point." we're coming to you live this morning from center college here in danville, kentucky. things last night right here were pretty heated between the vice presidential candidates, no one had a bad night. nobody was too polite. instead joe biden, paul ryan, simply let it fly and when it was over the american people scored it a draw. cnn/orc poll of debate watchers showed that 48% felt that paul ryan won. 44% said that the vice president joe biden won. of course that would be a statistical tie when you calculate in the margin of error. we begin with cnn's dana bash with some of the highlights of the night. good morning. >> good morning. we were here. we watched it all. you really could feel the intensity of it from the beginning. all 90 minutes. it was very intense. there were some smiles and smirks on both sides. but all in all it was very substantive. these were two men who both came ready to tangle. >> world -- >> thank heavens -- >> reporter: on taxes. >> you can cut tax rates by 20% and still preserve this important preferences for middle class taxpayers. >> not mathematically possible. >> it is mathematically possible. >> on medicare. >> they just allo medicare to bargain for the cost of drugs like medicaid can, that would save $156 billion right off the bat. >> and it would deny seniors choices. >> all -- >> reporter: on the president's foreign policy. >> when we look weak our adversaries are much more willing to test us, they're more brazen in their attacks and our allies are less willing -- >> with all due respect that's a bunch of malarkey. >> reporter: the vice president appeared determined to make up for president obama's mistakes last week. almost immediately launching the attack lines obama never used in his debate. >> it shouldn't be surprising for a guy who says 47% of the american people are unwilling to take responsibility for their own lives. my neighbors, they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his fed cal income tax. >> reporter: before the debate, cnn was told paul ryan's team anticipated biden being aggressive where the president was not. especially on mitt romney's infamous 47% remark. >> mr. romney's a good man. >> reporter: ryan was ready with a well-practiced retort. >> with respect to that quote, i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. >> i always say what i mean. >> biden's recovery plan for a demoralized democratic base was not just in what he said but what he did. >> in spate of their opposition -- >> oh, gosh. >> the president was criticized for not interrupting. biden jumped in constantly. >> as a result of this -- >> it's not -- >> what we're saying. >> but -- >> mr. vice president. >> the president was slammed for nodding as romney spoke. >> biden used the split screen to give a running commentary of disapproval. with his facial expressions. ryan had a zinger ready for all that, too. >> i know you're under a lot of duress to make up for lost ground. but i think it will be better served if we don't keep interrupting each other. >> for 3409 minutes voters saw two dramatically different visions on the economy. >> the last people who need help are 120,000 families for another, another 500 billion dollar tax cut over the next ten years. >> our entire premise of these tax reform plans is to grow the economy, and create jobs. >> to national security threats like a nuclear iran. >> and if they get nuclear weapons, other people in the neighborhood will pursue their nuclear weapons, as well. >> war should always be the absolute last resort. >> reporter: for the most part it was a substantive debate between two longtime lawmakers who tried to disagree without being too disagreeable. >> when my friend talks about -- >> reporter: biden avoided any trade mark gaffes but did provide a little levity. >> this is a bunch of stuff. look, here's the deal -- >> what does that mean a bunch of stuff? >> well it means it's simply inaccurate. >> it's irish. >> we irish call it malarkey. >> okay. so much to talk about out of this debate. martha raddat zpchlt, i thought she was terrific. >> absolutely. if there was a winner, she was commanding. fee followed up when she needed to. she pressed them on specifics. >> she also l them go a little bit and had some arguing. >> perfect. >> you know, if you went on twitter, as i did, after and said that i thought it was a draw, people on both sides completely hammered me because there was a sense joe biden's people thought joe biden won. paul ryan's people thought paul ryan definitively won. when end of the day they're appealing to the middle. >> there's so few undecideds at this point that that is a big reason, we're told, why joe biden did what he did. because the democratic base was really deflated, demoralized, after the president didn't deliver from their perspective. that's why he was frankly in many ways over the top. in some ways that's who he is. it's why he did what he did. if you talk about what happened in the spin room afterwards, that was the big debate. was he disrespectful for joe being joe? >> you won't be surprised to hear that both sides went into full spin mode in that spin room, that conversation happened. you can listen to both people immediately afterwards talk about how their candidate won the debate. everything was under the microscope, including ryan's level of experience, and joe biden's interruptions, and his facial expressions, as dana just said. here's a little listen. >> i think congressman ryan was out of his depth, and showed clearly that the ticket is not ready for prime-time on foreign policy. i think that was a decisive difference between the two sides. >> i thought it was a great nice for us. i was excited for paul. he was solid. he had a command of the issues. quite frankly i was embarrassed for the vice president. i mean the laughs. we counted 82 times that joe biden interrupted paul ryan. >> if the only criticism comes from the right and from some folks out there is that he smiled too much, i'll take that any day. my father was enjoying the opportunity to debate congressman ryan on a very important issues. >> not exactly a surprise that there was spin from the spin room. we want to get right to democratic congressman chris von hollen of maryland. he played paul ryan in the vice president's debate prep. you were the guy who was responsible to push the vice president. when you watched it actually unfold in real life, how do you think it went? >> i thought the vice president did a great job. look, joe biden is a fighter for the middle class. he's passionate about these issues. that came