named park in the u.s. it s america s most popular street name. but allstate agents know that s where the similarity stops. if you re on park street in reno, nevada, the high winds of the washoe zephyr could damage your siding.
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chair is accused of hiding at least $30 million that he made before his days with trump as an unregistered foreign lobbyist for ukraine and its former pro-russian president many we are told the prosecution plans to call 35 witnesses including agents from the fbi, treasury department and irs to show how manafort allegedly stashed his wealth in overseas banks to avoid paying u.s. taxes. last week a member of robert mueller s team said he does not anticipate a government witness will, quote, utter the word russia touring the trial. but if manafort is convicted the special counsel could use it as leverage for him to talk about anything he knows pertaining to the trump campaign and russia. the trial is expected to last about three weeks. manafort also faces a separate trial on similar charges in washington in september. you know, it is interesting. when everything seems to collide with donald trump and things start going really bad
he deflects. he decides he s going the take a meeting with a group of tyrants. he did north korea. it is a playbook. it is a playbook. people made fun of us for saying it. with north korea at a particular time when stormy daniels was about to hit the front pages, he went there. now he is open to meetings with the iranians. i guess after this when he gets in trouble, i gesell talk ab guess he ll talk about meeting with the martians. let s take a look at the president. i would certainly meet with iran if they wanted to meet. i don t know if they re ready yet. they re having a hard time right now. but i ended the iran deal. it was a ridiculous deal. i to believe they will probably end up wanting to meet, and i m ready to meet any time they want to. and i don t do that from strength or from weakness. i think it is an appropriate thing to do. if we could work something out that s meaningful, not the waste
of paper that the other deal was, i would certainly be willing to meet. do you have preconditions for that meeting? no preconditions, no. if they want to meet, i ll meet, any time they want. any time they want. it is good for the country, good for them, good for us, and good for the world. no preconditions. if they want to meet, i ll meet. so the reason why we needed, the world needed to have someone at the meeting with vladimir putin and donald trump is because in the past week or so since helsinki donald trump has, one, sent a signal that he wants to lift sanctions on an oligarch who s close to close to vladimir putin that we just put on a couple of months ago. and, two, now he is talking ben from a position of weakness, wanting to meet with iran. it is a complete 180 turn. there s very little actually to explain that, richard, but there
is a playbook for donald trump. threaten to bomb a terror state, say you want to meet with a terrorist state, and state. are we going to see what happened in north korea happen with iran now? almost certainly not. if the administration were serious about meeting with iran, they would have done it before they unilaterally got out of the nuclear deal that, by the way, iran was complying with. what if putin asked him to reach out to iran? the other reason, the iranians want no part of it. they re not going to sit down with somebody the secretary of state the other day gave a big speech essentially calming for regime change. the administration is ratcheting up sanctions. again, they got out of the nuclear deal, after the president said he would meet without preconditions, the national security council under the secretary of state started issuing the preconditions on nuclear issues, on how they re
treating their own people. you can look at what we re saying about north korea all along and you have donald trump declaring victory with north korea, when we find out now more ways they re cheating and, in fact, their nuclear program is more dangerous today, u.s. intelligence officials tell us, than it was when donald trump first started negotiating with the north koreans. there s a front page story in the washington post that says after last week s story about the nuclear program, now we learn their intercontinental missile program is continuing. the only word i take exception with is cheating. we don t know if north korea is cheating? why? because we don t know what the united states and north korea agreed to. if you look at the commune caiq that came out of the singapore summit, it was like a swiss cheese but we have had two summits. donald trump said americans could sleep at night, nuclear weapons were no longer a problem with noerpt. we know that s a lie. we know that s a lie and nothing like that was
accomplished. again, we are seeing this pattern of summits where the promise is great. we don t really know what was agreed on, and then there s no it is wrong at both ends. there s no preparation and there s no follow-through, no engine, no caboose. coming up on morning joe , the president s firing off tweets this morning aimed at a political network that s been closely aligned with republicans, at least before donald trump was around. what a brewing feud with the koch brothers could mean for the up coming mid terms. morning joe is coming right back. we have got a problem. a few problems actually. we ve got aging roadways, aging power grids, .aging everything. we also have the age-old problem of bias in the workplace. really. never heard of it. the question is. who s going to fix all of this? an actor? probably not. but you know who can solve it? business.
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trade. i never sought their support because i don t need their money or bad ideas. they love my tax and regulation cuts, judicial picks and more. i made them richer. their network is highly overrated. i have beaten them at every turn. they want to protect their companies outside the u.s. from being taxed. i m for america first and the american worker, a puppet for no one. my god. except for vlad. two nice guys with bad ideas. make america great again. god. i don t know where to start. there s a lot there. jim, first of all, would support donald trump, would support the protectionism. they obsess over government spending. they want not balanced budgets but rational budgeting.
you ve got the biggest spending bills ever, trump going on the biggest trade war we ve been at since herbert hoover was president. you could go down the list. economically there s really no reason for charles koch or libertarian, in his case a classical liberal, to support donald trump, is there? no, you outlined what the koch network stands for and it is more traditional republican party topics, regulation, taxation. even immigration he is in a different place than the president. i think charles koch probably likes this tweet because one of the things that the koch network is trying to do is rebrand itself. they know how radioactive they are in politics. david koch has basically stepped back from all political operations. charles koch is now sort of the leader of that organization, probably happy to have this. but, again, i think he is definitely speaking for a distinct minority.
it is the republican party as we know it right now, but certainly speaks for what we thought republicans stood for pretrump. heidi, they ve always been very uncomfortable with some of the more hard-core republicans views on immigration. they ve always been concerned about exploding military budgets, pentagon budgets, and they ve always been concerned by protectionism. this was before trump, and i don t know that they had much of a choice but to do what they have done here if they want to stay true with what they believe in. by the way, donald trump can t make the kochs any more money than they already have or they already need. they never did like trump as you accurately point out. they didn t support him in 2016. they held out for quite a while and, yes, the issues range the gamut from the deficit spending to the muslim band.
charl koch w charles koch was on the record likening that to nazi-style racism. but here s the thing. mark short is tightly aligned with the koch network and he was right there in the white house as the legislative director, and they took away the crown jewel of their agenda, which was the tax cuts. so, surprise, surprise, now mark short is leaving. he s gone after the tax cuts have been enact, and i know personally from speaking with the kochs and the representatives that as early as january they started to become very uncomfortable. they started to pick up whiffs of the protectionism that was about to come with the tariffs and the trade wars and were very concerned about this. so they ve been kind of in this position for several months. it is not surprising that they would come out at this point, that they are comparing this to kind of depression-era tariffs and trade protectionism. but i do think this is
significant because, joe, so many sometimes we ve sat in this chair and talked about what is .that it is going to take for the republicans to kind of stand up to trump. well, all along it has been who behind them. it has been the donors threatening thm on the tax cuts for instance. the donors have outsize influence over a lot of the republican representatives, so i do think it is an important moment and a potential change in strategy that could, could show some fractures in the party just because the donors are so powerful in this party. still ahead, we ll talk about a new column that caught our eye. stephanie grace explains how throughout history only 19 officials have been impeached, yet somehow a group of republicans in congress think rod rosenstein deserves to be the 20th. steve scalise is now signing on to the idea. that s just ahead on morning joe.
