Transcripts For CSPAN2 State Lawmakers Testify On Impact Of Roe V. Wade Overturned 20240707

management is meant to ask a gentleman texas mr. cloud is recognized. quick thinking manager. thank you for standing around in working with us on our schedule today. our declaration of independence introduced into the world a profound set of ideals to be perfected in subsequent generations. there werend certain inalienable rights that were given to mankind. and they were not a grant from government but a gift from god. the declaration on the site among these were life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. it is notable that those ideals upon which the rest of the rule of law under which we live is all based on the first essential right as the right to life. with the dobbs decision in a single day millions gained about right that have been taken away .reviously if we look at the development last 50 years, i was born in 70 a couple years after row. ultrasounds were very brave. i asked momar for my ultrasound. there wasn't want to be found there isn't one. when rogue was being argued the dialogue at the time it was a blob of tissue. and we know so much more now than we did before. we know that a child at six weeks we can detect a heartbeat. we note thanks for showing us a child can feel the pain of abortion. there is a lot of misinformation that happened progress. the chair said the dog physician is undemocratic big two ms. holland the dobbs decision and if it is undemocratic or not? >> certainly for theco dobbs decision is not antidemocratic. it is an act of judicial modesty. it's a decision which the majority clearly explains the concentration structure and history are absently silent on the right to abortion. justice explained that means that we the people get to debate the issue, to decide the issue in the supreme court got out of the business of legislating abortion. >> if anything a restorative democratic process to the discussionis of abortion progres absolutely it leaves it to the people. >> that is my understanding as well. it was also said for outlying people whom braces are extremist, draconian is how this we heard about threats to democracy and also to things. we talk about extremism can you compare where the united states stands in relation to other countries when it comes to abortion? >> absently under roeac versus wade united states is on the most extreme and permissive nations on abortion in the entire world. we were one of only seven countries in the world including countries like china and north korea who have horrible human rights records to allow abortion up until the moment of birth for any reason at all. that is so very rare we are not on the right side of that. are there any state laws that would prosecute women for an abortion? rockstar not now. there are no state abortion laws no. >> any federal? we have heard a lot about that. could you speak to a topic pregnancy and abortion as we keep hearing that is an issue as well? >> thank you so much that question. think topic pregnancy's art issue as you said misinformation and social media post suggesting when it will not get treated for an ectopic pregnancy because doctors might be afraid of performing the procedure. but that's excellent balls. an ectopic pregnancy treatment for a topic is not in fact an abortion. andly abortion is the intentionl taking of human life. an ectopic pregnancy is a tragic situation in which the baby is developing outside of the loan. treatment for that is planned parenthood is recognized simply not an abortion. both you and i believe life begins at conception this is a questions of life ultimately that's what makes it so difficult and why this is such it is so deep-seated when it comes too this. when it comes to what subnormal and h2 hr 927. these bills among other things allow for abortion because of disability. whats the child is what race te child is potentially involved in a child's life. there is ambiguous language many who their faith dictates is not a proper thing to do to perform an abortion. what is troubling to me we thought from therf left wantingt to be rare supposedly to now elect taxpayers to fund it. not only in our country to pay for other people's abortion but also for abortion the judgment time has expire for. >> thank you foron being here today. >> gentleman from california's readiness for five minutes requeststs madam chair to enter into the record in his sock abortion progress without objection. >> before dobbs, even under roe americans who wanted an abortion were denied. the aaa study examines theer lis of hundreds of people were denied abortions and compare their experiences to people who got abortions. are you familiar with the turnover study? >> yes i am. clocksks and watches my whitebod to help americans understand what the study found. let's start with health. women are more likely to suffer from physical health problems, women who had an abortion or women who were denied in abortion. >> women who were denied in abortion. >> women who were denied in abortion. i in which women were denying abortion is not just correlate physical health and meets the financial. which group of women, those received an abortion or denied and abortion are more likely to be unemployed? >> for sure those who were denied in abortion. >> denied an abortion rate which group of women was more likely. >> to findn. those were denied abortions. >> and which are more likely to have low credit scores to have their application for housing, car loans denied? >> that were denied in abortion. >> to some women but the decision to have an abortion were not able to have an abortion. to make their ownde decision. they had a worse health outcomes, were more likely to be unemployed, or more likely to face financial problems like living in poverty arewo having w credit scores. women who were denied abortions are four times more likely to live below the poverty line for the less likely to be able to afford food and housing for their selves and their children. can you explain why people who were denied denying abortion are morere likely to have these poor outcomes and someone who obtained an abortion? >> he hurt abortion you are not having a child based on when you actuallywh want too. and what we know as there is a wide range of reasons people determine it is not the right time to have a child. it could bee that their health s not the reason that they want to have a child at that time. but it also could be because they are not financially secure, they are in a relationship where it does not make sense. there is a range of reasons. that is why it is so important decision be the decision of the person was actually pregnant. the person who's actually going to have that child whether or not they doat that. >> i completely agree. we should let people who are pregnant make the decision whether or not to carry that child, to deliver that child and to raise that child. i am a mom, i love my three children. i know firsthand the joys and hardships karen, birthing, raising and providing for children. including doingng it alone is millions of women do. that is why i believe so strongly should not have the power to force anyone to become apparent. it's not just a major health decision and is an economic decision for entire families including other children that person, that mother or parent may have. many women significant decrease in their income after having a child. income declined even further after the birth of additional children. many leave the workforce altogether to care for their kids. when extremist politician prevent americans from making their own decisions they force patients to give birth to children that they may not be able to care for afraid that they may not be able to protected ray safely. and that nay forced to grow up in poverty. we should live in a free society. america should have the freedom, the liberty to grow their families and they are ready to doam so. not birthing babies because of government mandates. i am here at home sick with college and caring for my two children alone. i doho not meet an american womn do not need politicians telling them when and if they should make the decision to raise children.in i thank you for your testimony and everybody onn this panel and i yield back. >> a gentle lady yields back. the gentleman from arizona is now recognized for five minutes. cook liked the chairwoman. i appreciate the opportunity to be heree today. this incredibly politically charged hearing. i know we get to have another tomorrow in fact the democrats are going five for five hearings five days effectively on this topic. democrats really are the abortion extremist relying on the strategy of fear that's really what itt is. i associate myself with the video those put in there i will say one thing mr. john was asking questions he forgot to ask the question about bounties put out by shutdown d.c. on supreme court justices. it is absolutely outrageous i'm not hurt anyny of my colleagues across the aisle, not one say hey maybe we shouldn't do that stop doing that. it is an incredible, incredible strategy. governor northam they are extremist. government north and said third trimester abortions are done in cases there may be severe information to be a fetus not viable. this particular example of a mother is in labor and content exactly what would happen. the infant would be delivered. the info will be kept comfortable for the infant will beat resuscitate that's of the mother and family desire in that discussion will ensue between thet discussion with the positn and the mother the outcome of that baby. i associate myself with the comments of senator rubio who said he had never thought he would see it day in america are back government officials who openly support open genocide. elizabeth warren, what didin she sayls? she set in massachusetts right now crisis pregnancy centers are people looking for printed her management help but true abortion clinics three -- when we shut them down in massachusetts. we need to shut them down all around the country. wow, that's from the liberal i've got a series of articles on that and i'm going to go through quickly fast.e this time goes by austria limits to the first three months into the rest of these are in weeks, croatia, 12, czech republic 12, denmark, 12, latvia 12, italy, 12, greece, 12, france, 14. you know what, america's laws before uvalde were the most this planet right up until the exit of the birth canal and what's happened since then the left is okay with this strategy. democrats have launched summer of rage. i appreciate someone said i have one dated june 9th, 56 attacks including one in bethesda over the weekend. pro-life pregnancy centers continue. this one is in hutchinson kansas. thein other one i will submit te justice department announced it has a reproductive rights task force and the threat from the left is that it can lose economic edge. that is what the times reports. this is a strategy of fear and threats and intimidation against members of the supreme court. it's a clinic on disinformation by asserting that it prevents abortion throughout the country. last question for you. can men become pregnant? >> biological women may become pregnant. >> thank you. i yelled back. >> the gentlewoman from missouri is recognized. >> thank you, chairman loney for convening this urgent hearing. within minutes of the far right supreme court decision to overturn roe and casey, my home state was the first state to enact and ban abortion care. the trans- men and non-binary people can become pregnant. the criminalization of abortion care has are ripple effect acros the healthcare and legal system. the majority of states where abortion care is now