through. and he also marshaled the facts tohow that the romney/ryan plan would be really bad for the middle class. so i think all in all he was a great debate for the american people, and the choice is clear today. >> i think they did a good job in sort of delineating their two very different positions and both campaigns have said this is going to be about two very different pathways. lots of criticism, though, from the -- for people who watch joe biden, said that they thought his facial expressions, the eye rolling, the laughing, some thought it was disrespectful. >> well, i would disagree. i think joe biden is passionate about the middle class issues. and you can feel his emotion. he speaks from the heart. and there were times that paul ryan said things that, as the vice president said, were just malarkey. normal people react to those kind of things. so, look, i know some republicans want to focus on style but what was important was the substance. what the vice president did was show that the romney/ryan tax plan at the end of the day will not help the middle class. it will help the very wealthy. he made it clear that their voucher plan for medicare will pass additional costs on to seniors, and again hurt seniors who have a median income of $23,000. i thought he did a really good job clarifying the choice. >> you know, "the washington post" said, it felt to us like he, talking about joe biden, went a little bit overboard and at times bordered on bullying riden. smiles and laughs while rying tried to answer questions weren't great optics for the vice president and his repeated intersupgss won't make those who think politics should be more civil happy. if it's not just about energizing your base. certainly people were like my guy won on both sides but it's about this sort of undecided middle isn't there a risk in being what i think some people thought was you know disrespectful. or at least -- >> i think that the vice president, his passion came through. he cares about these issues. as for undecided voters, the cnn poll was of all viewers, but cbs did a poll specifically of undecided voters who were watching the debate, and joe biden won overwhelmingly, 53% to 35% something in that range. those are the voters that people are looking for right now. they clearly said joe biden was the winner. >> one of our polls cnn/orc poll, they said who was more likable. and it was paul ryan who won by a decent margin. almost 10% margin there. also, who performed better at the debate? that looked like a tie from our perspective. >> that was a poll of all the viewers. it was as you indicated earlier slighted weighted towards republicans. >> this was debate watchers. >> right. but the cbs poll was debate watchers who were undecided going in. and they gave the clear victory. >> let's talk a little bit about paul ryan on tax cuts. i want to play a little bit from the debate. >> sure. there aren't enough rich people in small businesses to tax to pay for all their spending. so the next time you hear them say don't worry about it, we'll get a few wealthy people to pay their fair share, watch out middle class, the tax bill is coming to you. >> what i thought was interesting and more intesting about this particular debate was that the candidates were able to kind of go at open other and some of that was a different format in the debate. didn't paul ryan have a point, both of them are calling each other on sort of the facts of what they have been claiming when it comes to numbers and math. >> well, except for one thing. the vice president has never claimed that you can reduce our deficit through tax increases alone. he's never said that. the president and vice president have said we need to take the ballad propose, using the kind of frachlwork that bipartisan groups have suggested. whereas republicans have been very clear not one more penny, even from people like mitt romney to reduce the deficit. so our point isn't that you can increase taxes on wealthier people, and do the whole thing on the deficit. our point of review is that they should be asked to contribute a little more. go back to paying what they were in the clinton administration, when the economy was roaring. that's what we're saying. we support a combination of additional targeted cuts. but also revenue for folks who are doing very well to help reduce the deficit. because if you don't have one penny more from very wealthy people it means you sock it to everybody else. seniors on medicare pay more. less investment in our kids' education. and that's exactly the romney/ryan budget does. itzhaks it to the middle class and seniors, in order to give these tax breaks to very wealthy people. >> what do you think of the job martha raddatz did? >> i think she did a very good job. never made herself the center of the debate. >> she started off very strong with benghazi. want to play a little bit about what the vice president said about security in benghazi. >> well, we weren't told we want more security. we did not know they wanted more security. >> explain that to me. a lot of the testimony was, in fact, the, the, the government did know. that, that, that the state department was well aware that there were requests for security. doesn't that completely contradict exactly what we just saw in i think it was wednesday's testimony? >> what the vice president is saying is that he and the president didn't know. this information had been communicated, at least according to the hearings, to the diplomatic security folks at the state department, and some others. but it wasn't communicated to the president. what the vice president said here was number one we're going to get all the facts. let's not jump to conclusions. let's not shoot from the lip as mitt romney did by making a statement right after some of the chaos broke out. it was sort of universally agreed was that the wrong thing to do. and we're going to make sure we hunt down and find the killers just like they did osama bin laden. so i think the vice president was very strong and clear on that. >> congressman chris von hollen. thank you for talking with us. during the debate we got a snapshot of what people were googling. the top searches were biden, conflating, malarkey, a lot trying to figure out what malarkey meant, and who is winning the debate. breaking down the top google searches related to biden, ryan debate came in number one. then how old is. then laughing, and then jill. breaking down the top searches related to ryan, biden debate was number one, then how old is. then shirtless, then workout. coming up we're going to talk with