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if you look at what mark meadows and jim jordan and devin nunes have been doing, they ve been fighting to get more information from the justice department and, frankly, it is mind boggling that justice won t comply. they ought to want to work with us to root out the bad apples, and if putting impeachment on the table is one more tool to get them to comply with the subpoenas from congress, we need to make sure they do their job and comply. if this came up for a vote, you would support them? you would vote yes? i would. house majority whip steve scalise speaking last week on fox news. political columnist for the new orleans advocate stephanie grace writes about scalise on a new piece entitled, on rosenstein impeachment, steve scalise crosses the line. stephanie joins us now. with us, professor of political science and director of international studies at stanford university, former u.s. ambassador to russia, michael
mcfaul. he s also an nbc news analyst. senior writer at the weekly standard john mccormick is with us as well. stephanie, why is this the line? first of all, i guess i would start you off there. how would you be able to explain in terms of someone like steve scalise would understand that this is incredibly dangerous? well, i mean the first thing that hit me on seeing that is the line that i was a little surprised to see him cross. i ve known steve ska lien for many years. he is very conservative. he is very much in line with the republican party. he is very much on the trump train, no question about that. but this is different. this is really, you know, for one thing breaking with the leadership, breaking with paul ryan who said, you know, really this is dangerous territory and really calling into question whether congress is going to where is the line?
you know, how far will congress go, the republican congress, to kind of help donald trump out in this situation? and it is interesting. i have been hearing from a lot of people who know steve scalise, like him, and they were they were disappointed. you know, the word that comes up sometimes is i thought he had more integrity than that. right. and it is a question that, you know, i might ask from my point of view, one might say, well, she she s on a different team so she s trying to fight for her side. but for republicans, for the party, why is this potentially i mean is there any scenario, stephanie, where this ends well? i mean it is hard to see where it ends at all. you know, when you look at impeachment, and you mentioned in the intro i looked back at how many people have been impeached in this country. obviously become. you know, the most recent one was a local judge from here in
the new orleans area, a federal judge who had a real trial before the senate. it was, you know, it was bribery, it was graft, it was sordid stuff but criminal behavior. that s what this is supposed to be. that s what impeachment is, and the trial you know, one thing i learned watching it is there are a bunch of senators who are former prosecutors because it was a trial, very much like what you would see in court. i cover louisiana politics so i have been in court a lot. i have watched a lot of trials of politicians. this is something totally different. rod rosenstein has not been accused of anything criminal certainly. it is a question of a difference between congress and the executive branch. to hear steve scalise basically say impeachment is a tool, it is how you get leverage, that just to me really defines it down to inappropriate level. not a lot of people have been impeached in history. john mccormick, so he would be number 20 if it were to actually
happen. the trump train, is this what it is? it is barrelling out of control or just going so fast that those who are on it are hunkering down, hanging on for dear life? yeah, you know, jack gold smith had a good piece in the weekly standard saying it is muddying the waters. there are even factual errors. they hold him accountable for not vetting the steele dossier when he didn t become doj until later. he said on tv, why would he impeach rosenstein, for what crimes? rosenstein is an executive branch employee. if he has done anything impeachable or even just not living up to his job, donald trump could fire him tomorrow. do you believe in the sincerity of the arguments from people like steve scalise, jim jordan, mark meadows of the freedom caucus that they re concerned that documents are
being withheld or is it an operation to protect the president? you know, i haven t talked to them directly to be honest. i think a lot is to protect the president. i think if you go point by point you could find some legitimacy to some of what they re saying, but a lot is just smoke. a lot is just muddying the water. ambassador mcfaul,tive top d topic. the president proposing in a joint news conference with the head of italy, meeting without preconditions with the head of iran. this is something that, as you know very well, barack obama was vilified for 11 years ago when he talked about it in a debate. what is your reaction to the president, who seems to say and actually says it out loud, it is a good thing to get along with people. it is better than the alternative, which is war? well, two things. first of all, yet it is another data point about how disconnected the president of the united states, the commander in chief, president trump is
from his entire trump administration that works on national security. this happens time and time again where there s one policy by the administration and he seems to be kind of ad libbing, said something different. secretary pompeo said there were all kinds of preconditions, and he pops off and says, i ll meet with anybody. the second thing though is another part of his philosophy that i think is fundamentally flawed when it comes to diplomacy. he thinks that having meetings is the goal of diplomacy, whether it is kim jong-un and the singapore summit, vladimir putin and the helsinki summit and now maybe mr. rouhani and the dubai summit. i don t know where they re going to meet and they re not going to meet because the iranians do not want to meet. but he confuses that as the goal. instead, normally democrats and republican presidents alike as well as other leaders look at summits as the means to achieve american national security
objectives. and in this instance i have no idea what american national security objective he s seeking to achieve by saying that. we know from that helsinki summit in my opinion, the actual summit was bad for american national skur national security interests. we don t know everything that was talked about, but what we do know about including me, by the way, we do know that was talked about. i think it was bad for america. so time to get everybody on the same team and understand the purposes of summits. so, john and rick, you ve got singapore. you ve got helsinki. you now have the potential of the president going to tehran, two guys in a room in three different spots in the world. you have steve scalise coming out favoring impeachment in order to curry favor with the president. what does this say to us about the level of fire among the base of republican party politicians,
specifically in the house? are they so afraid of crossing this man or saying anything adverse to this man s policies that we hear relatively nothing from them? i don t know if it is fear or true loyalty for some of them, but i mean they re all in. they re all on board. if you look at any of the reecet examples you gave about helsinki or kim jong-un, the republicans would have been screaming bloody murder if barack obama said kim jong-un loves his people or if he gave legitimacy to vladimir putin. if you look at the polls, 90% of the republican party is on board with donald trump and these things haven t dented that support. most members of congress are not we call them leaders but they re not leaders, they re followers, and joe as well. if you can articulate why you oppose certain policies to your constituency, they will listen
to you but they won t do it. they re afraid that all of these trump voters are just going to turn against them so they won t take it on. sometimes you got to say, look, i m going to say what is right and if i lose my seat, i lose my seat. that should be the conservative position anyway. mr. ambassador, it has gotten ridiculous. you have a leader in the republican party, in the republican house who is actively working to help hide you know, cover vladimir putin s footprints in the 2016 election. when steve scalise signs on to impeach rod rosenstein, he is no longer just helping donald trump. if you look at the indictments that came down a few fridays ago, he is helping cover up vladimir putin s interference in american democracy, isn t he? it is incredible. i got to say it is incredible. we have been talking about this for two years. the russians violated our sovereignty, right?
aren t they supposed to be about america first? aren t they supposed to be protecting our borders? well, our cyber borders were violated. we now have overwhelming evidence. we have indictments on gru military officers and yet for some reason our america first patriots won t stand up and defend america. i don t understand it. this is not democrats and republicans, folks. this is america sovereignty being violated. it is hard i mean i work on national security. i don t work on domestic politic goes. this is a national security issue. never in history has it happened and yet people don t want to stand up and defend our sovereignty. you re talking about republicans, members of the republican party, and there is we began this segment talking about steve scalise and this position of potentially impeaching rosenstein. it is incredible. i think that when you hear someone like ambassador michael
mcfaul talking about this, given the way he has served our country and the experience he has, we should be frightened at this point. i don t understand why more people aren t stepping up. i don t get it. well, it is not that they re just not stepping up people in the white house. they re actively, actively signing on to bills to cover up vladimir putin s attempt to undermine american democracy. that s not hyperbole. how many russians have been indicted now? 25. 25. you have 25 russians indicted. you have the united states military and the united states intel services saying, this is a member of the gru that was at this building, these are the key strokes they made at this exact time. this is how they infiltrated the dnc. this is the russian agent that did it.