banned has threatened to enforce criminal laws that target healthcare providers for administering medication and providingem abortion care to those who need it. if convictedto with a sentence f up to 15 years and other states like texas include the possibility of a life sentence. i've heard from people in st. louis who told me they are afraid to cross the state line to access abortion care which they need because they fear being investigated and prosecuted at home. so many of these know that it's long beenig politicized which is happening in this moment and criminalized. people have been investigated and punished for struggling or self managingg abortion care. if it is banned and where it is legal and protected. a local prosecutor in california charged to women with murder because of their laws. i am concerned that far right extremists antiabortion lawmakers in my own state like the state attorney general may move to further politicize the rights and criminalized abortion care and pregnancy outcomes. unless we speak of more. until we organize to block the lawse, and protect the reproductive freedom. so can you please describe what measures are being taken to protect people in a rare state like mine? >> thank you for the question and for your work on this issue. to not use government funds to prosecute folks or to investigate folks should the law will go into effect that would affect the outlaw abortion so i'm glad that you mentioned about what is going on with criminalization because we also at the same time across the country they are hyper aggressive about bending and twisting the law and using others toe criminalize folks ad we do know that there has been an uptick of criminalization of miscarriages across the country. >> thank you, thank you so much for those insights and for what you do. can you explain how it creates a public health emergency? >> abortion care is both effective and safe. what is deeply concerning is if people are either afraid to seek medical care if they need it or if providers are killed if they are afraid to provide medical care not knowing the state of the law. the other thing we know is carrying a pregnancy to term. the mortality rates are extremely high. so none of these will do anything to aid that and will only worsen the outcomes. >> the undocumented people and the most marginalized in our society. we have an obligation, all of us to take care we find work for everyone we need to work in lockstep for the reproductive health care. >> of the gentle ladies time is expired. >> the gentleman from kansas. >> the supreme court decision in dobbs v jackson women's health was a monumental one. it signifies the pro-life americans across the country but most importantly the innocent unborn but make no mistake the ruling is not just a victory for the pro-life movement it's a victory for the constitution and for the principle of federalism. if you want to have abortion laws in this country tome your liking, elect officials that agree with you and pass it in the legislative body and states throughout w this country. that is the way to achieve it but let's not pretend it existed in our constitution in this country. and contrary to what some of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle say, this in no way endangers lifesaving care for pregnant mothers. the mississippi statute in question excludes procedures to treat ectopic pregnancies and miscarriages from the definition of abortion and they are nearly identical exceptions in every state that enacted pro-life laws. this protection of both unborn children and their mothers is what a consistent and compassionate ethic of lifed looks like. citizens have the opportunity this august to vote for the value of the constitutional amendment that rightfully reserves the right to pass the laws regulating abortion to the people through their elected representatives. i am a firm supporter of the change and hope that the momentum from the historic decision compels kansans to restore authority to citizens to decide abortion laws. i celebrate the impact of the decision and its implication for the sanctity of human life both for mothers and their unborn children. in your opinion why is the regulation of abortion better bosuited for the state legislatures van unelected supreme court or even a here in congress? >> the voters in mississippi are women andwe for those in mississippi they now have a voice and vote. they are able to tackle these difficult issues and we can allow women to express their opinions on this issue. >> there's been a lot of conversation among social media and by a pro- abortion organizationsto that warn women the government is tracking their activity across health apps and search history on the web browsers and will use that to seek criminal penalties related to abortion. did any of the laws include criminal enforcement mechanisms against women who seek abortions? >> know they do not. >> what would you say to women who were scared of criminal for ectopic pregnancies because as you know this is a real issue and real anxiety eveno among those that consider themselves pro-life but want exceptions. there is a lot of fear mongering. >> as you mentioned, every state's law has an exception for the life of the mother and this means doctors and physicians will be able to treat the mother with her life in danger similarly the idea that a treatment organic ectopic pregnancy is and abortion is simply false. it's fear mongering it is untrue. it's a tragedy that one in 50 pregnancies are ectopic pregnancies. women usually find out about this between six and eight weeks and it's a horrible circumstance but a treatment for that is not an abortion. there's no intend to take the child's life were to be worried as a doctor or physician or especially as a woman. >> what do you think damage is caused by this fear mongering? >> whether it's something that you longed and hoped for or something that's unexpected can be overwhelming. to have this additional fear mongering on top of that i think addsyo to that uncertainty. we need to come alongside women and support them and provide them the resources necessary for them and their children to survive. the decision is not only a lega victory but it is a rallying cry. we must become a culture that values life, women's lives and the resources they need throughout their pregnancy and beyond. >> if i could b get you to commt on this it was referenced earlier the vandalism that is being done throughout the country and the intimidation being attempted in my home state as i mentioned we are trying to pass both because our state supreme court wrongly decided that our 1859 constitution had a right to abortion, which is absolutely absurd. but we have instances in kansas right now are the churches are being vandalized. would you comment on that briefly? >> i think you're right the decision not only must lead to sathe american people by opposig the right to abortion but also state supreme court. so hopefully kansas can rectify that. as far as the vandalism -- >> the ladies time is expired. >> the gentlewoman from ohio. the gentlewoman from california, ms. jackie spears for five minutes. >> thank you so much for holding this hearing. let me say at the outset to my good friend and to others on the republican side yes, we deplore violence against pregnancy centers and justices and judges. we deplore violence against the institution we call the u.s. capitol. we also deplore violence against abortion clinics. and you have said nothing about the fact that 11 people have been murdered at those clinics. for doctors, to clinic employees, one security guard, one police officer and one clinic escort. last year there were 186 arsonso targeted at abortion centers. 123 acts of vandalism, incidents of assault and battery. stocking increased by 600% last year over 2020 and increased by 129%. suspicious packages by 153%. i didn't get one word from any ofus you announcing those acts f violence. so you have very selective memories. >> let me start by speaking about mothers. i am a mother that has abortion, 59% of the women inai the county that have abortions or mothers. they love their children. they want to provide for their children. across this country, women are asking themselves is it even is safe to get pregnant. this is not hyperbolic. as states criminalize abortion, they are also making it illegal to treat many pregnancy related complications. i've had two miscarriages. miscarriages happen a lot. the treatment for the miscarriages the same for the treatment to reduce abortion. it could take up to three or four weeks. a woman may need medication or dnc especially if there's signs ofch infection. whenou i had my first miscarriae i was told i was going to have to wait period of days before they could give me a dnc. i can't begin to tell you what it's i like having wanted that fetus to become a baby and know that it was a dead in my body and i had to walk around with that. i had a mother at a church once say to me i had to carry a dead fetus to term for nine months. women will be denied carriage because doctors are worried about whether or not they are going to be thrown in jail for 99 years. at the same goes for treating women that are seriously ill. if a woman has a 50% chance of dying is that sufficient to provide an abortion? have about 20% or 10%.an at what point do we value the life of the woman? how will criminalizing impact patients that are experiencing miscarriage or other pregnancy related complications? >> we are already hearing reports on the ground from providers being uncertain about the care they can actually provide when faced with someone that has an ectopic pregnancy. going back to the point that you'veve raised around miscarrie what is likely to happen is an acceleration in miscarriages being investigated. it's the experience of people more likely to be low income and blackbe and brown people. this b is a population that has unfair contact with the criminal justice system. so what we will see is going through a miscarriage turning into a a criminal event. it's the safe and effective care people need. >> you've spoken about meeting a dnc after your iud punctured your uterus. k can you tell about your experience and what it meant for you if abortion had been illegal? >> after having my daughter i had an iud placed into a in a rd through my uterus. it is very rare and it requires a dnc to have it removed. i could have died if i had not been able to have the procedure to have that removed and we are already hearing from the university off michigan medicine saying that they fear -- >> the gentleman from georgia you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you madam chair. as we all know, we are here today because of the lifesaving decision that the supreme court made on june 2nd in the dobbs versus jackson women's healthcare organization case. this historic decision simply restored the rights of voters in each state to allow voting citizens to have a say in protecting life. i would like to submit 71% of americans support limits on abortion. it is a fox news article dated january 20th, 2022. >> without objection. >> the impact of the supreme court's decision in dobbs will let the american people decide on the issue of abortion. american voters are able to elect representatives that they believe best represent their beliefs and i believe that they will do exactly that. but democrats have brought us here today to talk about the impact of the decision. but the impact is exactly what i said so we should do away with the hearing and change the focus to things citizens care about like rising inflation, rising crime and open borders that are putting the safety and securith of our families