several westerners included three americans, journalist james foley and stevenñi sotloff and aid worker peter kassig. >> this guy was a human animal and killing him is making the world a better place. >> col. stephen warren in baghdad said the pentagon is reasonably certain emwazi was killed last night by a drone near raqqah, sir. i can't he was born in kuwait but grew up in london where he became radicalized and left for syria at 18. critics argued it's doing far too little to fight i.s.i.s. but today white house spokesman josi earnest used the targeting of emwazi to push back. >> i think it is clear we are making progress in an element of strategy which is to apply pressure to the i.s.i.l leadership. >> james foley's father john saw things differently. >> bombing him won't bring jim back or change the war. we need to eliminate i.s.i.s., not "jihadi john," okay? >> pelleyokay. >> rose: we continue with dexterñi filkins. >> rierk as a state and a -- iraq as a state and nation is broken and they're trying to hold things together andeth not clear they want it more than we do. that's the fundamental problem, who wants to die for iraq? it's hard to find iraqis who want to do that. who want to fight nor i.s.i.s. and shiites who want to fight for the shiite militias, but who wants to die for iraq? also klaus schwab, the chairman of the forum forumñi which takes place in switzerland in january. >> today we live in an interconnected world and whatever you do in an socioeconomic, political sphere, it is in some way related and that will shape your contextual intelligence. >> rose: and we conclude with a conversation about the new movie "shelter" starring jennifer connelly and anthony mackie and directed by paul bettany. >> there was a homeless couple who lived outside our apartment in tribeca, and we saw them every day and said hello to them and they said hello to our children. i'm ashamed to say that they sort of became invisible to me. their poverty became more and more acceptable somehow and i stopped being able to see them and they disappeared, actually, before they really disappeared, and hurricane sandy happened and they really weren't there any more and i felt a lot of shame surrounding that and thought i might like to write about them, but i didn't know them. i thought actually maybe that's a really interesting way with which to discuss judgment, because i do think that our eresponse to homelessness is puzzling. >> rose: the war in iraq, a conversation with klaus schwab and the new movie "shelter," when we continue. >> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: american express. >> rose: additional funding provided by: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: with me now is dexter filkins of the "new yorker" magazine. he has reported extensively from the region and i am pleased to have him back at this table. welcome. >> thank you. >> rose: you wrote extensively about the kurds in the "new yorker" magazine piece i read. what is it about them that made them a model in terms of the democracy of their government and how they run the government in terms of the efficiency of the government and their effectiveness as a fighting force? >> well, i think, in fighting, they have a lot of practice. you know, they have been fighting -- they were fighting saddam for years, you know. and then i think -- but these two things are related. i think the main reason their government is as strong as it is and as efficient and open as it is is because, you know, it's been going now for almost 20 years. you know, the united states first essentially liberated the kurds in the first gulf war in 1991, and they basically have been autonomous since then, and 1991 is essentially the birth of the kurdish government such as it is, the autonomous region. so they have been at it a long time and they've had to protect that area and fight for it, and it's very ethnically homogeneous there. so they had a big head start on everybody else. >> rose: okay. there is been a lot of support from american airstrikes. >> yes. >> rose: more so than coalition because it is said -- >> everybody's dropping out. >> rose: -- everybody's dropping out. >> yes. >> rose: so it's really america from the air and the kurds on the ground. >> that's it, yeah. >> rose: are you reasonably sure from all the contacts you know they would not want to take mosul because they see all the danger you're pointing out? >> i think that's our impression. i think the americans would love it if they would. >> rose: and the iraqis would love it if they would. >> yeah. you know, look, maybe they will be persuaded to do it, but, you know, if you look back to last year when i.s.i.s. swept into mosul and western iraq, it was -- you know, the iraqi army, tens of thousands of iraqi soldiers were garrisoned in mosul and, you know, when i.s.i.s. just walked in. i mean, the iraqi army disintegrated. the problem is -- >> rose: they fled. yeah, they threw off the uniforms and ran. so the problem is -- >> rose: has there been any change in