i mean the evidence i mean vladimir putin s dna is all over this. by the way as i always say, you could go into any court and get judicial notice of that. when steve scalice signs on to actually try to stop this investigation, by firing the guy and impeaching the guy that actually is allowing it to move forward, you ve got a guy, steve scalice, and by extension, anyone who does not condemn him, who is doing the work of an ex-kgb agent who is trying to undermine american democracy. am i overselling this? no, you are right. who s connected together. trump is saying this is a win hunt. steve scalice agrees by signing on to, frankly, embarrassing impeachment document, he s saying these 25 indictments against russians. against russians, that that s the witch hunt. he s defending the gru. he s defending the gru
against the united states military. the professionals at ft. meade. the professional also in the intel community. so let me connect something else. if the president is willing to pay off important stars, playboy models to keep quiet, what do you think else he would be willing to be compromised on? ambassador michael mcfaul, thank you. thank you both very much for your reporting as well. president trump weighs in on the next dangerous chapter in america s gun debate. that s next on morning joe. it s what this country is made of. but right now, our bond is fraying. how do we get back to us ? the y fills the gaps. and bridges our divides. donate to your local y today.
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president trump tweeted this morning, quote, i m looking into 3-d plastic guns being sold to the public. already spoke to nra, doesn t seem to make much sense. senate minority leader chuck schumer responded saying, quote, your administration approved this. what kind of incompetence and dangerous governing is this? and to check with the nra? holy moly. attorneys from eight states and the district of columbia have sued the trump administration to stop the company, the texas company, from publishing the blueprints. senator nelson of florida says he plans to file legislation today to block the blueprints from being released. and that s another example of the president playing with the truth by tweeting out something that s very misleading. or he clearly doesn t it could be that he just doesn t know because he doesn t think. his administration approves the plan. i think there s more. yes. i think at this point we need to look at his behavior as strateg
strategic. now to the ongoing crisis of migrant children and families separated at the border. the washington post has highlighted the dire conditions those children faced in one illinois shelter, including reports of children forced to scrub toilets with their bare hands and of a 10-year-old being denied medical attention after breaking his arm. joining us now, immigration attorney jeff goldman who successfully advocated for the reunion of of two boys ages 9 and 10 from that shelter with their parents after a federal judge ordered the government to release them. they are the first known reunions by judges order in the country. thank you so much for being on. so the status of the remaining children, how many are there? what are the continued conditions that they live in? what do you know? mika, there s still hundreds that have not been reunified with their families. we know about 460 of them may never find their families because the parents have been already removed and deported to
their home country. leaving the children here. i think at the end of the day, most of them will be reunified with the parents. i think they ll have to do dna tests. this is going to cost the federal government millions of dollars to try to reunify all of these children. i think the taxpayers are paying and paying for nothing. this never needed to happen. so who pays to transport these children to various parts of the country? who pays to maintain these children on a daily basis in those various parts of the country? for the the two boys i helped get release from the facility in chicago, the federal government was ordered to pay for the reunification, for the flights, but we decided not to wait. we had some donors who were offering private money to fly the boys immediately to be reunified and we choose that route instead. there s been word the federal government is going to have to reimburse people who paid for these flights. we don t know.
we don t really care. we just wanted to get the kids back with the mother. you have rare inside information of the process. how you identified these two boys and how you got them back to their parents. i think a lot of people would like to see what you were able to do for hundreds of other kids. we were contacted by one of the mothers. she called my law firm directly and said she was given our phone number by someone who said we could help. once we understood this is a parent whose child had been taken out of her arms at the border, we were able to sit down, focus, and went into action. shed an that point did know where her child was. it s actually remarkable. the government released her after ten days in jail, left her without any knowledge of where her child was but another woman who she met in prison was able to find her child and she called and said i think you re client is in chicago because my friend has met a friend called joco.
we got in touch with the highest level of people in chicago. the federal government farms out these key tensidetention center private contractors. we called, they said we re not releasing him. we said, the mother s right here, she s able to take the child back. no, we re not releasing him. why not? the federal government could not let these contractors release the children. the federal government, after a very well-planned chaos, that they created, decided to let s call these 2,000 children orphans. therefore, parents would have to go through extensive back ground security checks not just of the parents but of anyone the parent knows or lives with. which is ridiculous when the parent is standing at the government s door asking for the child. what did they tell you about their time when they were being held? just routine. they did attend classes. they had time to play. one of my clients was left in solitary confinement for two weeks, unable to touch or
communicate or talk to anyone because he broke out with a rash which the doctor at the facility said was chicken pox. it wasn t chicken pox. this child already had chicken pox. and they ended up injecting him with something to hopefully help this rash, without a parent s permission, of course the child didn t know what was happening. my two clients absolutely were forced to scrub toilets without gloves on, sweep the floors. these were 9 year old boys. i can t imagine the legal ramifications and potential out of all these stories. child abuse. i don t even know what that s incredible. many of the children were told if you don t do this, you re not going to see your parents. that s child abuse. absolutely. what would we say of if this is how if they forced 8 year olds, 9 year olds to scrub toilets, oh, my god, it would be an international scandal. joe, just a month ago, our country spent i don t know how

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Transcripts For MSNBCW The Rachel Maddow Show 20180802 01:00:00


up 10 points. that has now evaporated. interesting to see who turns out, a testament to the excitement level. thank you all. that is all for this evening. the rachel maddow show starts right now with ari in for rachel. good evening. rachel has the night off. we have a pretty big show. today was day two of the federal criminal trial of the campaign chairman. the witnesses were several people who sold the defendant clothes and houses that he bought through secretive international wire payments. one important thing we learned from what happened today, this judge is holding mueller s prosecutors to the line, limiting their questions and how they present key evidence to manafort to the jury. a former prosecutor who tried these kinds of cases and inside that courtroom today joins me to explain if what the judge is up to could hurt mueller s case.
there are reports tonight about the russian woman charged with trying to carry out the government influence campaign through the nra in the u.s. and people who appear to have been her american co-conspirators. that is a big story. but we begin with something far more troubling than any of that. it began last march. let s set the scene. donald trump had been in office just six weeks and his national security advisor was already out. it was march 1st, they exposed jeff sessions participated in two encounters with the russian ambassador during the campaign, a ways away from session s own testimony at his own confirmation committee that he hadn t had quote communications with the russians. we now know internally at the
doj there was a process going of career lawyers recommending jeff sessions recuse himself from the probe, he had an obligation on that. this was a key inflection point. jeff sessions could have taken the doj guidance to recuse and could have also ignored it, a decision to make and donald trump at that moment could have stayed out of it or at least in the public realm. here s what happened. the next day, march 2nd, trump had this very big grand appearance arriving via helicopter on the uss gerald ford, the navy s very new and expensive warship. trump spoke to sailors there. the traveling press corps for this big fancy appearance were with trump. watch this key moment. this was one of those unpredictable, you could seen say random times you see this normally routine even frustrating job of the traveling
reporters see it become pivotal, potential criminal evidence. watch reporters ask trump whether jeff sessions recusal because he was too close to the trump campaign should happen. mr. president, should sessions recuse himself from investigations of the campaign in russia? i don t think so at all. when do you think sessions spoke to the russian ambassador? when were you aware he spoke to the russian ambassador? i wasn t aware. that was a quick but pivotal moment. trump did two things, he inappropriately pressured sessions not to recuse and if you listen closely he contributed to the doj s argument for sessions recusal. because the doj standard for this is whether a person is too close to the subject of the probe, whether jeff sessions would basically be more of a trump campaign surrogate who happened to be attorney general rather than acting as a law enforcement officer.