at risk across the country and in every state.r let me remind you again of the impact. it allows american voters to have a say on abortion. that's all it does and that's why democrats are terrified and why we are here today which leads me to my first question. democrats seem to think it's a bad thing to let american voters have a say on abortion as opposed to having the courts say it. if americans wanted to legalize abortion would they simply vote for the majority of candidates into office that would do that? is that a bad thing to return it to the states? it's not apl federal issue. >> i think we can see the extremis of the democratic pro- abortion position when we look at the women's health protection act. if we look at that act it permits abortion up until the moment of birth for any reason. this is a more extreme policy that all but seven countries in the world including china and north korea, countries that have horrendous human rights records. in addition it allows abortions for any reason that include sex, race. it supersedes every single state law. so the provision that might require parental notification or that might say their safety and health regulations that apply to abortions, those are gone under this nationally mandated abortion on demand through all nine months of pregnancy bill. >> i think that it's better that it goes back to the states for the people to decide. ms. graves, you are the president and ceo of the national women's law center. is the word abortion, i mean, we hear you are a lawyer, obviously a good one. >> i hope so. >> i would hope so. is the word abortion anywhere in the constitution? >> there are a lot of words that are not in the constitution. >> i just need a yes or no answer please. is the word abortion anywhere in the constitution? >> the word abortion is not. >> it is not. thank you. earlier this year our supreme court justice was asked what a woman is and she had a difficult time defining that. since you are the president of the national women's law center i was hoping you could define what a woman is in this committee hearing. >> as the president of the national women's club you can imagine i say women a lot in my job. so what i will tell you is i am a woman and that's how i identify but i wonder, however, is in part the reason that you're asking the question is you're trying to suggest -- >> i simply want an answer. >> i think that it's really important to be very clear that there are people who identify as non-binary -- >> we are not going to go there. i was hoping that maybe you would say something that may be we learned in high school biology that has to do with x and y chromosomes that define male andwo female but i guess we aren't going to get there. >> i have another question. i saw in your annual report you previously received money from groups like planned parenthood action fund. are you still receiving funding from planned parenthood action fund or any other planned parenthood affiliate? >> i certainly support the leadership and work of planned parenthood and the work they are doingg right now. >> are you receiving money from them or not? >> we don't have grants but i support the work they do. >> i would ask for unanimous consent to enter the annual reportho which states the contribution from planned parenthoodod action fund. >> without objection the time of the gentle man is expired. the gentlewoman from illinois is recognized. >> thank you madam chair. even before the ruling, the united states was faced with the highest mortality equally felt. >> we are having trouble with the connection, representative. now we can hear you better. we know black women are three to four times more likely than white women to experience pregnancy complications. can you speak to my black women are more likely to die during pregnancy and how well zev uvale make this worse? >> they are less likely to have access to insurance but one of the other things that we know h is that te discrimination and bias that they receive in healthcare makes the pregnancies that black women have even more serious. so, when they raise concerns about their health they are not always taken as seriously, and i commend the work that the congress has done to try to deal with the maternal mortality crisis in this country. i have such deep worries that we will be accelerating on the wrong track especially in the states thatav have ran to ban abortion leaving people without options to decide whether they want to have children themselves. >> and it should be especially alarming that the states with the highest rates of mortality haved also banned or are abouto ban abortion and more women will die as a result. representative georgia has one ofo the worst mortality crisis n the country. [inaudible] who advocates [inaudible] >> could you repeat the question? it cut out. >> those that advocate for forced pregnancy are they taking steps to address the crisis in your state? >> some of these folks were being told they were not living their values and wanted to make sure that everyone has access to healthcare which is what they claim. they did to support the effort to expand medicaidre but one thg i would like to correct on the record because i've heard this many times the disinformation of how the united states is radical compared to other countries. most countries don't legislate abortion. they don't. because they know that abortion is healthcare. so this isn't even something that is legislated in most countries so that's why you don't see this is something that is talked about because they know that this isn't a political issue and it wasn't a political issue until the 1980s when republicans used it to coalesce their base, so all the talk about how radical the u.s. was protecting abortion rights is completely false. >> thank you for clearing that up.ut mortality rates have increased during the pandemic. i'm alarmed and enraged to make that disparity worse. it is a public outcry and we need to address it [inaudible] >> the gentle lady yields back to the gentleman from north carolina is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you madam chair. i find it amazing that the statements abortion is healthcare. that is totally unbelievable if you are uttering that abortion is healthcare. is it healthcare for the child or for that person? to make that statement completely baffles me. let me ask the three of you i assume you agree with the fan decided that the killing of a perfectly healthy child? >> i don't accept the basis of the question but i do believe abortion is healthcare. >> i'm talking about do you agree -- i get that but do you support killing a child after he is born? >> i do not agree with the basis of that question but i do agree that it ist healthcare. >> so i will take that is yes you do agree. do you agree with the infanticide? >> i think you're using inflammatory language to describe a situation. we don't have infanticide happening. doctors wouldn't do that and neither would folks -- would you agree if a healthy child is born it's that woman's right to decide if it lives or dies? >> you have a very low opinion of pregnant people because if youd think -- >> danswer the question. >> i'm answering it. >> do you want an answer or keep talking over witnesses? nobody would carry a pregnancy and decide on a monday because they are bored that they want in abortion. that's ridiculous and inflammatory what you're saying. you are talking about families ayinto situations where folks he been excited about carrying a pregnancy. most of the abortions that have been leader in pregnancy are tragedies where it is a disappointment for everyonete involved. >> i take it with all those words you do agree basically murdering a child after they are born. could you answer that? yes orre no? >> i have to say, congressman, how you just characterized the representatives statement is extremely inflammatory and the type of thing that is dangerous. talking about the threats against crisis pregnancy centers which i assume are serious and terrible. >> i have a limited time. reclaiming my time. i wouldd also say [inaudible] >> reclaiming his time. >> i will say this it's inflammatory when jesus healthcare -- abortion is healthcare. i'm reclaiming my time. this being said, do the three of you favor doing away with the law on the books if a mother is thr is carrying i a child and is sh, is that murder, homicide or should that be abolished? >> homicide for who? >> if a mother is carrying a child and gets murdered, they are charged now in most every state that i know of double homicide. they killed the mother and the child. is that right, do you favor that were want to abolish that? >> i will go first. >> i'm asking ms. graves. >> i have no idea what law you are talking about. >> if a mother is carrying a child and gets shot -- it happened in charlotte north carolina where a mother -- carrying a child when she was killed. charged with doublewh homicide r killing two people. should that be abolished or not? >> one of the most dangerous timesou -- [inaudible] let me say the dog's decision was the greatest decision the supreme court has made. federalism versus states rights that the untruths you are putting out there, the left is putting out about doing away with abortion, the states decide. and these other things you're putting out wouldn't allow a physician to care for a woman if it poses a serious threat to her life, totally false. restrictions mean a woman with an ectopic pregnancy must choose between jail or death. that is totally absurd. the supreme court got it right and i hope each state will ban abortions and infanticide which the three of you are in agreement with. >> i disagree with that. none if you answered the question. >> the gentleman's time is expired. the gentle lady from michigan is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you madam chair. i find it ironic that my colleagues on the other side keep talking about giving the states the right to choose about abortion but you want to take the right to choose away from a woman carrying that child who has all of the responsibility. i w find it ironic choice only works for you in certain scenarios. i will continue my comment that when you talk about the fact healthcare, you are a man. you are totally clueless or you don't giveu a darn that when a woman is pregnant that is a unique situation that requires intervention and special treatment. that's why doctors obviously specialize in care for pregnant women. it is a healthcare issue. my question goes to senator mario. we know that the state officials as we keep hearing about the choice going to the states, the majority of people pushed back against the effort to take the constituents back in time. my question is what are we doing and what can states do because the conversation about the fact that the ability to have healthcare during a pregnancy to make a choice is nothi healthcae and shows that we are dealing with a population that we cannot advocate. please comment on that. >> first of all, i am so grateful to hear from our republican colleagues that they plan to pass legislation prohibiting partisan gerrymandering.l we are returning this issue to the states and state legislatures we must ensure that people have a fair right to elect their choice of elected officials that represent their values because right now in michigan the courts have ruled that is nott the case. one of the most of the badly gerrymandered estates in the country and all you have to look atan is the effort behind the initiative. the number of people, volunteers who stood up and collected signatures to challenge the extreme minorities that are passing legislation against the will of the majority, so we need the