republican senator ron johnson. first we want to get right back to new york and top stories making news today outside of last night's debate. good morning to you, skron. >> good morning, soledad. first up, rallying. more demonstrations in smoert of 14-year-old anti-taliban activist malala. the taliban targeted her because she's been a fierce critic of theirs. she's a staunch advocate for education and girls and women's rights. about 100 people were detained, accused of colluding with attackers who tried to assassinate her. most of them have been released. she's in critical condition. a veteran diplomat coming out of retirement to serve as the senior u.s. envoy in libya. laurence pope is tapped for the diplomatic post a month after the death of u.s. ambassador christopher stevens in the benghazi consulate attack. pope retired from the foreign service twelve years ago. the 2012 nobel peace prize awarded just a couple of hours ago. it didn't go to a person. but the european union. takes the prize. the eu was formed out of the rubble of world war ii and for more than six dpek aids it has promoted democracy and reconciliation across europe. the nobel committee noted that the eu is now battling one of the worst economic crises ever. mission 26 is the shortest and slowest mission ever for the space shuttle "endeavour." the retired spacecraft began the journey overnight from l.a.x. to its retirement home at the california science center. big crowds are expected as "endeavour" snakes its way through the straights of los angeles at a whopping 2 miles per hour. the 12-mile trip will make 46 hours, and it ends tomorrow night. the detroit tigers and san francisco giants are a step closer to the world series. the tigers shut out the oakland aest to advance to the championship series. the giants posed out the reds to reach the nlcs after losing their first two games at home. they had to win three on the road which is pretty darn impressive. their opponents will be decided tonight. the baltimore orioles, beat the yankees 2-1 in 13 innings in the bronx to force a game five in their series. everyone is rooting for the orioles. the washington nationals scored a walk-off win against the st. louis cardinals. that sets the stage for a game five in that series. i was in washington when jason worth hit that home run. washington went bonkers. i swear you could hear the screams on the streets anywhere. very exciting. game five there as well. soledad? >> and how did your red sox do last night? oh, wait a minute. >> they didn't lose. they were undefeated yesterday. unlike the yankees who were 0-1 yesterday. take that malarkey. >> the spin. yeah, you're right. malarkey. i call malarkey on you. all right, john, thank you. still ahead on "starting point," both vice presidential candidates asked if they can get unemployment under 6%. they both said they could do it. is it a promise or is it just hot air? we're going to dig into the jobs issue and some of those numbers up next. and then of course remember he went to prison for illegal dog fights. michael vick is up to something you may not believe. >> vice is big today "time" magazine published a punch of pictures of paul ryan working out. have you guys seen these? take a look at this one here. yeah! tin can romney right there. look at this one. this is one that really got me. i like this one. next vice president of the united states. looks like screech from saved by the bell. backwards hat. jack, you're a little boring. boring. boring. [ jack ] after lauren broke up with me, i went to theiti private pass page and decided to be...not boring. that's how i met marilyn... giada... really good. yes! [ jack ] ...and alicia. ♪ this girl is on fire [ male announcer ] use any citi card to get the benefits of private pass. more concerts, more events, more experiences. [ jack ] hey, who's boring now? [ male announcer ] get more access with the citi card. [ crowd cheering, mouse clicks ] your doctor will say get smart about your weight. i tried weight loss plans... but their shakes aren't always made for people with diabetes. that's why there's glucer hunger smart shakes. they have carb steady, with carbs that digest slowly to help minimize blood sugar spikes. and they have six grams of sugars. with fifteen grams of protein to help manage hunger... look who's getting smart about her weight. [ male announcer ] glucerna hunger smart. a smart way to help manage hunger and diabetes. ♪ [ male announcer ] its lightweight construction makes it nimble... ♪ its road gripping performance makes it a cadillac. introducing the all-new cadillac xts. available with advanced haldex all-wheel drive. [ engine revving ] it's bringing the future forward. throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multi-vitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. it has more of 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. welcome back to "starting point." this just in to cnn, jpmorgan chase reporting record third quarter profits this morning. ceo jamie dimon says the housing market, housing has turned the corner. so clearly the economy still the central issue of the 2012 campaign as well. both paul ryan and vice president biden attacking each other's records on job creation last night. >> look at where we are. the economy is barely limping along. it's growing at 1.3%. that's slower than it grew last year and last year was slower than the year before. >> they talk about ts great recession as if it fell out of the sky like oh, my goodness. where did it come from? it came from this man voting to put two wars on a credit card, at the same time put a prescription drug benefit on the credit card. a trillion dollar tax cut for very wealthy. i was there. >> the two men pitched plans to speed up job growth over the next four years, but as they say the devil is in the details. mark zandi joins us now, chief economist with moody's analytics. his new book is called "paying the price, ending the great recession and beginning a new american century." mark let's start with jpmorgan ceo jamie dimon saying that the housing has turned a corner. we have seen housing prices start to move up. we've seen foreclosures at a five-year low. the unemployment rate at 7. pfrs. we have jobless claims at a four-year low. is joe biden's recovery finally here 28 months later? >> yeah, it's happening. the economic recovery is in place. it's been in place for 3 1/2 years, and i think we're making progress. obviously we're not going anywhere fast. the economy is not improving fast enough to bring down that unemployment rate. but we are improv