Rachel Maddow takes a look at the day s top political news stories.
the probe remains open. that is just what we know based on what is in public and is leaked. one more thing as you take it all together. there is another reason donald trump may be writing things about sessions that look self-incriminating on twitter, have his own lawyers saying they aren t what they are. this requires you to entertain the believe the president is more canny than clueless. donald trump s team uses donald trump s past efforts to squeeze and oust jeff sessions. mueller s case may already have strong evidence of that, provable evidence. so knowing that it looks bad, donald trump may want to re-up the worst parts of this himself and say, how bad can it be if it s what i just tweeted? i turn now to a reporter leading much of our knowledge about this, investigative reporter for the washington post, and she
has a new story tonight on the muumuu ler interview offer to trump, essential to all of this. thank you for being here on a busy night for you. glad to be here. thanks for the good questions you guys always ask. it s been a roller coaster of a day. i think that s fair to say. there s some theme parks open well into the evening. we may still be on the roller coaster at this moment. walk us through what you learned of mueller s counter offer for a potential trump interview and why do you think he s willing to limit some questions? i m told mueller s team presents a counter-proposal in this 7 month-long investigation for them to interview the president that the president obstructed justice or sought to thwart a criminal probe. in this counter-proposal, what
lawyers, i need to know whether or not the president had corrupt intent when he took some of the actions that he took, most importantly, firing fbi director, jim comey. he wants the president in the room with him one way or another. the second seems to me likely possibility about this counter offer is he wants to show he s willing to negotiate a little and not be stoic and stubborn. so this is a little move closer to trump s request or the trump legal team s request, but i even hear within the sources close to the president and in the white house, that they re not so sure mueller moved that far, but he certainly made the effort to appear he was reducing some of the questions. do you have any hints whether he is prepared to go to the
supreme court if trump won t sit down and how do you do that and when do you trigger that? one thing we know very clearly he has given the trump legal team, he would like to avoid a subpoena fight. there are all sorts of good reasons. he knows that will take months. very little chance the court of appeals certainly involved on the road to the supreme court would move with any and the question never been answered, can you force the president to the table to talk about acts as president. if there is one thing we know as well, mueller has gathered a lot of evidence. he s interviewed a ton of people and pressed in his questions he hinted at to the trump legal team what he s interested in.
obstruction is a central piece what he wants to get to the president. you say obstruction. that brings us to the most damning and obvious question many of us watching would like your view on. why do you think donald trump wrote something on the internet that was so plate tently self-incriminating about obstruction into this case that is an investigation into obstruction. so blatantly. two things, i agree with the prosecutors i spent a lot of time in federal courts. i agree any statement you make that suggests you re threatening or intimidating or encouraging a course of action is not a crime but certainly goes to a state of mind and could be part of the mosaic laying out, arguing, the president was really signaling to tens of millions of people, this is what he wanted.
it s not a crime but builds the color around the state of mind of the actor, the president. the second thing is why did he tweet? the president has shown a talent for sending a message early in the morning, either about his anger or about the topic he wants all of us to be talking about. in this instance, i believe he s been watching a lot of coverage of paul manafort s trial. obviously, we re not live inside that trial but he s watching the cable news minute by minute updates and he wants to send a signal about how he feels this is wrong. it could be just a signal to his base and nothing more. you said it was a mosaic of sorts. i wonder whether it s a self-portrait titled evidence of obstruction, given how blatant it was.
carol, we appreciate you being here and your nuance. and asserting collusion is not a crime, he read aloud from the u.s. code the actual statutes that would be broken if there was collusion with russia and election interference certainly adds to the public record, senator. i want to start with your view of what donald trump wrote on the internet today is evidence of potential obstruction. it s certainly evidence, ari, of his state of mind, how he views the ongoing mueller investigation and what he thinks should happen. he s saying this morning jeff sessions should shut down the mueller investigation he calls a rigged witch hunt a number of commentators said this evening that could be entered into evidence what his state of mind has been. i ll remind you, this goes back to his lester holt interview following the firing of james
comey, when he said he had the russia investigation in mind when he fired jim comey, the former fbi director. i think there s abundant evidence obstruction and intent to interfere with the ongoing investigation whether or not russia committed some conspiracy with the trump campaign in order to violate our federal election laws. that s been out there in plain view now for months. my answer why president trump did that this morning is a combination appealing to his base and delegitimizing the mueller investigation and he can t help himself. can t help himself. his lawyer said it was come from the top and didn t do what it did. sometimes it feels like we re all going through a type of law school together in this era. you would be one of our voluntary professor, i suppose.
collusion, conspiracy, criminal hacking and theft, fraud against the united states, foreign campaign contributions, those are all felonies that relate to what has been alleged in 2016. walk us through your point about what crimes constitute collusion. first, the term collusion is being used casually. it s a conspiracy to break federal election laws. the federal election law, tite 52 of the u.s. code, says it is a crime to solicit or accept a thing of value from a foreign national in order to influence a federal election. i m summarizing what is a much longer paragraph. essentially, that s what it says, a foreign national can t contribute either money or thing of value and an american can t solicit or receive a thing of value from a foreign national in connection with a federal election.
that s the crux of what s being investigated here whether the russian well documented wide scale russian effort by dozens of russian military officers to influence the american election and offer hacked e-mails was in some way either solicited on accepted by the trump campaign team. that s why i think the developments in recent days, michael cohen may be willing to testify president trump knew about the june 9th trump tower meeting with russians offering dirt on hillary clinton could be a key turning point here. there s lots of public evidence of enthusiasm by the highest levels of the trump campaign to accept derogatory information of hillary clinton and her campaign and information robert mueller made of indictments and russian efforts to influence the outcome of the campaign. what is missing is what connects
point a to point b to make it a conspiracy and that may well be what robert mueller is trying to present. lying to investigators is also a federal offense. sometimes things said on twitter, whether by donald trump jr. or paul manafort or others, what really ends up being the thing that hangs them up, testifying to a committee or fbi investigator one way and proving the facts are the opposite. i think those are the three core issues here. violating a federal election law and working to break the laws, which is conspiracy and lying to investigators. most of the indictments that have so far come out from the mueller investigation move along one of those three tracks. i expect we will be seeing more indictments in the future. to paraphrase, they were right to say collusion is not a crime, collusion is like four crimes.