that? everybody talks about there is the political question, obviously it's worse than when the previous iraqi government was in power, the my lacke mal y have to rally the sunnis in order to have a chance. >> they have to rally the sunnis, but that hasn't happened yet. >> rose: because. they're not sure the sunni government will win or they will be inclusive. despite all the airstrikes and operations they've done, i.s.i.s. still have ramadi, the capital of anbar province, they still have fallujah. the whole area around the euphrates river is in the hands of i.s.i.s. and up the tigris they have mosul. so they're doing pretty well. conversely, the iraqi army is not. what the government has come to rely on is not the iraqi army, it's shiite militias, iranian trained and backed. iters a mess. >> rose: we've had some ratcheting up by the united states. >> yes. >> rose: would it be effective? >> i doubted it. i think the news this week was, apart from this offensive by the kurds, was that president obama had decided to send 50 special forces guys to the kurdish region of -- >> rose: but on the front lines or simply support at the front? >> i think they're going to be doing a lot of support. but 50 guys? they'll be able to do a lot and i think they will be able to do stuff like coordinate the airstrikes so they will be a lot more effective, but they're hoping the kurds will push out a little bit more, but that's not -- 50 troops is not -- >> rose: so what do you know about the russian effectiveness in syria? >> oh, man. i mean, you know, one of the first thing the russian jets did that were there were bomb some of the very groups that the united states has been supporting. >> rose: cra c.i.a. yeah, that the c.i.a. has been supporting, so it's a tangled mess there. the reason the russians went in and so quickly was to save assad. >> rose: they said that to me. yeah, said they thought he was in danger. >> rose: there's a plan circulating at the u.n. and they want to have some kind of negotiation. most people don't perceive a great love affair on the part of the russians and vladimir putin and bashar al-assad. >> you know this better than i do, but i think they're very wary of each other and i think the feeling is putin fears, i think more than anything, a collapse of the state in syria and the jihadis, you know, taking over the state and, you know, more russian muslims going in to fight. but i don't think he feels anything in his heart for assad. >> rose: so, therefore, he is seemingly circulating some kind of political election that would take place in a year or so? >> i guess. it's hard to imagine right now -- >> rose: elections in syria? yeah, it's hard to imagine any kind of political settlement right now given the situation on the battlefield. but i guess you could sort of imagine at some point that you could have a government of some sort, probably a coalition, be assad. >> rose: a government that would be satisfying to all sides including the iranians? >> yes, and the iranians, i think, are much more inclined to support assad himself and the alawites in syria than putin is. i don't see that happening for some time. >> rose: i don't know what the word defeat means in this case, but my question is have you seen any, because of your long involvement in the region and in iraq, especially, have you seen any plan that you think will lead to a significant decline in i.s.i.s.? >> no, i don't. i mean, look, i don't -- i don't see the political will in the obama administration. i mean -- >> rose: we're doing about as much as we're going to do? >> yeah, there is only so much you can do from the air and there is only so much you can do from the air without people on the ground. >> rose: the former head of special forces was here and pretty much was advocating american troops on the ground to get the job done because he thought the stakes were that high. >> that's a political decision. i think military people have said to me that the airstrikes themselves would be a lot more effective if you could have people on the ground. so the people on the ground could say they look at a building and they would be able to say, there are civilians in the building -- >> rose: but there is a military sense we've got to have people on the ground if we're going to be really successful? >> yes. >> rose: and they're not coming from the other arab states? >> clearly not. they're dropping out. >> rose: they're dropping out. qatar and the u.a., they haven't done airstrikes in months. >> rose: and the saudis are focused on yemen? >> yeah, they're focused on yemen. that's chaos as well. so it's hard for me to see a change in the status quo there. >> rose: so, therefore, this question. we're looking at some success on the battleground in sinjar. >> yes. >> rose: but you're suggesting not mosul. my question is, you know, what are we looking at over the long term? >> well, i think in iraq, i think the situation in iraq is not -- i mean, certainly for the kurds, i think it's okay. i think once they're able -- >> rose: