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NBC Nightly News With Lester Holt

>> reporter: judge florence pan, a biden appointee posing stark hypotheticals on what a president could do if mr. trump's view prevailed. >> could a president order s.e.a.l. team 6 to assassinate a political rival? >> reporter: the answer yes, as long as the president was convicted and impeached first. pinning much of the senate on acquitting mr. trump at his 2021 impeachment trial, a position doj cast as frightening. >> what kind of world are we living? the president has a unique constitutional role. he is not above the law. >> and laura, what can you expect going forward in this case? >> the court is likely to rule very fast, even this week or next. now, if mr. trump were to lose in front of this court, he could appeal even further, potentially up the supreme court. all the while, though, the march trial date is ticking and his lawyers have not been shy about the fact that their gel is to delay.

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

you know, that manufacturing has disappeared, and there is a lot of rage in flyover country. that really explains support for trump, i believe. >> did that explain the support for trump back in 2016? he saw that rage, was wise enough to go to those towns to speak to those people. however, over the course of those four years, he did not pass any policies, they not do anything that helped those voters. in fact, when he lost and joe biden won, we are actually seeing manufacturing come back. we're seeing massive infrastructure investment. what is it beyond the fact that trump does a good story and gets those people to feel scene and fired up, he does not have the facts on his side, when are those voters going to see that? he has not delivered for them. he delivered for corporate america and wall street, did

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

case will be pushed back. that's the entire point here. just to agree. with all my esteemed panelists here. he will do whatever it takes to draw this out. he wants to push these cases passed the election, both as a short term political matter, getting it out of the way, don't have a -- but also as a -- if he is elected president he can assume office and direct the justice department, now under his purview, to dismiss the case is entirely, or it could go even further, and issue a pardon to himself. that's the tactic here for trump. i don't think trump is wedded to constitutional principles or specific arguments. i think he instructed his lawyers to say do whatever it takes, find whatever argument is worthwhile for sanding the gears, and that's what they're doing. >> melissa, let's go back in time. i want to share a bit of sound

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

fundamental constitutional decision. the evidence will be presented at trial at some point. i do think, i mean, i can't get in the minds of the judges on this, but i do think everybody who understands the meaning all of this and how much this matters knows that speed is so important in this case. because if donald trump is able to delay into situation until after, i don't even think it's going to take an order on his part, if you were to win, to release the sensitive nature of this now elected president, what we do with this? and i take all the arguments that people have made before about whether or not you can indict a president and all that are all gonna surface again. and i would argue that i believe, i mean donald trump is a problematic cause in himself, that this dates back to the nixon administration, when we never dealt with this question because of the pardon by gerald

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

that what needed to happen first was an impeachment and a conviction on that impeachment because we have seen not once but twice in the case of donald trump that impeachment is very much a paper tiger. it's toothless at this point given the polarization in both chambers of the congress, especially in the senate. so the real question is, if that cannot be a check on the president, and you cannot have a criminal prosecution in the absence of what could be could not impeach with, what kind of checks on this role do you have? it basically becomes a dictatorship. there is no way to check the president. his impeachment is a paper trigger and criminal prosecution isn't available. it did seem alarming to some of the judges. judge florence pan, for example, was relentless in asking what could the president do in the absence of any real check on his authority. >> over the new york times they created this timeline of donald

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

appointee, posing stark hypotheticals on what a future president could do if mr. trump's view prevailed. >> can the president order seal team six to assassinated political rival? >> the answer, in sauer's view, is rest, as long as the president wasn't indicted impeached first. -- a position doj cast as frightening. >> what kind of world are we living in? the president has the unique constitutional role, but he is not above the law. >> so that's what went down in court. it was not a lot of space or time for political theater, so donald trump save that for after the hearing, and when it was all over he and his lawyers went to the d.c. waldorf astoria to give their version of the day and predict what will happen if they lose this case. >> there will be bedlam in the country. it's a very bad thing. it's a very bad president. we can see the opening of a

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

the court in d.c. might agree with, we might move faster, if not we could see this go to default, set of appeals judges, and it could go to the supreme court. this is really about timing. that's what we're gonna see. how they rule but really how wide scope they take and whether or not they choose to prolong. >> let's think about trump or trump lawyers arguments. if the president can commit high crimes and have complete immunity as long as he's not impeached or convicted, what's to stop any president from committing crimes every day of the week? aren't they making that argument? >> of course. and actually what's to stop a president from shooting three u.s. senators to make sure he's not convicted? because if you're not convicted you can eliminate the people that we convict you and so he can eliminate house members, senate members, and so the whole thing is, i mean, i'm not

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

it's sort of a classic page from his playbook. it doesn't matter, being on trial, maybe not the best thing politically for him. it's all about attention. it's telling that he decamped to the waldorf of story a right after it, getting reporters to rush over to follow him there. didn't take questions, mind you, but gave a statement. he didn't have to do that. he didn't have to be in trial today. he was fundraising, in fact, saying he was forced to be at the trial. that's completely false. it goes to show these things have been beneficial to him in the course of this primary. he has raised money off it. he has put his republican repugnance over in a box over. they've defended him saying he subject to persecution. he has created this image of a president in exile from republicans, someone who has been banished, potentially unlawfully banished by his opponent. you just need to restore back to power. he's done an effective job

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

case about his attempts to overturn the 2020 election. >> i did nothing wrong. absolutely nothing wrong. i didn't feel that as president you have to have immunity. >> the republican front runner running or watching on as court as his lawyer john sauer in courage the judge to break new legal ground, emphasizing everything he did was took place while he was still in the white house. >> winning in every poems being prosecuted by the administration that you seem to. replace >> one justice department argues nothing in the constitution supports shielding mr. trump from prosecution now. >> never before has there been allegations that a sitting president has, with private individuals, and using the levers of power, sought to fundamentally subvert the democratic republic and the electoral system. it would be awfully scary if there weren't some sort of mechanism by which to reach that criminally. >> judge florence pan, a biden

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The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle

placed on his speech in some ways. if he saying something that is threatening, for example, a court clerk at the table, but if he simply going after a hearing late today and using it as a way to hammer president biden, to talk about his defense strategy, there's not much that can be done. that's why we're going to see a series of campaign events taking piggybacking off a series of court events. >> melissa, who's reporting the donald trump is going to give his own closing arguments on thursday. how exactly will that work? a, he has lawyers. is he allowed to represent himself while having lawyers? and what are the rules around having to tell the truth? if he's on the stand, he's forced to comply or his suffer the consequences of perjury. but our closing arguments a different story? >> there is an axiom in the law, that a man who represents himself, has a full for a

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