that s right. what we are commonly referring to as collusion is a complex series of violations of federal election law, truthfulness to investigators and commonly known of conspiracy 183 c 71, working with more than one person to break federal law, simple conspiracy. senator chris coons, a member of the senate judiciary committee, an expert on this. i appreciate you. and we have the former federal prosecutor in the courtroom today in just a moment. let your perfect drive come together at the lincoln summer invitation sales event. get 0% apr on select 2018 lincoln models
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in this courtroom believed the law did not apply to him, not tax laws, not banking laws, this man collected over $60 million for his work in a european country called ukraine. this man didn t want to use all his income and used foreign countries to funnel. the judge interrupted, the evidence you say will show this? yes, your honor. the prosecutor tried to continue to say, to funnel millions of dollars. the judge said, did you hear what i said? then we get a more typical response, yes, your honor. the court said, all right. do it that way, please. ellis did press both sides and told manafort s lawyer they must speak of evidence and not claims that. in terms of quote, you will hear
evidence that dot dot dot dot. right out of the gate that has been the issue. judge ellis didn t mellow out at all. at one point he scolded them to rein in their facial expressions. it s been reported that lawyers leaving the bench roll their eyes, communicating essentially why do we have to put up with this idiot judge. don t do that. obviously, if i see that i might be upset. you can see that running a courtroom at times is no different than dealing with your average teenager, at least from this judge s point. the judge is trying to trim the sales of these aggressive lawyers including mueller s aggressive prosecutors. the court saying oligarchky is just despotic power exercised by
someone and principals of high schools are that. saying he was being paid by people who are themselves criminals. the name, oligarch has a majoritive meaning. he told them, look, find another term to use. almost immediately, not being able to say the word, oligarch, kind of like a banana peel for the prosecution, i ll read to you again what we re learning from this big trial, the payments were made on behalf of mr.ian nokovic, i would say oligarch but by the wealthy businessman. the judge wanted to know who paid that money? and he said, those are the oligarches. those are the individuals that financed it, don t use that term and what good lawyers say, understood. and now a matter whether the prosecutors can use photographs
of manafort s very expensive suits as evidence. grand names basically greek to this judge. ica can t recognize these names. if it doesn t say men s warehouse, i don t know it. that got something of a laugh in his courtroom and then this did not. these pictures of manafort s very fancy suits may never get to the jury. the big curveball came when the judge started questioning other evidence pertaining to rick gates, mueller s former deputy they got to cooperate. it has the potential to be the most riveting part of this trial and maybe the whole prosecution at this point because we re talking about the deputy campaign manager for donald trump who flipped. look at this. judge ellis says, quote, you will offer up mr. gate, aren t you? mueller s prosecutor say, your honor, we re not sure if we are. he may testify in this case, your honor, he may not.
that is one of those things that sounds very measured, we may do this, we may not but has big repercussions what we will hear out of this case. why would the prosecution be considering not putting what is described as their star witness on the stand? a good question. i will be joined by someone at the trial today and also covering as politico s correspondent, covering the trial since the beginning. i put that question to you. whether gates will testify. interesting moment in the trial. a sudden hush in the courtroom and sudden scurrying in the courtroom when a number of people ran out the back. judge ellis himself said, that s a surprise to me and apparently about 25 other people out of the courtroom who just ran out like rats from a sinking ship,
presumably reporters who would report back this statement. if you think about it they very well may not decide to call in rick gates. the case is coming in very well. it s primarily a paper case, which if you re a prosecutor is a dream. paper doesn t lie or forget or admit to biases. if you can prove your case, you may not need a live witness who can go sideways in a lot of ways. sounds like they re playing it in a lot of ways and may end up not calling rick gates if they don t need to and presents potential risks. a good trial lit gator has no ego or attachment, just wants to win. have they found manafort s defense lawyer has been effective enough they want to keep this option open? they were non-committal to
be. as long as they re on your list you may call them but you don t have to call all of them. when you do call a witness, you re required to turn over all their prior statements on the subject matter and turn over anything that could be used to attack their credibility, like the plea deal, anything bad he has admitted to, any statements he made about the russia matter. it may be prosecutors would rather hold that foreclose to the vest for now and save him as a witness in the washington, d.c. trial in september. if they can get through this one on paper and save him, i think they can view that as a good thing. they can make that call next week and see how the case has come in and decide whether to call him at all. josh, walk us through a little more color of the reading rainbow segment that was just a few quotes. did you ever see eye rolling and how pivotal is this judge? i think some of the eye rolling may have come through the jury selection process when
we had very long sidebars. the judge does seem to really be riding the prosecution. there wouldn t be any reason to be riding the defense because the defense at the moment is just putting in a few congratulati cross-examination questions. it s the prosecution s ball on this side of the field at this point. the judge is limiting the amount of evidence i think the defense might view as prejudicial. as you mentioned, the issues of photo, ostrich jacket and home renovations very expensive. the photos of all the suits, of all the other luxury goods manafort used money to buy that he said came from his work in ukraine. the judge is trying to keep this to facts and figures, to the invoices, the paper. let me draw you out on that.
the criticism of the mueller view is they re trying to make manafort like he had fancy coats and fancy brands. legally, that s not the problem and unfair and all they have to prove is tax evasion. do you think the judge is hitting that right and fairly? i think he is, although he does bring it up a lot. i d say roughly hour or two he makes a comment about manafort is not on trial for being rich or having a lavish lifestyle or extravagant tastes and prosecutors often agree with the judge but insist they need to show the value of these luxury goods that manafort was getting them to convince jurors his tax returns could not cover the lifestyle he was living in addition to proving this point of the very very strange payment arrangements. nearly every vendor that came up said they were paid by overseas wire transfers from shell
companies whose names they never heard of or only got from manafort and today we had forged invoices, a couple saying they were being shown invoices with their name at the top of the letter head but not authentic and somebody forged those as part of the process of getting these shell questions paid overseas. honestly, it sounds exhausting to be that shady all the time. we don t always relate to what they re accused of. we have one more note, manafort has those expensive tastes. that includes, we will show you, a $15,000 ostrich coat, josh just mentioned it. we want you to see it. you re not a juror so you have every right to see it. we submit it to you without comment.