okay, but if i.s.i.s. still controls territory between syria and iraq -- >> yes. >> rose: -- they have some kind of caliphate there, don't they? >> they do. >> rose: we can't live with that, can we? >> look, i think the fundamental problem here in both of those states, syria and iraq, is that they're artificial so there is nothing -- >> rose: they were created artificially so there is no reason for them to survive? >> yeah, people don't want to die for iraq. iraq as a state and a nation is broken so, you know, we're trying to hold these things together and it's not clear, you know, that they want moirt than we do -- more than we do, and i think that's the fundamental problem here is who wants to die for iraq? and it's hard to find iraqis who want to do that. you can find kurds, you can find sunnis who want to fight for i.s.i.s. and shiites who want to fight for the shiite militia but who wants to die for iraq? >> rose: thank you. thank you. >> rose: dexter filkins with the "new yorker" magazine. back in a moment. stay with us. >> rose: klaus schwab is here, founder and executive chairman of the world economic forum. holders conferences with global leaders all over the world including the closely watched gathering in dabo, switzerland, in january. schwab created the forum with the theme of improving the world. they will focus this year on mastering the fourth industrial revolution referring to the digital transformation that will have profound effects on economies, societies and human behavior. i am pleased to have klaus schwab back at this table. welcome. >> great to be back. >> rose: you started this in 7'72? >> $71. i was a proffer and i had written a book on the multi-stakeholder complex and that means businesses should not only have shareholders but they should have a stake in the business. i felt they should meet. in the mean time, it has developed, and today i'm proud to say we have become the official international organization for public-private -- >> rose: official, that means you have been designated as such? >> we have been designated by the swiss government. we are similar to the international red cross or olympic committee. >> rose: how many meetings each year? >> the meetings play an important role and w have five or six meetings. >> rose: china? china. what is really -- i mean, if i look at my 700 colleagues in the room, we are mainly engaged now in task forces in working groups where we bring together governments, business and civil society to address specific issues of the global agenda. >> rose: and they are big themes. i'll talk about this year's theme but they're big themes. >> for example, we are working together with the french government and preparing the paris conference on the environment in december. wwe are very much engaged in the sustaining development goals together with the u.n. >> rose: how has it changed? it changed very much in terms of business today feeling itself -- hopefully, our wish and intention, as a stakeholder of the global commons to provide global goods, to integrate business in the solution of the big challenges which we have in the world. >> rose: i noticed that from what i do. i was just out at apple doing a series of piece force 60sments "60 minutes" on cbs about apple. they clearly have a sense that not only are they creating great products and not only do the products they create play a role in society, they do, but there is a larger sense they have of we want to change the world. >> yes, you have to show that you deserve the trust of your customers, of your employees. today, people have become very sophisticated. you have to show that you are really committed to society. >> rose: not only that. i mean, they're doing it on issues of sustainability and the environment and a whole other range of things, but there is a sense, it seems to me, that they recognize that corporations in the private sector, you know, have two things -- one, they have resources -- >> yeah. >> rose: -- they have talent and resources and money and lots of other things. many who are like the scale of governments. but they have resources. secondly, you know, they have found that they can work in combination with the public sector and universities to create bigger goals. >> of course. today's big issue is whatever you take can only be addressed in corporations between the public and private sector because the if you go to the root causes, you have to create conditions in those countries which keeps the people at home. >> rose: right. so this concept of working together, of partnership is now very well organized. i think it was the major change in the last years related to our -- >> rose: the recognition by corporation -- >> the recognition by corporation of the need to engage together with government, civil society, interjoined efforts. >> rose: you now say you want to talk about in this year's conference in january mastering the fourth industrial revolution. >> when we look at the world today, we see governments and even business very much engaged in mastering