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underway after the surrender. >> yes it's already started. >> that's not happening in georgia, right? it will not likely not have until september, is that right? >> perhaps. and we'll see. the judge has the sort of expedited schedule, and so we'll see what other motions get fired even before september, right? already we've seen mark meadows trying to remove this to federal court. we don't know what kind of effect that might have on this. we'll have to wait and see. we were still in like, this is like the first stage of what's going to be, like you said, weeks, months-long, perhaps a years-long process. we just watched literally the first baby step of this. >> barb, as we talk about the issue of severability, i have gone to television law school, and we talk about moving this case into federal court. if kenneth chesebro, it's really still unclear, even now. a. if he is successful -- sorry, if chesebro is successful in severing's case, that bodes well -- sorry, if donald trump is
that. or at least should be for anybody who doesn't want to be there. -- or still does in some cases. not the white house. barb, when we talk about the stress test, it seems like a lot of it is left at the discretion of prosecutors in terms of what they're gonna complain about and the judges and how they rule against a defendant violating the conditions of bail. by virtue of the fact that trump was fingerprinted and mugshot it in a way that he has not been in any of these other criminal indictments, should we infer anything about the way that georgia's gonna deal with this defendant? is it going to be a tougher line there ito? or is it premature to suppose anything based on the processing thus far? >> well, on the one hand, i don't want to make any assumptions based on one small data point. but, you know, if you are to generalize in big terms, federal court is the very
think will be a lot stronger smaller than 19 defendants. >> yeah it's the calm before the storm, joyce. when you talk about wilson's preparedness, there is something happening on monday that i love to get yours and barb opinions on. -- fani willis has called in a couple witnesses that could prove very pivotal in mark meadows argument. one of them is brad raffensperger, and also is cheap investigator frances watson. now, watson was one of the people that physically prevented mark meadows from entering the space where the cobb county audit was being performed. i think on december 22nd, when he traveled to georgia. and meadows personally arranged the call between trump and watson. again, francis watson, raffensperger's chief investigator, --
i would suspect that in this case, this judge has acted with quite a bit of dispatch, in denying the motion to stay, the surrender of two of the defendants, and i would think within a week or so we probably would have the answer. we may not have it on monday. it may be the kind of thing the judge would reflect on it and issue a written opinion. >> lisa rubin, and vaughn hillyard, thank you both, barb will be back with us after the break. a break down is growing and complicated case, surrounding former president trump, and the 11th hour lawyer swap which has a legal analyst saying we may come to regret it. we're back in 60 seconds. but you know what is? myplan from verizon. (vo) football season is here. get nfl sunday ticket from youtubetv on us. a $449 value. plus, get a free samsung galaxy z flip5. only on verizon. ♪ shelves. shelves that know what taste buds want.
violent. we've seen nothing that is dangerous. here at the jail, there are several dozen or so protesters on the other side of the jail with signs and with t-shirts. people driving by with trucks. again, no sign of anything that would get unruly so far, but we do know there are officers who are of course in uniform and plain clothes officers who are watching for any potential disruptions, guys. >> thank you, blayne alexander, we'll let you go to continue with your reporting. barb, rudy giuliani who already surrendered said he talked to trump yesterday. we also saw trump put out a statement defending giuliani. barb, legally, is that a problem if co-defendants, alleged co-conspirators are still talking to each other? >> well, you'll note that in the bond orders, what the judge has required is that they not talk to each other about the case, and so if they're talking to each other about other things or even very generally, you know, i'm supporting you. i hope you're well. i wish you well, those sorts of
>> absolutely, joy. i think that is sort of rule number one for prosecuting organized crime. you are always looking to flip people who can get you closer to the person at the top. it is what the federal government perfected over years of prosecuting drug organizations and mafia cartels. it's getting folks at the bottom to come in and testify at the top. fani willis is no stranger to that. i would expect absolutely that there will be deals offered to folks at the bottom, probably sweetheart deals to folks at the bottom if they're willing taprovide truthful, helpful testimony to the state. i would be shocked if you did not see folks at the bottom start to flip as the heat starts to get turned up in the case. >> barb, the reality is, number one, donald trump is not paying for your defense. and we have seen with the i.t. guy who flipped to the other case, the documents case, as soon as the i.t. guy got his own lawyer and didn't have woodward representing him anymore, suddenly, he got religion and realized, i need to help myself
ever come across in my life. what you see with her is what you get. she is fearless. she is fierce. and when she stands up in front of the citizens of fulton county and tells them what she intends to do, you better believe she's going to follow through on it. fani willis will not be intimidated by trump. in fact, all he will do if he attempts to do that is embolden her to be stronger and steadfast. that's how she's conducted herself in her 20-something odd years doing exactly this work, standing up against murdersers, some of the most dangerous violent predators in our community who she's been threatened 1,000 times over by a whole lot of goons and none of them have ever dissuaded her from doing her job and doing her job well. so yeah, i think that of all the indictments that trump faces, coming to fulton county and facing fani willis in a courtroom ought to scare him. >> you know, and barb, to me, the other tells, it's not just
former president's bond. she could ask the court to do it. and then the president would have, the former president would have the opportunity to say why he shouldn't, and ultimately, it would be up to the court it decide if he in fact violated the bond and inthe sanction should be he should be held in custody until he's tried. >> how do you expect this to work, barb, when he is going to, i guess, i don't know, maybe doing it for drama. we don't know what the specifics of it will be. but how do you expect this to play out? i want you to clarify for me. when you go in and you surrender, you are technically under arrest, right? you have given bond, they release you on your own recognizance, but are you under arrest at that point? >> yes, for those moments you're in custody with the sheriff's office in this case, you are under arrest. they'll show up, they will book him, take his fingerprints, maybe take a mugshot. we don't know about that. but yes, under arrest, but in this case, it appears that the parties have worked out this bond agreement so they don't
that includes all of north georgia. some of the most conservative areas east of the mississippi. that congressional district, for example, that elected marjorie taylor greene. that would be a huge benefit to someone like mark meadows and donald trump. remember, in that jury trial you only need one juror to hold out. you are much more likely to get it if you are able to get all of northern georgia in on that. katie, we are expecting, if this keeps does get removed, potty with it or t would be sworn in as a special u.s. attorneys. we are still talking about the same prosecution team. we are still talking about state, not federal, laws. what changes are the judge in the jury. if someone is convicted, the presidential pardon would not apply. >> barb, let's talk about that judge in state court right now. judge mcafee. a young judge the bench, just appointed in january of 2023. we mentioned in the last hour of my show that cameras are allowed in the courtroom. you and i haven't been in
federal official's charge of the crime instate work, if they're acting within the scope of their authority. but you are not immune from all kinds of prosecution. for example, if you're a law professor, law professors like to use hypotheticals to stretch the logic. if he were charged with murder in georgia, he wouldn't be immune from that. it needs to be something within the scope of his official duties. because his official duties, the president does not include the calculation of votes that the state of georgia are or any other state. i think ultimately he'll be unsuccessful. but the emotion hearing on this whether he can have it removed from federal court and dismissed under this immunity theory. >> barb, speaking of that earlier commotion to remove this from state court to federal court. how likely do you think it is for a judge to agree that they should be removed to federal court, and if it is in federal court what is the likely advantages or disadvantages that are presented to someone like mark meadows, and any of