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moved, it happened last minute over where the public is not permitted there so protesters couldn t get as close. when they got the word the meeting was moved, protesters marched at the hart center where hemed with senator boozman. they got louder, blocking the halls shouting, hell, no, kavanaugh. dozens were arrested. 74 people arrested and charged, the counts around crowding or obstructing because you can t interfere with the gathering places there. when disability rights activist bar kin was wheeled in, he was cheered by the protesters. the battle is in early stages. democratic senators mostly saying they will not meet with kavanaugh. they want documents of his time serving as bush s time in the
white house. they will not say when the confirmation hearings will start but does say they re not likely to september which is getting close to the mid-terms themselves. if today is any indication what s to come, there could be a lot more bumps on that road. there
bounty picks up messes quicker and is 2x more absorbent than the leading ordinary brand. ahoy! (laughing) bounty, the quicker picker upper. big news when the trump campaign announced the deal. at the time trump was campaigning he was insisting he had no deals with russia. another scoop where negotiations with trump tower and moscow were far more extensive and lasted longer than previously reported and went into june 2016, after trump became the nominee, and
negotiations conducted by michael cohen with plans for trump to make a mid-campaign trip to moscow, a great idea and another bombshell that relates to collusion, even before mueller was appointed special counsel, fbi agents learned trump was in frequent contact with foreign individuals about trump moscow and that some of these individuals had knowledge of or played a role in 2016 election meddling. that would be a big headline all on its own if we didn t have so many other things happening. just one exhibit in collusion issues around trump. now, this team is back with a new scoop. this one is about the accused spy, maria butina of acting as an agent accusing her of a covert influence with the nra and other conservatives and that she was aided by two persons from the u.s., paul erickson who
had a relationship with butina and the second one is george o neill jr., a rockefeller heir and worked on the pat buchanan campaign in 92 with erickson. details are piling up about butina s alleged influence campaign financed by support from the russian billionaire and with deep ties to the russian presidential administration and the word you can t use in the trial, the oligarch s son. and the senate today unanimously approved turning over that transcript, what she told them and details about the billionaire to prosecutors as well as the defense lawyer. buzzfeed is hot on the trail and they re reporting investigators are looking at $300,000 in these transactions by butina and erickson, which includes $90,000
sent to or from a russian bank. the transactions were first flagged by anti-fraud investigations at wells fargo in some cases found no economic business or lawful purpose to explain them. those records also handed over to the fbi. joining me now is one of those authors of those scoops, buzzfeed investigative reporter, anthony cormier. i guess i should start with, wow, there is a lot here. a lot going on. the $300,000, what does it mean? we know now this massive investigation is doing what they do, following the money. who is supporting miss butina in the u.s. and what she was doing with the funds while here and if anyone else was involved in what is alleged to be a grand conspiracy to influence figure is in the u.s. on russia s behalf. you say anyone else involved,
she and the others linked to putin on this sleeper cell or other dogs? both russian and american, i think, to we can say that that s what the fbi is sniffing around on. you are familiar with the term what happens in las vegas stays in las vegas? what happens online has not stayed online in this case. the midterm campaign hacking we re hearing about involving offline events. how much of this looks to you like bigger offline physical activity inside the united states and how does mueller view that? i will speon t speak for mr. mueller. but our sources tell us that
money has to go somewhere. this is cash. it moves. they want to know where it went. it is going to be difficult, right? when you deposit cash on the front end, it is hard to know where it came from. when you pull it out, it is difficult to know where it went. the fbi has a massive sweeping counter intelligence investigation and they are firmly going to get to the bottom of it. and being so hands on means what? it means you can make a beeline right to the kremlin if this all stands up, right? if the charges stick, if they do find where the money came from, where it went, it is going to be very difficult for the kremlin to say, we had no idea. final question, there is a lot of discussion about regulating finance and banks in america. is this story, which you report, begins with banks regulations and laws a sign that s a important part of regulating banks? absolutely. whether it s citi or wells
fargo, they are critical points where the fbi is able to go and full records. paper don t lie and the fbi is making paper to sort of make these cases. it is fascinating. and you have been doing a lot of reporting that we have been indebted to. customers bundle and save big, but now it s time to find my dream abode. -right away, i could tell his priorities were a little unorthodox. -keep going. stop. a little bit down. stop. back up again. is this adequate sunlight for a komodo dragon? -yeah. -sure, i want that discount on car insurance just for owning a home, but i m not compromising. -you re taking a shower? -water pressure s crucial, scott! it s like they say location, location, koi pond. -they don t say that.
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the political state of ohio has a 12 district right here. it has been reliably red. hasn t gone to a democrat for congress since run dmc was the top of the charts in the 80s. right now they don t have someone representing them because you have that big ohio shaped hole in the u.s. house. that s why we have a special election to fill that seat this coming tuesday. you can say the mid terms have already started. although, it is a special election. that has gone up like a flair for democrats. take a look at the latest poll. trailing by just one point. well within striking distance would be a huge shift, blue in the state. and democrats say this is not the only good piece of data they are getting right now. today over in texas, which is reliably red, the idea of a senator like ted cruz losing his seat to a democrat would seem
like a total fantasy, but there is this poll out of texas. the democrat running against ted cruz trailing now by 6 points. that is tight for texas. now, the race has an upset potential for democrats. the flip side if you follow the news or know in texas, everyone loves ted cruz. that s just an issue any time you run against him. having said that, there is a bat signal going on for the democrat party s biggest cheerleader, former president barack obama using today to release his list of endorsements for these midterms and trying to push some candidates over the finish line and chipping away at the republican majority in congress. it is now 97 days until the midterms, and this former president is choosing this as his moment to get back in the spotlight, saying he s eager to get back into politics. we re about to enter the sprint to november. make sure to stretch.
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Judge , Thing , Holding-mueller , Case , Hurt-mueller , Evidence , Questions , Prosecutor , Prosecutors , Courtroom , Cases , Line

Transcripts For FOXNEWSW Fox And Friends First 20180803 08:00:00


A precursor to Fox News s morning show, featuring the news and first looks at the other stories of the day.
in court today charged with attempted murder. he was out on bond for a weapons charge. put the man police a friend to shoot a congresswoman set to face a judge today. carlos is accused of leading voice mail for the majority whip and caffrey kathy mc mars rogers, they told him, quote, we are going to feed them led, make no mistake, you will pay. scalise nearly killed last year after a gunman opened fire at a republican baseball practice. jillian: donald from rallying the crowd in the keystone state out of his economic success, slamming his opponents and calling for a government shutdown. rob: drumming up support for lou barletta s senate bid. reporter: in classic form, in
maxine waters, very low iq. running against pocahontas or crazy bernie. i saw him up there the other day. that hair is getting wider and wider, he is getting crazier and crazier. reporter: the attack on the media was a centerpiece of the rally message. we are doing better in all of these states than we did on election night. despite only negative publicity, only negative stories from the fakers back there. reporter: donald trump surprised many when he won in 2016 which is why this race for the senate seat is a big prize this november. barletta trails by double digits. it will be an uphill climb but the president going back to the arena he has gone to in the past.
todd: pocahontas, crazy bernie is now sleeping bob. he loves the nicknames. donald trump using his rally to encourage voters to go to the polls in november as the partisan gap grows wider. the midterm elections offer the once forgotten men and women a chance to make their voices heard again. we have a chance for a historic election to give the american people and honest choice between a radical extremist democratic party and the progressive wing gradually being destroyed by radical extremists or they can try to appease the elites. if they run district by district campaign they blues the house. it is impossible in the modern era, rush limbaugh approved of it. 435 districts every day.
republicans are going to win the fight, when the argument, all the issues on their side but the question is do they have the courage. the midterms 95 days away. todd: mike pompeo with his counterpart overnight demanding an american pastor held captive be set free. the two speaking privately in singapore. pompeo is hopeful something will get done. pastor andrew brunson is facing terror-related charges while under house arrest, the white house is not budget and economic sanctions on turkey after they refused to release him. jillian: a newcomer claims victory in the gop primary for tennessee governor. bill leads beating out three republicans to get the nod. one of them congresswoman diane black was favored to win, karl dean in november. congresswoman marsha blackburn
easily winning the gop facing tennessee s former governor, democrat who won by a landslide. todd: 9 minutes after the hour. we are just hours from the july jobs report. american workers get their biggest pay raise in more than a decade. economist peter moricci with why trump s economy is bad news for the democrats in the midterms. you cannot say the press is not the enemy of the people. it is ironic that not only you in the media attack the president for his rhetoric. jillian: hot off the press, sarah sanders and jim acosta, how the fire exchange ended.
have no answers. america is winning again. last week we announced that the us economy grew 4.1% last quarter, nobody thought that was possible and if the democrats got in, that number would be 1.2, it could even turn negative. jillian: will the jobs report due out in just hours add to the president s successes? peter moricci joins me now. thank you for being here. what do you expect in the next few hours? 210,000 jobs which is in line with what we averaged the last several months with an expanding and growing economy. jillian: that is the number we have seen the last couple months, 213,000 jobs created in june 2018. do you expect this number to
plateau? we should not expect to see bigger numbers, and at that pace of growth, gradually getting people off the bench and that is people who weren t in the job market, who were really to start looking again. pulling a lot of minorities and disadvantaged people. people who might have a black mark on the record, people with criminal records, this is a very robust job market. people with some experience, opportunity to switch jobs and jillian: it is a nice number and you have critics out there saying american people are not seeing a difference. what do you say to the critics? what else are the democrats going to say?