today. if you look into the future, there is so much going on in technology, it's a real revolution and our lives, the pattern of governing societies will be so much affectedder, what's going on on research and innovation and we're not sufficiently prepared for it. look at the discussion on data, it shows how difficult it is to find the necessary norms. >> rose: look at things like artificial intelligence and and robots. >> exactly. >> rose: look at gene editing. exactly. >> rose: open ago whole new horizon for medical science. >> and you see the difference of the forced industrial revolution is it doesn't change what you are doing, it changes you. if you take genetic editing just as an example, it's you who are changed and, of course, this has a big impact on your identity. >> rose: and all of a sudden, all kinds of possibilities that have to be careful about, you know, when you began to do that kind of gene editing, some people worry that you're changing what it means to be human. >> that's the problem. >> rose: yeah. of course. the new industrial revolution offers us many opportunities that it raises many of the questions on the ethical but even legal implications, and we have to be prepared for it. and first what you want to do and that was next year. >> rose: the reason people come is because subjects are interesting, let's say, and you have there the leading people in a variety of fields, both private and public, who come. thirdly, it seems to me that there is within that short time period of a week an opportunity to cross-fertilize with a whole range of people in one place that you cannot easily duplicate. >> that's all true, but i would add one other mention, that is to look at the global agenda at all the issues which we have in an integrated way. >> rose: the contribution of everybody and how they relate? >> yeah, and you have usually conferences or meetings related to one specific issue. >> rose: right. but today we live in an interconnected world, and whatever you do socially, economic, political sphere is in some way interrelated, and that will shape your -- i will call it, shape your contextual intelligence. >> rose: when you talk about technology and the ways it can be deployed that contribute to growth rather nan exacerbate unemployment, how will that implement itself? >> it's a big question mark because there is a fear that technology, robots, just to take one -- >> rose: machines. -- exactly, and it replaces maybe the workforce or new shops. but i think the question for governments and business alike and society will be how do we rescale and upscale people to keep pace with what's going on in terms of technology around us. >> rose: this is also going to affect the whole national security arena. >> yeah, if we look at, say, fighting robots. if we look at so many -- >> rose: the battlefields. it's a big change. we surpassed what we called asymmetry, which means with very small means you can do great damage. >> rose: asymmetrical warfare. yeah. >> rose: and clearly what is on their minds and the most intense subject between china and the united states now even more than the islands is the idea of cyberespionage and cyber warfare and the possibility of taking down someone's electronic grid. >> exactly. i think we had first cyber espionage, then cyber stealing. >> rose: right. now the issue is to implant some malware, as we call it, into a system which you can, at a given moment, put into operation. >> rose: obviously the iranians caught the brunt of that when it happened with their nuclear project. >> probably, yes. and this is just an expression of the big threat which the new technological evolution characterizes. but even more opportunities, and we have to make sure that we concentrate on using the opportunities, because practically every issue in the world can also be solved, disease and environment, by the new technologies which are now developed. >> rose: it is amazing people talk about a cure to cancer and even blindness and a whole range of things. they see them as within reach because to have the technology, because of all the developments in stem cell. it's really remarkable what people can now imagine, have the tools to imagine. >> ewe did a poll and among quite a variety of people and more than 50% of the people said it will be possible in the next ten years to three-dimensional print human organs. >> rose: it's amazing. we'll talk about -- as you talk about these kinds of evolutions in this fourth revolution, there is also going to be a need for new governmental structure, new rules, new regulations, the whole new structure to comprehend the possibilities that are being unleashed. >> the problem is that governments have a different pace in terms of how they approach change compared to business. what is very important is governments, it is said in business, have become agile and even have to go in the direction what i would call agile norm setting, agile legislation, which means we have to have an ongoing cooperation between government agencies, parliaments