federal government and our colleagues in congress to make sure that on the local level llevery single voter is able to elect their candidate of choice that aligns with their values. >> thank you. i want to ask a similar question to the representative. i understand georgia previously passed the six week abortion man. what steps are we taking to help ensure georgian residents are able to access abortion care if this ban goes into effect? >> das across the state to say they will not use funds to prosecute funds foror getting access to healthcare which is abortion and local municipalities are also saying they will not allow funds to be used to attract folks or stop anybody from getting accesson to care. >> thank you. i want to use the remainder of my time as a woman when i gave birth to my second child from my second pregnancy i began hemorrhaging and i remember all the doctors and nurses running in because my life was in danger. my doctor who is trained in pregnancy and care for pregnant women told me that i shouldn't have another child because my risk level of a pregnancy would be very, very destructive to my body.. my husband and i, as a married woman, to say i shouldn't have another child that left me with two healthy beautiful children from two pregnancies but i'm i'm beingtold by a medical profl do not have any more children because we almost lost you today. so for the ignorance and lack of compassion for women who have an amazing opportunity to give birth to say that abortion is not a part of healthcare because as a married woman if for some chance i had become pregnant again, what would be my option? to sayand would have let's start planning your funeral. i yield back and wish to god that when we get in the position of dictating to government that we have respect for women and respect for the ability to make choices. thank you. >> the time is expired. the gentleman from south carolina is recognized. >> thank you madam chair and i want to thank everyone for their time here today. i am from south carolina that recently implemented a fetal heartbeat velvet had exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother because i put them there. one of the few in the nation inthat has a fetal heartbeat bil with those exceptions because i told my story of being raped when we were debating the issue a few years ago and i hope the state of south carolina and the governor keep those provisions. and also do not legislate whether women can go to other states or locations if they so choose. at the constitutional conservative i take the constitution to my oath of office very seriously and even justice ruth bader ginsburg talked about and discussed the concerns she had from the constitutional perspective on roe v wade for decades. even joe biden 40 years ago was talking about overturning roe v wade. there's a number of folks and it was under president obama when he had a super majority in the house and senate and had at the white house and decided that they would codify roe v wade and not to because the left could use it as a fund-raising juggernaut for decades rather than take the issue seriously and now we have supreme court justices and protests and folks that are showing up on the arms of the supreme court justices and whether you are left or right it is the third branch of government and we shouldn't be encouraging these kind of activities. the united states it's the states not the courts that are the true laboratories of democracy and leaders that the federal, state and local are elected to represent the people and other states and what roe does isn't necessarily what the media has said or even some of my t colleagues have said on the overturning of roe v wade. it isn't going to eliminate women's care for ectopic pregnancies as iy have heard. i had a miscarriage when i was first having my children. it isn't going to eliminate healthcare for women who have ectopic pregnancies or who have miscarriages. i don't know one state if you can mention one state that's going toeg eliminate health care for women whose lives are in danger, one estate, does anybody have one state that it's trying to say we are not going to allow any healthcare for a woman whose lifege is in danger, is there oe state making that a law? >> go for it. >> i would like to weigh in and tell you what providers told me when this issue came up providers told me that they were worried even when you make an exception for the life of then pregnant person that they would be charged they would be challenged when it's appropriate to make the decision to perform an abortion so this puts fear in doctors and if you live in south carolina i don't know what your provider situation looks like but we already have a shortage of specialists. over half the counties do not have access to an ob/gyn. we can't andyo afford to lose doctors because they feel that they will be criminalized or sued. >> therein lies the debate today why so many women either don't have access to birth control, don't have access to medical care or healthcare, access to understand if they want to keep their child how to give it up for adoption, why are so many women having abortions and why they don't have access to care and that isal the debate i feel should be. i would be remiss if i didn't mention that some of the most important constitutional decisions have overruled other prior precedents because there's been some mention by folks across the aisle that the supreme court is not legitimate, but i want to mention a few here in brown v board of education, three in 1954 the court repudiated separate but equal doctrine that allowed states to maintain racially segregated schools and other facilities. by happenstance earlier this week i visited the federal courthouse in downtown charleston where 1950 was thurgood marshall who brought arguing that a school segregation in south carolina wass unconstitutional. this was the first case nationwide that the challenged school segregation is a violation of the constitution. that would eventually become brown v board and the court found then as it's found now it was the right and constitution to overturn that particular precedent. i appreciate the time today and yield back. >> the gentle lady yields into the chair recognizes the distinguished gentleman from vermont for five minutes. >> i think the witnesses and the chair and mymy colleagues. in vermont we have a constitutional amendment that we will be voting on that will enshrine the right of a woman to make her decision about reproductive choice. we passed the law signed by republican governors that would protect a woman's right to make that decision. now i want to say two things. number one, i am unaware of our u.s. supreme court ever passing a law or making a decision that took away a right that had existed in this case reproductive freedom for 50 years. i am aware of the court making decisions as they did in brown v board of education to expand rights that are in the spirit of the constitution. equality under the law which has beento the aspirational goal of our constitution and our declaration. but it's always been about reaching beyond where we were as opposed to taking back what had been acknowledged. second. when i returned to burlington on the date ofkn the court decisio, there were demonstrations across vermont. and there's been other times when i would appear at demonstrations when and an action taken by the branch of government was very upsetting to people in vermont and often times i've experienced people's anger at the actions that were taken. this one was different. it was fear about what this meant for a woman's right to make a decision about her own reproductive choices and it was also fear about the erosion of privacy and what the implications were for contraception. same-sex marriage and a whole range of cases that have essentially respected the individual's right in the sanctity of his or her privacy protection and that awaits us. the second point is that we know that abortion is a very important topic for everyone. with the witnesses there's some disagreement here. it's a passionately held decision. but what we had a sense was an opportunity for people to make their own decisions and not impose their decisions on someone whose decision was different. what i've seen since the decision is in our divided society and escalation in the division that is dangerous for the country because you see legislatures now past laws that take away rights animated by people who not only have made a decision that they never want to have an abortion, but who then want to through politics to impose the decision that's there's onto others. and i think we should all be concerned about the division. and i am hearing from medical practitioners and an immense amount of apprehension that they will be second-guessed. i will ask you whether a woman should be prosecuted and you answered no and i appreciate that. dol you think a doctor who performs an abortion based on her medical judgment that that was necessary to protect the health of the woman should ever be prosecuted? >> absolutely not.me there's two issues. women should never be prosecuted for having an abortion. women are often harmed bylu abortion. the emotional and physical consequences. and many, well, every state allows for emergency exceptions for the life of the mother. mississippi allows that in the division of best judgment. >> professor graves, you had mentioned the court had never taken away a right. could you elaborate on that in my remaining time? >> this is the first time in our history where we have had a court take away an individual why wend that is exactly are seeing this level of legal chaos. weor have shaped the other laws and systems around the idea that abortion was legal in this country and so what that means is sort of the individual and personal freedom that people had to make those decisions, to plan and determine whether they have a child are no longer guaranteed to be there's and the fundamental floors are not as state-by-state ideas. we are one nation with one constitution. >> the gentleman's time is expired. