Transcripts For MSNBC Dateline : vimarsana.com

Transcripts For MSNBC Dateline



hanging from a banister. >> from first look it would appear as though it was a suicide. >> but then they looked closer. >> it appeared that there was a struggle. my gut was telling me there's something wrong here. >> did someone want michele dead? was someone else willing to help? >> at that point we're shell-shocked. >> a bond forged in blood. >> we called it the lie and cry conversation. >> betrayed by blood. >> what are you hoping for? >> some conversation between the two of them about the death. >> we have an investigator look at the video surveillance and he goes, i don't like what i'm seeing. >> you're theorizing the darkest scenario? >> yes, we are. evil. hello and welcome to "dateline." michele and lloyd neurauter were high school sweethearts who tied the knot two years later, then had three daughters. their marriage didn't last, but michele and lloyd remained devoted to their girls. then michele was found dead in her home. at first police suspected suicide. but soon the case took a chilling turn. at the heart of this mystery was a betrayal too twisted to be true. except that it is. here's dennis murphy with "the ultimatum." >> the long road to prima ballerina. the dreams of thunderous bravos. the cascade of roses. begins for the youngest of dancers in a ballet school of tutued 10-year-olds. stretching, stressing. >> it's very disciplined. >> an athletic discipline of concentration and body control. learning poise under pressure. >> it took a lot. especially when we were young. to stick with it. but it was worth it. >> a ballet academy in upstate new york was where amina raj got to know her friend karrie neurauter. >> i met karrie when she was 8. she was very sweet, very bubbly personality. >> both of them were girly girls, but wanted to grow up to be like their dads. >> our dads were both engineers. so we were both going to become engineers. and be professional ballerinas on the side. >> and everyone could see that karrie was very close to her dad, lloyd neurauter. every saturday he'd not only drive his daughter to class in corning, new york. he'd stay to help out. >> he was the only father there that was bringing the kids in the morning at that time. >> mena's mom cynthia would see him on those saturdays but rarely his wife. >> instead of doing the children's hair at home, he would always sort of bring them there and brush their hair out and put these buns together. >> with some skill and art? >> yes. and he definitely enjoyed the admiration of the other mothers around him. >> as their daughters rehearse for the annual nut cracker, cynthia and another friend, rose coluccio, became friendly with lloyd. >> lloyd was i would say eccentric. always the center of attention. >> of course we eventually asked about his wife, and he said that saturday was really her day off. >> lloyd's wife, michele, had a full plate of her own. she had a master's degree in literature but chose to be a full-time mom, home-schooling their kids and taking an active role in charity work. here she is making thanksgiving dinner for the needy at their local church. >> it would be really odd to have thanksgiving at home, just us, and not be here. thanksgiving is celebrating with the community, giving back. >> michele had met lloyd in high school. her mom jeannie remembers a teenage boy who was smitten from the first date. >> i think she thought he was intelligent and she could have intelligent conversations with him. >> so maybe a peg above the other kids in the schoolyard or her circle? >> yes. >> the high school sweethearts married when michele was just 20. they'd later settle into a farmhouse in upstate new york and have three girls. karrie, the middle child. michele's younger sister, also named karrie, admired her so much. >> tell me about your sister as a mom. >> she always like wanted the best for her girls. she was always very supportive because of course when i had children i asked her all my questions and looked up to her. i always looked up to her. >> though they lived close apart, michele's sister and her husband were close with the nieces. >> the oldest one really bonded with kevin, and karrie and i very much bonded. >> but as with so many people the neurauter family ran into lean times, diminished prospects during the great recession. lloyd moved out of state to find work as an engineer. >> what happened is lloyd, it was a tough time in corning, new york and he took a job in new jersey. >> michele stayed behind with the girls out in the country in corning. but the separation put a strain on the marriage, and in time michele and lloyd divorced. >> she was always positive and going to make the most of everything, and then one day out of the blue she called me and said we're divorced. like okay. >> it was very random. >> after the divorce michele sold the farm and the kids split up. the oldest went to live with her dad in new jersey while karrie and the youngest daughter stayed in corning with mom in a new house. but the divorce was hard on everyone. karrie and her mom sometimes butted heads. the arguments could get