and so on and the business community to bring the standards of norms and legislation always to the latest levels of tech logical developments. >> rose: let's talk about these four things. you said the fourth revolution is different from the previous ones in the following ways: first, speed. >> yes. look how long it took uber -- >> rose: to become a $50 billion company with tentacles everywhere around the world. >> yes. >> rose: and a disruptive technology, too. >> it's disruptive, it has velocity, and the new technological revolution is, in principal, not a revolution of new products and services, it's a systems revolution. the whole system is changed. >> rose: exactly. the ecosystem changes. you said the second reason is that it is not related to one area. >> yeah. you have usually a combination. look at brain research. i mean, brain research, as we have it today, would not be possible without the progress in the information technology. >> rose: and the third which is one you've already mentioned, the third difference that separates the fourth revolution is beyond speed and not related to one area, it is, as you said, not about a single product but about systems. >> exactly. airbnb,ist , it's a systems revolution, not a new product. >> rose: it's a shared economy. >> it's a shared economy. it's completely new conditions for the economy. >> rose: so you have been doing this since 1972. how long will you want to do it? >> as long as i can serve the world and as long as i have the energy. >> rose: do you find today that the most powerful leaders in the world want to come to talk about who they are, what they believe, you know? because you've had some famous fights as well. >> that's right. >> rose: and you've had famous people who are dramatically opposed to each other on the same stage, whether yasser arafat. >> erdogan. >> rose: erdogan walked off, as i remember. >> yeah. >> rose: attraction not for the people who come as guests but for the people who come as primary components, primary participants is what? >> i think, in the past, it needed power to tell politically to come. >> rose: right. today, the situation has changed because politicians, and i come back to the notion of public-private cooperation, they have big issues. they need the help. the old world is gone where the government can just execute. they need the support of the other components of society. >> rose: and you also make note of this -- with all the fast rates of change, at some point, people will not want to go to conferences anymore or need to. >> what we are doing is not anymore conference because it's built into our ongoing workforces. one demand people will have -- you can download all the knowledge which you want to have, but you go to a meeting to be part of a process. i think that's very important. and what we are trying now to do is also to integrate into this process the digital dimension, talking about the technology evolution or industrial revolution we ourselves, of course, have to learn what it means for us. >> rose: great to have you here. >> thank you very much. >> rose: klaus schwab of the world economic forum. back in a moment. stay with us. >> rose: "shelter" is a new film by paul bettany, it depicts the love story of two homeless people in new york. paul bettany's debut. here's the trailer for "shelter." >> this is new york. it's not a something for nothing town. >> i can't do that. nigerian, came on a visa. overstayed his welcome. >> there is no place i can get you both in. >> we can't be on the streets. no. we need something good. something good. >> i'm looking for my daughter hannah. >> this is jake. you have a child. he is alone. >> whwhat are you doing? are you? m i? i've made such a mess. (singing)çó >> you can have it all, hannah. >> rose: joining me the director and cast of the film, academy award winning actor jennifer connelly and anthony mackie. i'm pleased to have all of them at this table, welcome. >> thank you for having us. >> rose: this is your first directorial debut. >> yes. >> rose: tell me about passion for the film. where did it come from and why is it sort of a labor of love for you? >> well, a dear old friend of mine ron howard asked me why i hadn't directed a movie yet, and i said, well, i'm sort of waiting for the secret to get passed on. he said, what do you mean? i said, well, you know, the director's secret you all have that you pass on. he said, paul, there is no secret. just make mistakes and get on with it. i decided i would want to and what i might want to make a film about. i was thinking i'm rather interested in judgment. the world i'm living in seems to be a world of increasing grey area and the culture i live in is more and more entrenched in black and white positions but i had no idea it would be about homelessness. and yet, at the same time as murk sandy was percolating, hurricane sandy hit and there was a homeless couple who lived outside our apartment in tribeca and we saw them every day on the school run, and said hello to them and they