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. >> thank you madam chair. there were no women on the supreme court when roe was decided. one when kasey was decided in three women when dobbs was decided. additionally, there are 2,295 women in the state legislators today across the country. women are more represented in government today than any time in our history. members of state legislators are voted into office by their constituents to represent their constituents. would you agree the state legislatures equipped to regulate abortion based on the beliefs and opinions of the constituents. >> the dobbs decision says because abortion is nowhere within thepp constitutional structure or the nation's history the people and their elected representatives are allowedd to make that choice. >> some websites such as need abortion.org are cautioning the centers telling them that they are unregulated and unlicensed. our pregnancy centers unregulated andcr unlicensed? >> absolutely not. we are steering people away from organizations and want to help them. >> do they give subpar services to women? >> we heard testimony at the senate hearing that it refers to the pregnancy center for other services aside from abortion. >> i would agree with that. with your assessment on the pregnancy centers and could you elaborate what services do the pregnancy crisis centers offer to women and babies after the birth of a child? >> absolutely. pregnancy care centers, alongside a woman island provide diapers, formula, those sort of things and often the workers becomed lifelong friends we hae several impressive crisis pregnancy centers in kentucky and in my congressional district in henderson kentucky to do magnificent work and appreciate everything they do. let me ask you the last question. ndradical groups have taken cret for vandalizing church and crisis centers across the nation. they also tweeted locations where the supreme court justices reside, where they are having dinner. they protested outside of the justices homes and disruptive church services. in'r closing can you tell us wht impact does political violence have on the function of the nation's institutions and rule of law? >> intimidation and political violence is intended to disrupt the rule of law and we see this with of the attack on pregnancy care centers and justices lives and their family. the name is ironic because justice ruth bader ginsburg was a critic of roe v wade for the reason she said it was a heavy handled judicial intervention that was unnecessary and short-circuited. iait's possible to agree and be civil. >> that is a great example. i've seen pictures of them playingdi cards together. appreciate you being here and all the witnesses being here and i will yield back. >> theth gentle man yields back. the gentle man from massachusetts is recognized. >> thank you, madam chair and to the ranking member for holding thisis important hearing. i also want to thank the distinguished panel of witnesses for your willingness to appear here in person and also testify remotely and to help the committee withta its work. as a lawmaker i would like to turn to explore the wider legal framework around the ramifications of the decisions and dobbs versus jackson women's health and the broad impact on the right to privacy which the court previously held was supported by the u.s. constitution and roe v wade. since it was decided in 1973, roe v wade has been cited in more than 4,500 cases including more than 140 supreme court cases. more than 2600 lower federal court cases and 2,000 state court cases. for nearly 50 years, the progeny stood as the law of the land reflecting the delicately determined legal balance between the fundamental right of a woman to make a decision about her reproductive health, free from unnecessary governmental interference and the legitimate legitimateinterest of the stateo to defend and solidify the right to privacy of every american as to the due process clause in the amendment. this guaranteed personal privacy includes and i quote rights that can be deemed fundamental or implicit in the concept of the liberty. it also extends to activities related to marriage, procreation, contraception, family relationships and child rearing and education. and overruling and disregarding the carefully deliberated a precedent, the majority opinion assures nothing in this opinion should be understood to the other precedents that do not concern abortion but given the indispensable role of the line of cases and rights to privacy frameworks i'm not so sure about that. justice alito's majority opinion takes great pains to distinguish the right to abortion from other privacy related rights and in stark contrast, the national women's law center, your orinstitution has warned that it lays out a roadmap for eviscerating other important rights. i would like you to talk about that. about the impacts that this decision impactslk those rights, those privacy rights. >> the first major concern is that it has the right to privacy that had been articulated and hass been built upon following whether you're talking about the contraception or intimate relationships or same-sex marriage more recently. owbut the other thing that was deeplyly concerning about a justiceab alito's opinion is he basicallyre says that it wasn'ta right that was well grounded in the nation's history at the time of the 14th amendment. it's not one that should be afforded respect. well, women at the time of the 14th amendment could not practice law, couldn't have lines of credit, couldn't own property separate. so if we have to go back to the rights that women had, we are all in trouble at that time and within the last thing that i will say is that totally missig from a lot of the conversations todayro but certainly justice alito's opinion is the right to control your own body and makeal decisions about your own body that is not a small idea. it isio a giant idea and it's nt just to be pregnant or give birth, that is a dramatic idea for people in this country. >> one would think if there is a right to privacy and also justice alito in his opinion on page nine says abortion wasn't recognized in the constitution, but he adds neither was privacy. and it just causes me to wonder that if the relationship between a woman and her dr. about her health. my time is expired and i want to thank you for your attendance. i will yield back. >> the gentlewoman from ohio isi now recognized for questions. >> thank you, chairman loney for holding this hearing. it's important to acknowledge demands and restrictions do not affect all people equally. can you explain how abortion bans and restrictions impact women of color in particular? >> women of color are disproportionately residing in the states that are banning abortion, that is the first thing to think about. but even if you go beyond, right now you will have sort of two different situations. it's either that people are going to be able to get access to medication or they are going to be able to travel. each of those things puts additional hurdles they will comeme down on people very, very differently. it's not a small idea to just pick up and travel to get youre own healthcare. it requires you to take time off with and it might require you to arrange for the children you already have. we shouldn't be confused about the criminal penalties that are going to come to not just providers, but people seeking care and anyone who helped them. the states around the country are not saying the things i've heard today in this hearing room about how there won't be anyat criminal punishment. they are saying the opposite with many years of criminal punishmentnt attachment. >> as you explained, we must also address the structural racism. across the united states, communities of color experience these disparities including uninsurance stigma that is exponentially higher. how do the laws the first people to continue their pregnancy present new threats to people of color? >> right now healthcare isn't readily available in every community. people are not always covered in terms of insurance. not every state has expanded medicaid to meet the needs ofe the lowest income. so we already are in a situation where healthcare access is worse. so if youth were choosing, if yu don't have an ability to decide whether you terminate a pregnancy on your own terms, what we know from the study is that it is likely to have the word self and life outcomes for that person. that's going to disproportionately affect people of color who already have less health access. >> it's also important to know many minimum-wage workers are women and especially women of color. the committee has taken on to address so for people with less income the cost associated with abortion care which you touched on includes the cost of the procedure of sulfur and transportation cost, childcare and taking days off work. these restrictions that force people to travel long distances to seek a provider make abortion care even more unaffordable. how would the ripple effect of abortion and access to other reproductive health services particularly impact people ofwo color? >> as i mentioned before in my initial testimony, outlawing abortion would basically amount to the folks that have resources would be able to get access to care which we know black and brown folks are disproportionately represented in the number of folks that make minimum wage. so it's going to boil down to the financial resources, childcare, do you have the wherewithal. less likely to be able to access. access. >> thank you. so i think it is clear people of color already face racial and ethnic disparities.ci draconian abortion bans and restrictions that force people to remain pregnant and further entrench the disparities so to do whatever we can to lift up thee marginalized communities. every person deserves the opportunity to make their own decisions about their body at their future and with that, i will yield back. >> the gentleman from virginia is recognized. >> thanknk you for holding the hearing and welcome to the panel. professor, are you there? do you remember your constitutional history? show me in the constitution where the founders granted to theright to the supreme court to review and nullify legislation passed by the congress or any other legislative body in america. does that exist in the constitution? >> no it does not exist at all. so by their logic this opinion is questionable. based on the constitution. do you remember when the first time the right to review legislation or the right to legislative actions of the legislative body was ever asserted by the suprememe court? 1804, marbury versus madison and it was made up by john marshall on the plot. he said it was an implied power. do you remember the first time in fact they used the power they asserted in 1804, because i think it is relevant. dred scott, 1857. that is the first time in american history the supreme court overruled, and nullify the legislation passed by the congress and the united states. how did that work out for us? that lead directly to the civil war,r, directly because it overturned the compromise of 185050 and asserted that no blak man or woman, free or otherwise, head of the same rights as a white person. they could never be a full citizen of the united states. a wretched and reprehensible decision. and sadly along with brown v board of education which was a good decision has a long history. plessy versus ferguson, lots of those decisions that tragically discriminated in some cases almost violently against groups of americans. in this case, half the population. ruth bader ginsburg, she said she questioned roe v wade. she did what she questioned the basis of it. it was compared to inequality that men and women have the same controls of their own body and should end by the way for the record, it may be true that ruth bader ginsburg played cards with and went to the opera with antonin scalia but got up in the morning and voted against them in every single case involving the rights of women to have choice and she upheld roe v wade during the entirety of her time in the court. is that not correct? >> that is absolutely correct. >> so, do men have restrictions? here are some limitations on what control you have over your own body, any of them? i can't recall. >> i don't know of any. >> so, let's just for the sake of argument say that there are none. it is a pretty fundamental restriction on their bodies and what they can doth with them. is that correct? >> for sure. >> we've heard a lot of interesting talk about the states rights and when life begins and so forth and so on. is it possible now that we are going to revert back to the chaosd that rains and to the republican appointed conservative justice deciding we had toth have a universal standd and a basic standard that was a right in 1973 is it possible stthat women could be criminalid or medical providers criminalized by some states may be even the state of missouri. >> we'vees already had women who've been investigated and charged for their own miscarriages. >> i'm sorry, did you say miscarriage? somebody can be charged with a crime free miscarriage? >> that's already happened. we've already had that happen. therg way that these laws are written in the states that have rapidlyea passed them they would open up