donald trump has accomplished 45% better growth then democrats did. he is averaging 2.7% a year. barack obama averaged 1.8, 1.9. the record is stark. all they can do is make up fake news, that there is great unfairness in the country and every mainstream church wagging a newspaper in people s eyes, not just the media saying there is terrible unfairness in america. the reality is a lot of the raises are going to people at the bottom and people who didn t have opportunities before have opportunities. we are going to make it so you don t have to work. we give you guaranteed annual income. we have an economy where nobody works, borrow money from chinese and democrats will get elected that way. i don t think that is a winning formula. jillian: what do you think these numbers mean as we head into the
midterms? good news for the republicans. unfortunately the republicans don t always have the strongest candidates. in a special election coming up on tuesday, when things look dark for the republicans a lot of people bail. it was hard to recruit the kinds of candidates, now we are stuck with what we have got. democrats raising a lot more money, hollywood on their side and silicon valley on her side. and the rich and wealthy went to dupe the poor into keeping them in power. that report, we are standing by to see the numbers. todd: democrats testing a new method to win over voters for
the midterms, text messaging, that can work. jillian: kurt the cyber guy with the downside. are you ready to take your wifi to the next level?
it gives you super fast speeds for all your devices, provides the most wifi coverage for your home, and lets you control your network with the xfi app. it s the ultimate wifi experience. xfinity xfi, simple, easy, awesome. todd: 21 after the hour, democratic darling alexandria ocasio-cortez hits the city of angels but the socialist star ab too far left for hollywood liberals. according to the hollywood reporter she won t meet with any entertainment bigshot donors. she showed up to an occupy ice lunch. establishment democrats find her too extreme. she has a fundraiser with democratic socialists of america.
jillian: ocasio-cortez s victory causing a rise of democratic socialists on college campuses, young democratic socialists of america experiencing a 280% increase from 2016 from 2018. in the fall over 250 campuses registered for a chapter which is the most ever. todd: politicians looking to win over use of voters sending a text message that. todd: fighting that is a got texts and vented mailers donated to campaigns. voters only got mailers. todd: is there a downside to this political spam? let s bring in kurt the cyber guy. when we look at this closely it is a brilliant way for political campaigns to reach people not only for the vote but donations to their campaign.
a group of people have been using a similar way, instead of volunteers sitting around calling you and annoying you in the evening hours they will instead text you. hi, jillian, what is going on, who is this? at the end of the day it is much less annoying than getting a phone call according to people receiving this. what happened in tennessee, where it is being sent to the moon? never areas actors, badmouthing, doing political attacks against opponents. it is certainly not allowed. at this point you don t know who is behind it. jillian: there is the national do not call list, don t know if that works for text messages.
robot machine, vote for me because that would not be allowed. you are completely allowed to have an individual text you at a time so they created software applications that work for political campaigns, individually texting you. their databases so virtually everything including what nail color you have. we have that information out there, you may have offered it before to a political party. can i do anything to stop this? there is a little bit you can do. once you receive this, you can request as they call you please don t text me again. is a going to be effective? apparently not. the second go around they start to think about removing you from the list.
how to remove anybody who is bothering you by text. jillian: including people you know. todd: the final day. jillian: where can we find that? cyberguide.com. jillian: a new clue in the search were missing iowa student as the family of molly tibbetts refuses to give up hope. molly didn t go to work today. at that moment adrenaline shot through my body, something is terribly wrong. heather: disgrace will act calling stone from the grave of a fallen hero. carly shimkus with growing outrage from a goldstar mother. friday the all-american
summer concert series eating up, king and country ready to rock the plaza, stay where you are.
fox news alert, brand-new clue in the search for molly to its. a red shirt found near the pig farm investigators have been coming through. rob: the family of the missing college student not giving up hope just yet. we believe that molly is still alive. of someone has abducted her we are pleading with you to please release her. todd: that was molly s mother pleading for the return of her daughter who she believes is still around after disappearing two weeks ago. jillian: ted wilson sat down with her yesterday and joins us with that interview. what is the latest information that you know? reporter: i can tell you over my shoulder here is the command
center where local, state, and federal law enforcement officers will be converging in this area with one objective and that objective is to bring molly home. they have gotten quite a few clues, some of it they shared with us and hold close to their vests. i want to play some sound from your interview with molly s mom. i was quietly sitting in the public library and approximately 5:15 my youngest son scott called me and said molly didn t go to work today. at that moment adrenaline shot to my body, something is terribly wrong. law enforcement has been essential, crucial. i can t find the words to say what happened. how are you holding up?
through some kind of internal strength that is just there. todd: we heard how important hope is during this process, you are there with molly s mom. what did you see in her eyes when you spoke to her? reporter: i saw what i have seen thousands of times as an investigator over the years, someone clutching onto just a glimmer of hope that at some stage in the future they will be able to hug their loved one who is missing. molly s mother s eyes, my heart went out to her. jillian: all of america s heart goes out to their family. in your conversation with molly s mother, do they have any suspicions of their own what may have happened to their daughter?
reporter: some do and some don t. i mean some of her relatives have an idea, they believe she is somewhere abducted, that she is alive. they believe sooner or later the person who is holding her, that person will release molly award. take us through what happens of law enforcement identifies this. once they identified the suspect they will bring that person or persons in, look physically over that person because if there are any abrasions, in a fight with the person, and confiscates their
cell phones and bring them in, they will do what is done with a digital footprint and find out about the person s background. and confiscate their automobile. one of the most important things they do, and aspect of suspects to take a polygraph examination as part of the investigative process. jillian: the number to call if you know anything no matter how small you think the detail maybe you can call the sheriff at 641-623-5679. thank you very much. reporter: the pleasure. jillian: an exclusive look at the military gear and personal items returned with us marines from north korea, helmets,
campaign buttons, from the korean war, caskets recently handed over to the us. also found, this dog tag. it will be given to the fallen soldiers two sons at arlington, virginia. the remains being tested in hawaii after mike pence accepted them on wednesday. todd: sarah huckabee sanders flipping the script on reporters during a fiery exchange in the white house briefing room. the president is rightfully frustrated. 90% of the coverage on him is negative despite the fact the economy is booming, isis is on the run and american leadership is being reasserted around the world. you did not say that the press is not the memory enemy of the people. personal attacks without any content other than anger. the media has attacked me personally on a number of occasions including her own
network, harassed, that i should be choked. todd: jim acosta tweeting that he walked out of the briefing room in protest. mark live in slamming the press corps. the dc press corps today is the least professional press corps of my lifetime. they think that their job is to make it impossible for the president to function. as long as they keep putting clowns like jim acosta out there who is a drama queen of sorts, the reaction of the american people. todd: live-in says the press needs to take a look at itself but it won t. as anti-trump rhetoric rams up eric trump is shining a light on how his family has been a target. i have been threatened, we have had white power show up in our house. there is no moral outrage about that but when it happens to them, when they are offended by a message.