said, you know, hello to our children. i'm ashamed to say that they sort of became invisible to me there. their poverty became more and more acceptable somehow, and i stopped being able to see them and they disappeared, actually, before they really disappeared. and hurricane sandy happened and they really weren't there anymore, and i felt a lot of shame surrounding that and thought i might like to write about them, but i didn't know them. and then i thought, well, actually maybe that's a really interesting way in which to discuss judgment, because i do think that our response to homelessness is puzzling. >> rose: what do you mean by "judgment"? >> i mean that my feeling is that you look -- people look at a homeless person and they immediately come to a list of conclusions, all that absolved themselves of any blame or danger of finding themselves in those types of positions. my late father who just died, i have been thinking a lot about him, he's aer are religious man, i'm not. but he used to say a thing i find really beautiful he would say when we passed a homeless person, there but for the grace of god go i. and i love that sentiment. it has an admission of how precarious life is and how it could so easily be us. you know, so that's where it came from. >> rose: and there are deep levels of homelessness and poverty and also medical issues as well. >> absolutely. e all kinds of people that,re but for the grace of god, find themselves in. >> and there are all kinds of homeless that slipped by the wayside. last year in new york city we passed two milestones, first an apartment for $100 million sold, and 60,000 of new york's residents slept in the municipal shelter system every night. >> rose: how many? 60,000, 24,000 of them were children. tonight 19,000 of them will be women, over half of new york's homeless population are families. you know, that's going on in the town with more billionaires than any other city alone. and that's an untenable situation. we're all taught it's an intractable and insoluble situation and problem and it really isn't. you know, so you're right, there are all sorts of homeless. somebody's lost a family member, somebody lost a job, somebody has a mental illness, somebody has addiction problems, but who am i to judge, how simply and easily it could be me. >> rose: tell me about tahir? well, tahir became more complex than he originally was. when i first read the script, i was impressed by the level humanity and dignity paul put in the characters. here was an educated nigerian man who lost his family and, through that, joined boko haram and became, for lack of better terms, a terrorist. to get away from that, left his country and came to america and basically just tried to find asylum here. but he never truly got over the loss of his wife and his child who were killed and mutilated right in front of him. and he then realizes his solace, his safety, his ticketñr into heaven is this young, beautiful woman he comes across, hannah. and just realizes that, if he can save her, he can somehow possibly save himself. >> rose: and why does she need saving? >> well, hannah is -- when we meet her, she's a woman who -- she doesn't know how to be in this world, how to be in life anymore. she's not quite able to be here and yet she's not quite able to let go. she's tethered by something and later in the film we discover what or who it is, more accurately. and she is someone who experienced loss and tragedy in her life and turned to what i think is kind of an old habit which is a drug use. and i think an attempt to escape the pain she was feeling and of course it wound up creating so much more pain because ultimately she wound up doing things that she couldn't bear to sustain her habit. so lilt she made more of a mess. >> rose: and what's the relationship? >> he sees -- they meet because she's actually stolen his jacket. >> rose:ñi yeah, right. (laughter) >> so he was in prison for the night, we assume like in a drunk tank or something, and comes out and his stuff is gone in his allyway. he's sort of walking around trying to find, you know, some things for a place, things that were stolen and sees this woman wearing his jacket, his very recognizable jacket and starts following her, and then that's how it starts, and then sees something in her. i won't talk about what that may or may not be. it's the beginning of the relationship. at first, actually, she, i think, has decided she's going to try again to leave, which is to jump off the bridge, and he stops her. and she's furious at him but also it's the beginning of their love story. >> rose: so what happens when tahir finds out that she has a son? >> i think he's outraged in that he has a moment of judgment. i mean, just in addition to what we were talking about just earlier. before it was a story about homeless people. i knew i wanted to make a romance and i thought, well, if i want to make a film about judgment, what will it be like if i put two people together who are on paper just unforgivable, the things that they have