individual providers and others who helped them to seek abortion care to criminal and civil penalties. >> that is astounding. i yield back.he we can't hear you, you have to unmute [inaudible] my question is quite simple. obviously considering as much time as you need. with the judicial humility is a humble decision to realize in 1973 when it invented the right to an abortion.to justice alito's opinion is meticulous. it explores every right that has been suggested including the equal protection right suggested by justice ginsburg. there are literally law review articles and the books devoted to saying what roe should have said. no one has been able to come up with an answer that is satisfactory because there simply is no right to an abortion in the united states constitution. andwi when the constitution says nothing about abortion, as justice alito said,o then that s an issue for the democratic process and for the states and for the people. and in addition, this is something that protects us ass. american people. we don't want a system of government in which the five justices that are unelected however well-meaning they may be are able to make up things out of the constitution. the last thingve i would like to say is that there are no state laws and the country that criminalized women for having an abortion. we realize thato this is a tough spot a lot of women may be in and we want to come alongside them and support them and a zero states criminalized the women for the decision. a zero states criminalize a physician who in his or her determination believes that a woman needs an abortion in order to half-life. for somebody that was charged over a miscarriage, what are the specifics around? prosecutors had filed charges against women who were investigated further miscarriages. the question of miscarriage and investigation into miscarriage is the same thing that women and anyone that is pregnant would have to deal with. there've been over a thousand people who have been criminally for their pregnancy outcomes. i think it's important for people to understand here the medical procedure of abortion applies to multiple types of situations. i'm not sure why in this room people are suggesting that abortion is in healthcare. it is. it's on the range of reproductive health care that people receive in the country seeking to criminalize for having the legislation to criminalize people who seek. they've already been triggered into effect right now. some will travel to other providers and self manage their own care. each of the people that help them would find themselves. the gentleman's time is expired. the gentleman from georgia is now recognized. >> thank you, madam chair. make no mistake about it this isn't about states rights in the decision. it's about taking away people's reproductive freedom denying access to healthcare. what have you seen on the ground with respect to the availability of and accessibility to providers who can prescribe family-planning services such as birth control and contraceptives and how well an abortion ban affect the availability of the services? thank you for the questions. most of the resources are located in the metro area which is the atlanta area that gets the attention. most doesn't have access to healthcare so that's an issue when you think about having access to family-planning but also contraception isn't the same as abortion and contraception, it is used to prevent a pregnancy and abortion is used to terminatete a pregnancy. so we can't pretend if we make sure that birthh control is over the counter and free, we will not have the need for an abortion. they do totally different things. but thank you for the question. >> they will be more constrained and the ability to get access to contraceptives. that is absolutely true and thank you for bringing it up. >> thank you. senator, what will be the impact of the ban on abortion in michigan? what would the ban on abortion have in particular to have access to the reproductive health services? >> there are four providers in metro detroit where the majority of the population lives that can provide the care the constituents need. it is nearly impossible to find that emergency care and that will only become worse and will be impossible for anyone who needs access to care to be able to find that. >> in 2019, the republican governor signed a bill outlawing abortion after six weeks of pregnancy. a federal judge struck down the law last summer but the republican attorney general asked the federal appeals court to let the georgia law take effect one of the challenges that we have is that we are only in a situation where most of the south has banned abortion and so people that are traveling are already having to travel hundreds if not thousands of miles access care. that is mostly and disproportionately peoplece of color because people of color are more likely to live in the south, so what is happening in georgia is not just a problem for georgia. it iss a problem throughout that region.so and it also puts an additional strain on the places that have continued to provide the freedom to decide whether or not you are going to parent. places like dc that are having a disproportionate amount of people coming to care. >> between 1990 and 2013, restrictions on abortion caused the mortality rate to increase by 136%. should we expect to see increases like this in maternal mortality again now that roe v wade has been overruled? >> i think that is where we are heading and we should all be worried about it. >> thank you and i will yield back. >> the gentle man from illinois is recognized. >> thank you madam chair and all the witnesses that have been here. more than 40 years the hyde amendment has restricted federal funds from being used to pay for services. states can choose to allow their own medicaid funds to be used, but only 16 states currently do so.us meaning that in 34 states and the district of columbia, people with medicaid coverage have to pay for their own abortion care. how does having to pay for your own abortion care actually affect these women? >> for some it means they are not going to get care at all because they can't afford it and now we are in a situation where on top of the actual medical services, we have to take into account the cost of travel, the cost of taking time off of work, the cost foror supporting famils who were involved with making this all possible. >> and so these states realize the difficulty, the lack of funds, the lack of resources and services have denied or in fact are denying their residence and citizens of a basic health service? >> if you match up the states that raced to ban abortion first, you find that they are also the states any of which haven't expanded medicaid. they are also the states that do not have paid leave programs. this is not an agenda that is supporting women are supporting familiesre at all. >> representative, what would it mean for the people in georgia to be able to use federal medicaid funds to pay for abortion services? >> did you ask me what would be the effect if they were able to use federal funds? >> simply put it would allow folks to have access to healthcare. so as ms. graves just mentioned, right nowor most people dependig on the state you live if you cannot cash pay you will not be receiving access to healthcare which i would add because we know abortion is healthcare you are not able to get that initial abortion forcing people to carry an unwanted pregnancy regardless of the reasons that they are having to continue contributes to morbidity and also poor outcomes though you're creating larger medical bills down the road potentially. >> i would think it would be like bringing light into darkness. i can recall living in rural america when things lit up it was totally different. as we've heard the amendment is an unnecessary barrier to d,abortion care for people acros the country and repealing it is a critical step in achieving economic and reproductive justice. i am a proud regular sponsor of representative barbara lee's act that would repeal discriminatory policies and last year the house passed the first spending package in more than 40 years that didn't include the hyde amendment. of course we complement ourselves for that and i would urge the senate to follownd our example and repeal this outdated amendment once and for all. thank you for your presence and your answers and i will yield back madam chair. >> the gentleman yields back. the gentle lady is recognized. for five minutes. >> thank you madam chair read i want to focus on so-called crisis pregnancy centers and the role they play. the firm anyoneti not familiar, systems of southern states. can you explain what these clinics are and how they promote an antiabortion agenda? >> let me make sure [inaudible] believing they are going to a aplace that can help facilitate access to abortion and be totally fooled and one of the reasons why they've gotten the moniker of clinics is that some of them have purported to provide health services that they do not provide. so if you are someone that is trying to access abortion, you are on the clock more so in states that havee restricted abortion care earlier and earlier. so one of the ways is by convincing people to sort of be with them and stay in their system and what ends up happening is people miss out on the care that they actually are seeking. i have to say though about these clinics, there's nothing that prevented them from providing the services that they provide consistent with roe being around. they didn't have to wait until they struck down roe v wade to provide access upon the transition to parenthood and that is true more broadly. we will now be facing a much more giant crisis where accurate information is going to be so very critical and so i am hoping that this body and others will look g really clearly at what st of information people are providing in the name of healthcare at this time where there is so much deep confusion. >> there's an estimated 2500 crisis centers in the united states and its outnumbered by a ratio of 3-1. florida remains for now one of the last safe havens for access in the south. how do these make it harder to travel for abortion care? i know during last year's committee hearing we had a firsthand account of someone thatrt unknowingly walked into a center when she was seeking abortion care. >> what it means is there will be people traveling to florida to seek care who don't know florida as well so they might find themselves stumbling into a crisis pregnancy center when they meant to stumble into someone who could provide them with abortion services. and that would be unfortunate. again we are on a clock here for someone to be forced to remain pregnant, be given bad information about their own health, the state of their pregnancy or about abortion services. what we needed this time of chaos is accurate, medically accurate and legally accurate information. that's what people need. >> that's exactly what i want to hit on. the advertisement of often times there is no medical training and they make scientifically baseless claims and scare them out of getting an abortion. [inaudible] i'm here. >> is it possible that residents in statess like yours are more likely to end up closer to their home? ..es cpc centers have gotten better over time as farce providing some services that still the case that they only exist just to talk people out of having abortions that they want to have. i had an abortion 20 years ago and i lived in florida. since decision i don't regret and i think it's important people know they want to have an abortion they be able to get that care without being distracted and this was mentioned before basically it willll