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case -- thank you so much for being. here you said and many that you believed that it would be embarrassing, a disaster, and fundamentally on courageous for donald trump to refuse to debate. do you still feel that way tonight? >> well, look if he refuses to debate through the entire debate season, i have an issue with that. i have no issue with him skipping the first couple of debates. the truth is, many people in this country did not even know who i was six months ago. this is a good opportunity for me to introduce myself to the country. he's been a the debate stage countless, times he's also been a u.s. president for four years. if you want to skip the first couple of, them i have no issue with that. i do think he should be on the debate stage at some points. throughout the course of this year. that's why math. >> you rarely, if ever really criticize trump directly. i think part of that, tell me that is a strategy when it comes to winning over his voters. how do you beat the republican front runner in this race without directly engaging him? >> the truth, is the reason i