done, unforgivable, but introduce them to you before you learn that about them as an audience. you fall in love with them, then reveal this thing to each other and the audience, and make you love them again and forgive them. so that was the sort of -- that was the sort of -- the idea. i think that for tahir, it's an unbearable idea. his child was ripped away from him. the very idea that this woman has chosen to leave her child alone is abhorrent to him. they're very much -- in almost a very real way, he is the person that took her husband away from her, or somebody very similar to him, which caused her to fall so slowly, you know. >> rose: take a look. this is a clip of them having dinner in a house in which they're squatting. here it is. >> i am barefoot. a man's shoes didn't fit. i found chicken. did you find chicken? >> i look like a zombie goldilocks. this is where i should say something. actually, don't say anything. >> i forgot how to speak for a second. you are more beautiful than i have wordsñi for. set the table. there are place mats and everything in there. >> rose: remarkable. they're having dinner. they also are bound in a sense, connect bid fate. >> yes. >> rose: she's an atheist, he's a muslim. what's the point? >> you know, i think it's an issue that has raged in me. i was raised a catholic. >> rose: how's that going? i'm a lapsed catholic. so it's going. you know, it's añi conversation that i have with myself, and i catch myself feeling slightly imperious sometimes with my notions of science. but when you're standing by a grave -- hmm -- with a loved one in it and you see people of faith who sort of -- their beliefñi rises like a lark above your sort of reason, and i think, who's the clever one here? but this whole sequence, this whole second act which takes place in a squatted apartment where i call the goldilocks act, and it came from an agent when i was talking about writing it as a homeless love story who said the agent will remain nameness, the agent -- nameless, the agent said, you can't make a romance about homeless people, no one wants to see them kiss. and i thought, what a repugnant and repulse everything to say, but let me hear it and let me put them in a place where these people live and dress and are living more like the sort of people that you might think you might want to see kiss. it's an amazing thought to me that the whole job is to try and humanize human beings as a source of shocking. >> rose: is this a political film? >> not at all. i think what's great about the movie for me is it finds beauty in all the tragedy. you know, people -- and i've always felt when i see homeless people or people in a desperate situation, i'm, like, man, their life must be so bad, how could you live like that in such a despairing situation foír so long, but then reading the script went into things i was entertained by and turned onto, the idea of finding beauty in the midst of madness. we all have bad days and times in the midst of our day, but we find our way out no matter what our surroundings are. i think it's not so much about politics as it is about the love and desire and need for people. >> rose: you said you don't like to see films where you're thrown into a place of despair and darkness. >> absolutely. i wani want resolution and hopei also want a cathartic and redemptive experience. the film isçó a little dark but how do you have redemption without dar darkness? >> rose: what do you think, jennifer? >> well, you know, he wants to go home,çó but he doesn't feel he's able to. there is something we needs to accomplish, he has a mission he needs to accomplish to redeem himself for the acts he's done, and hannah similarly does, too. she needs to learn how to love again and to open herself up and to forgive herself, and she's able to love again. >> rose:ñi found redemption in each other. >> yeah. truth is i need the money for my boyfriend, he's sick. >> no, i can't wire you money. i'm not using. i'm not using, dad. >> well, you've said that. i swear to god. it's been four months now. >> you've said this before, hannah. >> i know i have, and i know how it sounds, but i promise this time it's true. >> why did you lie to me about the tr >> he needs -- he's so sick, and i didn't think you would believe me, it costs $370. >> if he's that ill, you should take him to a hospital. >> we've been. look, dad, i know you shouldn't believe me, i know -- >> you're lying, sweetheart. please... and the simplest version of the film i had in my head when i started to write it is there is a man who is a ghost walking in new york city and he can't get to his family in heaven. he meets a girl who thinks she's a ghost but realizes she has something to live for. if he can get her home to her family, he can let go and go to heaven and, of course, you know, it takes a form of a story that is homeless. >> rose: this is your first -- did you want to go spend time at a homeless shelter? >> i did. after i made a decision that's what it was going to be about, i spent time with the coalition of