make it difficult for thm to get the care that they know they want. >> the crackdown on abortion services and additional forces trying to protect the right to care. i yield back the balance of my time. >> the gentleman from california vice chair gomez is recognized for fivetr minutes. >> thank you madam chair. firstd. you for a start on myy formal remarks i want to address it was here for the opening statements by the ranking member and he made some comments that the democrats arere trying to destroy democratic institutions and we don't respect the process. this is coming from the same side of the aisle when it came to january 6 that they didn't dspeak up. they didn't vote to impeach the former president. it then held them accountable. they didn't want to put anyone on the january 6 commission. this is the same groupvo of fols that don't believe in the institution and the peaceful transfer ofon power. on the other side of the aisle on this committee said it was a normal tourist visit it as my colleagues and i were lyingth on the floor in the gallery with cops above us withth guns drawn. we were sitting there. no they want to call out that violence. it almost overthrew our democracy and our country. theyey are okay with that. they wanted to provide a different set of electors and they were okay with that. i think it's very when they say they are the oness that don't respect their institution. we respect their institution that we recognize their institution and the individuals that are placed there have a responsibility to live up to the constitution not to their political party. they also make the claim that it's about lifeve and freedom. these are the same folks that if you dig down its not about life for freedom it's about control. if the workout like they'd look at a lot of states. what about their states? if you really look at it the maternal brutality rate is the highest in louisiana georgia indiana new jersey arkansas alabama missouri texas south carolina and arizona. we have one blue state out of 10 but when they get a chance to support life of mothers they always vote no. when they hadon a chance to increase the childet tax credit that would reduce poverty in brackets out of poverty they voted no. we comes to the family leave the bono and my comes to expanding the aca they vote no and if you look at the same states that are pulling back on abortion rights and the right to privacy and that's what it's about are the same 12 states roughly that refused to expand medicaid. so for them they claim it's not about life, it's about controlling women lgbtq individuals and it's about controlling individuals that don't look like them and don't agreee with them and don't have the same values as them. that's what this is about an and they say we are using fear to mobilize the public it's a fact. the court should reconsider griswold dealing with contraception and same-sex marriage. the same majority in the house and the senate passed laws that word abortion rights throughout this country no doubt about it. this is what we are dealing with and the people that are most likely to suffer blacks and browns indigenous lgbtq individuals an undocumented individuals out the country. for the panel what do you say when my colleagues on the other side of the aisle claim that they are pro-life to ms. gross? >> you know i think there are a lot of things we could do to support life, gun reform that would make it safe for my children to be in school and paid leave would increase the maternal outcome. there is a long agenda and much of it within build back better which not many the folks in this room supported so there are a lot of things that would be in support of the well-being and security of all people. that the gentleman's time gentleman's time has expired. >> madam chair may respond with the gentleman said about my opening remarks. >> we will give you time at the end. we are almost atat the end. let's get to members that are waiting all day to ask their questions. the gentleman from california mr. deth saulnier is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you madam chairwoman and the panel and everybody who has stuck with it. i get right to questions so we can wrap up this hearing. i want to talk about the disability community and how disproportionately they are affected.t the impact includes a lot of people like robin wilson who lived in the bay area not far from my district and made the difficult decision to terminate a pregnancy in 2007 page he -- had she not terminated her pregnancy it would have endangered her young son. theeg tribe -- draconian laws tt robin faced were traumatizing and it would further harm people like robin. people have to make deeply personal decisions about their reproductive health care. many people rely on medicaid for their essential health care needs. restrictions on medicaid coverage of abortion are particularly harmful to thiss community. ms. mc morrow how can those of us working to expand health care access and share people living with disabilities? >> i i appreciate the question. it's really challenging for many people and that's especially true and it ultimately comes down to the health care decisions between an individual and a family. every single situation is different right c now the law is written and our attorney general mentioned it as an exception for death to the mother. it goes back to the issue is its a% or 20% and it doesn't not impact mental health in the issue you brought up to care for existing family so ultimately all of us in the most compassionate way need to work as hard as possible to ensure the decision that medical providers can make without arbitrary hurdles. >> i'd like to follow-up. they have so many challenges. the governor has been at the forefront of helping people with disabilities and the impact they are very system is dictated about behavior health and their families. this is just one more thing great could you respond to that? >> is and it comes down do we talked a lot about the constitution and everybody's constitutional right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. we have to consider the official hurdles and challenges for the disability community and respond int kind and ensure that our ls do not add additional hurdles to ensurech that everybody has the right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. >> i will just follow up with ms. lopez on the behavior health implications art community centers unique and people who art disproportionally low income and people of color again one more thing a significant life-transforming event for multipleli people the decision process so they can get behavior health they need in this political atmosphere. >> it brings up the conversation of how to expand access to health care mental health care in wrap-around support so everybody isab a fundamental rit knowing that impacts the family different forms. do you have any observations or comments? >> i'm grateful for rural folks lgbtq thugs and people of color. these are the communities that are disproportionately impacted by abortion bans and restrictions on what i've seen in helping people over the air over last few years is that people are so desperate they will do anything they can to get this care whether that's to give up their rent money or shuffle it around to make sure they have childcare. these are things that are dire and it comes down to if and when abortion care care success a bowl. >> thank you so much for the yield back kreitsinger the gentlewoman from massachusetts is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you madam chair. the state for the record that an actfo topic pregnancy ruptures what are the chances it could be carried to term? >> my understanding is that women act topic -- act topic pregnancy ruptures -- >> again when it act topic pregnancy ruptures what are the chances it can be safely carried toto term and i'm looking for a number between zero to 100 giving me a percentage. >> event though they do not rupture they have a chance of successfully being carried to term and that's why to trim is not an abortion. >> reclaiming my time. it seems there's a deficit in your standing of reproductive health. in fact i want the record to reflectun according to the american college of obstetricians and gynecologistsu treatment for ectopic pregnancy requires ending a nonviable pregnancy. now -- >> with respect maam, that's not anna abortion. >> this is my time. i asked you the question and you answered and i'm providing you with accurate information from medical experts.th my question was when the ectopic pregnancy ruptures what are the chances it can be safely carried toto term. the answer is 0%. further when it comes to one's accurate understanding of reproductive health and abortion care within ectopic pregnancy the american college of obstetricians and gynecologists says, quote treatment for ectopc pregnancy requires ending a nonviable pregnancy and quote. now i'm going to turn to the real experts. reclaiming my time i'm now going to turns it over to the real experts. so despite the active misinformation campaign is endangering the lives ur of pregnant people including much of the testimony heard here today endangering the lives of pregnant people their families and entire committees this hearing is an opportunity for quality public health education that prioritizes equity and justice in reproductive healthmm care. i would like to ask you about a topic that many are hearing about for the first time in the news. since first being approved by the fda more than 20 years ago medication abortion is now the most common form of abortion health care. it's incredibly safe and highly effective. in my home state of massachusetts nearly half of pregnancies are terminated by medication abortion. last year chair maloney and i led calls to improve medication drugs and arbitrary restrictions that experts agreed were medically unnecessary and thankfully the fda revise this medication so he could receive theth by mail. representative shannon what does having access to medication by mail -- most of our resources are located in atlanta so a lot of folks don't have access to providers. it means that people can get access to care after they made the decision regardless of what zip code theyer live in and an unwanted urgency leads to poor health outcomes. it's the right thing to do. >> based on your experience with abortion care expand abortion access including medication abortion for the client that you work with? >> absolutely especially now that we have seen most clinics in texas shuddered and especially because h.b. 2 passed in 2013. >> i think the point here is that pregnant people in multiple states have emergency surgeries delayed while lawyers and doctors to take care due to confusion caused by republicans and the far right supreme court. this is a matter of life and death. thank you. >> madam chair i would request on the happ -- in the future her membership o treat guests with a little more respect and not be as hostile and confrontational. ii believe we have a witness hee today that's been very honest andro very polite and trying to answer the questions and the last questions i feel were a little over the line. i want to state that for the record. >> you are now recognize mr. sarbanes. >> thank you very muchi madam chair. thank you to the panelists. you've been here for a long time. your testimony has been of great consequence away thank you for takingsa the time and remotely s well. in the late -- in the wake of the dodge decision many states have bans on abortion and place and we know conservatives around the country are pushing policies to further limit women's fundamental right in many