todd: vanessa trump was hospitalized after opening a suspicious letter with a white powdery substance addressed to her ex-husband donald trump junior. jillian: hundreds of protesters fed up with gun violence take to the streets of chicago. the march shutting down a major highway during rush hour, demonstrators sending a loud and clear message to democratic mayor rahm emanuel, make changes or resign. 16 shots covered up. we are praying today, the mayor and city council, do something different. jillian: gianna caldwell is on the ground with the protestant will join us live in the next hour. todd: democrats blasted by their own party over their efforts to impeach the president. not a single person in the
senate democratic caucus has shown the common sense or the sense of right and wrong to support impeachment. jillian: carly shimkus with serious xm 115 with reaction to those comments. reporter: tom stier made his money on wall street, he is a billionaire who became an environmentalist and is founder of a campaign aimed at impeaching donald trump. you heard him calling out members of the democratic establishment who have not backed his campaign but conservatives on social media are responding to his comments, when twitter user rights goes to show you common sense is not needed to become a billionaire. another rights you actually have to commit a crime to be impeached. nora on twitter writing sorry but not liking him is not a valid reason for impeachment. stier pledged $40 million in his business campaign to impeach donald trump. todd: it is about having grounds
on which to impeach. really unfortunate situation in massachusetts. the mother of a fallen soldier said thieves have been stealing coins people are leaving on her son s graveyard. take a listen. it just makes me, it makes me sick to think that someone could do that. the mother noticed the coins were missing a couple weeks ago. it is a tradition for people who knew a fallen soldier to leave money on their gravestone. a lot of people on social media sympathizing with this family. i never heard of this tradition but love it. how dare people steal the coins, so much disrespect, such a beautiful young man he was and another twitter user rights there is no accounting for scum who would violate the grave.
jillian: 3 girls on horseback going viral. 3 girls in california came up with a unique way to thank firefighters and first responders battling the car wildfire. they are riding past the command center on horseback carrying american flags and a sign it says thank you. it listed their spirits and people in social media responding to this, one twitter user rights that is the country i grew up in and we have to get back to and another twitter user says my hometown, proud of those girls, a simple thank you in a unique way. jillian: i will not get on horseback to say thank you. 39 after the hour, 17 years after 9/11 airplanes are a real target for terrorists. terrorists want to bring down
aircraft. they still see aviation as the crown jewel target. jillian: why in the world with the tsa cut security screenings at airports across the country? jim hansen, an expert in hunting extremists, joins us with why he says this could be catastrophic. rob: this video showing a dramatic car rescue, americans help officers. the weather across the country. not a hero the hero in the morning sky - in a crossfit gym, we re really engaged
upload your logo or start your design today at customink.com. booklet, travelers, tsa weighing a new plan to stop security screenings at 150 airports nationwide. jillian: critics worry it will or terrorists to those airports. john kelly has this morning.
reporter: terrorists want to bring down aircraft to disrupt their economy, undermine our way of life and it works. which is why they still see aviation as the crown jewels target. jillian: joining us with reaction his former us army special forces conducting counterterrorism operations, jim hansen. thank you for joining us. i want to hear what you have to think of this was we were stunned yesterday when we heard it. reporter: it does not seem like a wise move. as secretary kelly said the terrorists have always focused on aircraft. if you can knock an airplane out of the sky or as on 9/11 use them as weapons you create a very normal fear for people. there is something completely not quite right about putting a couple hundred humans in a tube and hurdling them through the sky. we all have a rational fear of that.
i have jumped out of them at the same altitude, but the terrorists know that puts fear in us and disrupting that and our air travel system causes massive disruption to people and businesses. it is a great target and we need to keep our eye on it. todd: you can t put a price on human life but for arguments sake, say they came back and said this will save us $100 billion. then there might be a little more of an argument here. $115 million annually. that is nothing compared to the scope of what we pay at airports and how much the federal government has. this is insanity. you can make the case there are plenty of other targets. a terrorist in nice, france, killed 87 people and wounded 450
with a cargo truck. it is not like they don t have other ways to do it but this is the one they focus on. this is the one that given a choice they will do. the idea of saying smaller airports if we go ahead and leave them a little bit foldable they won t go there but the 9/11 hijackers focused on an airport in portland, maine based on the assumption that security at smaller airports would be less. they proved the fallacy in that thinking. tsa needs to accept the fact that we either protect all our airports or none because knocking a plane with 50 people out of the sky is not much less bad than knocking one out with a couple hundred. jillian: a statement from the tsa says, quote, there have been no decisions to illuminate passenger screening at any federalized us airport. you brought up a good point when you were talking about what happened in nice. we saw terror play out in many aspects since 9/11, vehicles on multiple occasions, a lot of
shootings, concert venues targeted. just because we are seeing other factors of terrorism doesn t mean you start getting lacks at the airports. i don t think this is the place to make cuts especially for budgetary reasons. let s go ahead and if we are going to secure our air travel system we have to secure it on this go in through the weakest spot and weakest links in the chain. secure it all and look at procedures that are ridiculous at some of the checkpoints but no reason to stop screening luggage or other things. if they sneak a bomb on a plane anywhere in the united states on the us aircraft or anywhere else on the world especially our own us travelers that will cause a massive disruption and we can t let them. todd: thank you for adding a little sense to a senseless argument.
heather: falling into a fountain while texting isn t bad enough, one town once you to pay with cold hard cash. todd: one homeowner mrs. amazon prime. who let the dogs out who let the dogs out who let the dogs out who let the dogs out it s great when you see a hundred orders come in, a hundred orders come in, but then you realize i ve got a hundred orders i have to ship out. shipstation streamlined that wh the order data, the weights of , everything is seamlessly put into shipstation, so when we print the shipping ll everything s pretty much done. it s so much easier so now, we re ready, bring on t. shipstation. the number one ch of online sellers. go to shipstation.com/tv and get two months free.
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at the site of you todd: if you do want free food you can come to the plaza later today. 14 and country will be performing the. jillian: best corn muffins i ever had. amazing. my first line is do you want free food? get a job. donald trump urging lawmakers to work together to put the rule in the farm bill. the president tweeting when house and senate meet on the farm bill, hopefully they will be able to leave work provisions approved. the senate should go to 51 votes. the current farm bill ends next month. todd: promise you won t laugh at this. this woman so distracted by her phone she falls into a fountain. california wants to ban people from using the phones while crossing the street. people who cover both ears with
headphones, violators could be punished with a $500 honolulu became the first major american city. with a similar law. jillian: sometimes it is insane. no one is paying attention. pay attention to this. stores closing their doors for good. todd: tracy carrasco is here to explain why. i found that one jillian: i like brookstone. you need to find another place to get chairs or high-tech gadgets. they filed for chapter 11 bankruptcy. they will be closing all mall locations, about 100 of them. they hope to keep 35 of their airport locations open but this is all due to declining foot traffic at malls, more people shopping online. another victim of the retail ice age.
jillian: they have the softest blankets. reporter: i have a blanket from brookstone. todd: some big guinness news. reporter: the first guinness brewery in the united states in 60 years is opening today just outside maryland. the guinness (worry, not going to be brewing the iconic stout, that is coming from dublin, ireland but they will be brewing the lacquer, they will have a visitor center, task force, you can take tours. this is opening up today, first time in several years. todd: the players are not getting in. reporter: you can taste the imported beer from ireland. they are not doing that iconic status. time for the good, the bad and the ugly. a lot on the line to pool a man
from a burning car. first responders pooling the unconscious driver out. he crashed in southern california. jillian: a teenager tried to steal a plane to go to a rock concert, the 18-year-old found bike security arkansas city in the cockpit of an american eagle jet but he doesn t know how to fly. heather: caught red pod, a company named savage seen on surveillance video stealing and amazon package. it was not the only thing savage swiped. he took a pair of prescription sunglasses and a garden hose nozzle the owner did not realize. jillian: all right. chicago protesters outraged over
rising gun violence instead of democratic leadership. not everyone believes chicago is a trump freezone. i accept his help. we can t turn any help away. todd: born and raised in the windy city, joins us live with reaction in the next hour of fox and friends first .

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