the homeless. there are real-life angels on the streets of new york. they deliver food, provide advocacy, provide education, and they also provide an extraordinary summer camp for the children of homeless families to offer them some respite, and they vetted my script but also got me out on the street meeting homeless people. >> rose: this is real. yes, i was very intrigued about the last act i wanted to be hannah against the bureaucracy and i was really interested in finding out what bureaucracy is in place to stop a needy person from getting what they need because if you read the literature -- well, there are no homeless people and there are no needy people, if you read what is available to you. but there is absolutely bureaucracy in place, which is what we play on in the film. >> rose: marvel has been very good to both of you guys, hasn't it? >> yes, it has. no question. (laughter) >> yeah. >> rose: the gift that keeps on giving? >> right. i don't know about you, but it's the first time in my life that i know that i'm working in a year's time. >> right. (laughter) >> that is an amazing feeling to have security. i don't know how you feel, i always consider the job that i'm doing to be my last. i'm going to be discovered and i'll never work again. >> rose: people always say, i'm going to be discovered, they're going to find out about me and i'll never work again. you don't feel like that, do you? >> i don't ever know if it's good or not good. you know, i never know if i'm going to find another job that i want to do again that's -- >> rose: as much as you wanting to do -- >> i'm always knocking on wood. >> rose: did you fire yourself? thought you would play a role in this and then the director said no way? >> yes, i wouldn't perform the casting couch, so i had toçó fie myself. rather humiliating, actually. i pretended -- i wrote some scenes in the film to raise some paltry finance in my name, and two weeks out i cut the scene, and the financier was, like, what? that doesn't make sense. so we moved on without me hampering the narrative. (laughter) >> rose: have you started filming "american pastoral"? >> i just wrapped, actually is that who was it? >> it was great. i had a great time making it. i enjoyed telling the story. i liked the story. it was a lovely set. >> rose: the editor of the "new york times" was here last night and i guess there was a time he had been fired as the editor of the los angeles times and became the washington bureau chief and moved here to become editor and he said during that year he did nothing but read phillip roth novels, close to a year. he just wanted one subject he could get his head around, so he chose all these. phillip roth novels. >> one of the things i love in that novel is this notion of a narrator who is sort of unreliable and the ways in which we get each other wrong. at one point the narrator says we get each other wrong and we get each other wrong before we meet each other and continue to get each other wrong even in their presence and it's very much a paraphrase. but i think that's sort of a large part of what this is about, you know, the ways in which we make decisions about one another. and i think when we do that, you know, it's very easy to kind of put people into their little boxes, into their corners, and i think, you know, exploit each other and do all sorts of horrible things that hopefully we can do better toxd eradicate. >> i just finished an adaptation of the broadway show "all the way" for hbo where i5m playing martin luther king, jr. and brian cranston is playing lyndon b. johnson, so that was kind of an amazing -- >> rose: brya brian was justñ same thing. >> rose: about the passing of the voting rights act or something else? >> the eight months between the assassination ofçó kennedy and m being reelected president and martin martin, jr. and lyndon b. johnson working on getting the civiget votingrights act throug. >> rose: terrific. amazing. >> reporter: thank you for coming. >> thank you. for having us. >> rose: pleasure. "shelter" opens in theaters november 13th. thank you for joining us. see you next time. >> rose: for more about this program and earlier episodes, visit us online at pbs.org and charlierose.com. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org >> announcer: this is "nightly business report," with tyler mathisen and sue herera. terror in paris. multiple attacks leave more than three dozen dead in the french capital. we'll have a report and discuss these new destabilizing events. equities have their worst week since the summer. and oil falls toward $40 a barrel. we'll look at the week just passed and look ahead in light of tonight's development. and search for a treatment. the fate of two drugs and one mother's hope for her two sons. all that and more tonight on "nightly business report" for friday november 13th. good evening, everyone. paris is a city under siege tonight. multiple attacks involving gunfire and explosions across the french capital have left more than three dozen dead. the situation is