states. given this reality is allvati te more essential or individuals in other states to redouble their efforts to protect and expand abortion access. in my home state of maryland which thankfully is one where access to abortion is still protected a new law allows certain nonphysicianst practitioners with qualified training to provide abortions and other states such as delaware washington connecticut have recently taken steps to strengthen access to abortion care. even when i say legislatures passed laws protecting abortion care it must continue to be vigilant. in maryland we've seen for example where the governor recently refused to release funds appropriated to support portions of the state's abortion access love. i wanted to ask you to speak to the emerging two americas that we are seeing now and in this case why it's critical that there be actions to expand abortion access in places like maryland and other states where the right is protected and just speak a little bit to what you see is that dynamic and we are headed in the near term and how we handle it will be extremely important.ea >> we have a relative that have the country would be hurling intoag place to decide whether u were going to be pregnant and what that meansou is that the oe in four women in this country to get abortion care are going to have to. figure out how to do that safely and without criminal penalties. some will be traveling to other parts of the country and some will be seeking medication abortion in seeking to self manage. all of them will be doing it at the time of legal and health chaos overstates that have an opportunity to expand access that's exactly what they should be doing, protecting providers patients in anyone who's trying to help them and in the states where they are finding that they are in a place that is hostile to buy just want to say that i see you in their people fighting for you. the idea that we can stand as a nation with one path more free than the other is one that won't stand very long. i believe we are hurling towards a time -- >> i think you are right to describe a situation of chaos across the country. we are seeing that with each passing day and i think it's coming to a heightened sense of instability generally in the country. this is the concert bands of the decision like dogs. maryland is one of the states as an opportunity to be a safe haven for women who live in other states where these restrictions are in place. we have got to do weekend to expand and model the kind of support and capacity. i also think there's an opportunity in states like maryland to gather data in a responsible way. they can inform the broader conversation across the country because we know we have had some debates here today over misinformation and disinformation around this topic. being able to gather data in a way that has integrity to it and diligence to it i think will be important in states like maryland can play a role in that effort. so thank you all again for your testimony today. the reality is the democrats on his committee believed that a woman should make her own health care decisions and unfortunately it seems the republicans that we serve with here have a different view. they want to take that agency away. we must and we will continue to do all we can to protect abortion access and ensure that all americans to matter where they live connectors is the reproductive freedom. we know it's the great majority of americansur. they must raise their voices in this critical moment and what that i yield back my time. >> the gentleman yields back read before i close and want to offer the ranking member the opportunity to offering the opposing remarks he may have. >> thank you miniature and i want to thank our witnesses for being hereer today. mr. holly want to publicly apologize for ms. presley. i feel like that was unnecessary and her tone and i appreciate your honesty and although witnesses willingness to volunteer today. couple of things madam chair that i wantedou to point out tht i disagree with statements. ms. wasserman schultz to disparage his pregnancy centers. they are providing a valuable service all over america and she mentioned the word fake pregnancy centers. erif there are fake pregnancy centers she should report them to the authorities becauseth its not allowed in any state. pregnancy center that not properly licensed. mr. gomez referred to my opening statement and iha would like to remind mr. gomez i have never voted to object and an electoral college confirmation vote. i was also on the floor and january 6 and i will always condemn the violence that occurred on that day so i don't know why he was referencing that with respect to me but i will conclude by reminding everyone on this committee with the purpose of this committee is in the purpose of the house oversight committee ise. to identify mismanagement of the federal government. we are talking about a supreme court case here comes something we have zero jurisdiction over. this hearing madam chair with all due respect was a political hearing in my opinion to try to fire up and demoralize the far left-wingad democratic party because of poll numbers with the president and the party. i hope in the future we can focus on hearings that identify the core mission of this committee and that's to try to provide oversight for the biden administrationly and their many policies that are failing and try to identify wasteful spending that we can hopefully reverse and tame inflation. again madam chair thank you for allowing me that closing statement and i yield back. >> i think all of the witnesses for your incredible testimony and i first of all want to say ms. presley was perfect way in her right to reclaim her time to grade that's the way this body works. the member can reclaim their time and she was fully within her rights as a member of this committee. i want to compliment her also for her foresight of beginning an a investigation well over a year and a half ago trying to remove the restrictions the fda has placed to have access to it which resulted in the ability now to mail it to areas of the country and i want to thank her for that. it's absolutely within the rome of the oversight committee to look at the rights of half the population of our country and to his devastating decision iss taking way of an a mental right that we don't settle with law. 50 years of precedent. supreme court justices testified before the senate saying they would respect it so this is a shocking and devastating opinion. i would say we heard testimony today from many of our panelists on the dire threat to the health of people.e. they said abortion would occur in the question is are they going to be legal and safe or are they going to be illegal and increase the deaths of women? thiss is literally life and deah to many women read we have heard that over and over again and we all know that. wehe have had hearings on the hh incidence of deaths particularly for african-american women with the birth of their children, eight times more likely in my great city of new york than the national average and that's a huge problem.il it's not unusual to look at the health challenges that americans face and i would say most women like-minded men in the country would be grateful for the testimony the knowledge and experience they have been listening to our panelists. i would say today we heard testimony about the chaos and confusion of fair explanations by a miss grades in the supreme court's extreme decision to eliminate america's constitutional right to an abortion. all of our witnesses who shared their expertise and their personal stories of abortion i want to thank you and while many did not share their stories i know their stories and they were very brave to come forward and tell us. today's hearing makes clear the loss of abortion rights is devastating, absolutely devastating for women across the country particularly people of color people with low incomes and others who already faced barriers to their health care. .. trying to downplay the damage from the supreme court's decision is flat out lying. and here are the facts. we heard them today. abortion is now illegal in 16 states, with more on the way. more than 33 million women are at risk of losing abortion rights in these states. that's half of the women -- that are of reproductive age. providers are scared to offer essential reproductive health care. we could not even get a provider to come in. they were afraid to come in, they felt they would be hurt in some way if they publicly talked about their work. and this is in america. people are being denied care for miscarriages and other emergencies because of these extreme state laws. when you have you can't even get in the hospital, and it's going to cause the death of more women in this country. republicans are not done. we are simply not done with taking away our rights. next they want to pass a national abortion ban. major leaders of a party have said that. just ask the republican members of the committee who are cosponsoringng a bill to make performing an abortion a crime punishable by five years in federal prison. i asked at the beginning of the hearing if this is the america we want to live in. the vast majority of americans who support abortion rights and want to make their own decisions about their own bodies. this is why democrats are fighting to protect abortion rights. we feel we are fighting for democracy itself. here in the house we are taking up legislation to enshrine abortion rights in federal law and i urge the senate to act as well. u president biden has also taken decisive action. he issues an executive order to protect reproductive care including access to medication abortionon and to protect the privacy and security of patients and providers. the administration is also acting to ensure access to contraception. and i've introduced a bill that many members of the committee that would prevent pharmacies from refusing to dispense contraception's based on their personal beliefs. as we've heard today the fight for reproductive rights is taking place in cities and states all overba the country, d i'm proud toda stand with my democratic colleagues in that fight. and i'm especially proud of the committee has led the way and expanding access to medication abortion and contraception. this ise a fight we will never, ever give up. before i close i want to enter into the record statements from pro-choice america, physicians for reproductive health, the american academy of family physicians and professor carrie baker regarding the urgent need to protect abortion access. i would like to say in closing i dwant to thank all of the panelists for the remarks and i apologize that we had a five minute time limit. many of you had more you wanted ntto say. you can put that into the official record and i want to commend my colleagues who participate in this conversation. without objection, all members will have five legislative days within whichal to submitwi extraneous materials and additional written questions for the witnesses to the chair which will be forwarded to the witnesses for their response and i asked the witnesses to please respond as promptly as you are able. the hearing isitne adjourned. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] right now we are facing our greatest challenge. that's why we are working around the clock to keep you connected. we are doing our part so it's a little easier to do yours. >> almost a week after announcing that he will step down as his replacement is in place. before the start the speaker throughout two members of parliament for their behavior. this is about 45 minutes.

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