heated. >> the issue was living with her mother finishing high school, but it got more and more strained as the years -- as she approached her senior year. >> by late august 2017 karrie, the one-time ballerina, had left home and was a sophomore at r.i.t. in rochester. her younger sister still lived with her mom. it seemed like a typical monday afternoon when a family friend came by the house to pick up the youngest for swim practice. but something looked very wrong. he called 911. >> she's motionless. and i'm concerned. >> the friend said he glimpsed a shadowy female figure on the stairway. >> she's just standing there not moving? >> kind of hard to tell. dark. >> something very dark had happened in that house. and when the curtain was pulled back, it would reveal a monstrous story. like something out of a greek tragedy. with an ending no one could fathom. >> this is absolutely ghoulish. >> yeah. >> coming up -- >> there appeared to be a body hanging inside the door about 15 to 20 feet, hanging from a banister. >> this is as they say a house that's known to law enforcement? >> yes. >> and somebody was missing. >> no 14-year-old was discovered. >> so where is this child? >> that was one of the first concerns. >> when "dateline" continues. when eye allergens attack, the itch can last 24 hours. but with pataday once daily relief extra strength you get fast, 24-hour relief in one drop. make it a pataday with the drop that's right for you. now without a prescription. everywhere. these are real people, not actors, who've got their eczema under control. with less eczema, you can show more skin. so roll up those sleeves. and help heal your skin from within with dupixent. dupixent is the first treatment of its kind that continuously treats moderate-to-severe eczema, or atopic dermatitis, even between flare ups. dupixent is a biologic, and not a cream or steroid. many people taking dupixent saw clear or almost clear skin, and, had significantly less itch. don't use if you're allergic to dupixent. serious allergic reactions can occur, including anaphylaxis, which is severe. tell your doctor about new or worsening eye problems, such as eye pain or vision changes, or a parasitic infection. if you take asthma medicines, don't change or stop them without talking to your doctor. so help heal your skin from within, and talk to your eczema specialist about dupixent. if your financial situation has changed, we may be able to help. i'll be observing your safe-driving abilities. play your cards right, and you could be in for a tasty discount. 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[ tires screech ] well, that came out of nowhere. advil dual action fights pain 2 ways. it's the first and only fda approved combination of advil plus acetaminophen. advil targets pain. acetaminophen blocks it. advil dual action. fast pain relief that lasts 8 hours. august 28th, 2017. police officers responded to the home of divorced mom michele neurauter. a friend of hers had called 911 to report a disturbing sight. >> there appeared to be a body hanging inside the door about 15 to 20 feet, hanging from a banister. >> corning police chief jeff spalding says his officers got in and found the body. a woman with a rope tied around her neck. it was michele. apparently a suicide? >> from first look, yes, it would appear as though it was a suicide. >> no reason to think not? >> no. >> officers searched the home. they found no suicide note. and the house was empty. daughter karrie was away at college, but the youngest, who lived there with michele, was nowhere to be found. >> no 14-year-old was discovered. >> so where is this child? >> that was one of the first concerns. >> it turned out the youngest was actually with karrie at school in rochester 100 miles away. police learned that when karrie called them herself after a friend gave her the shocking news. >> my mom hung herself. >> we are looking into it. can you give me any insight into what might have happened? >> i don't know. i decided to go home. >> karrie told police she had stopped by the house that night. >> when i got there, they were freaking out. >> in karrie's words they had a fight, her mom went yelling and screaming. >> karrie told investigators she stormed out of the house, taking her teenage sister with her. not all that unusual. police learned that raised voices in that household were sadly routine. a bad divorce with kids caught in the middle. this is, as they say, a house that's known to law enforcement? >> yes. >> there have over the years, what, been 911 calls to the location? >> probably in the course of two or three years a dozen, a little more than a dozen calls. >> so chief, i'm thinking even with this brief history you have, fragmentary history of trouble inside the house, mother, daughter, something's going on, it does maybe give you an explanation of why she's a death by suicide. >> exactly. >> investigators also got in touch with michele's ex-husband lloyd, who lived in new jersey. he was rushing to upstate new york to be with his daughters. >> the last time i spoke with her i couldn't even say. >> lloyd told a detective by phone he wasn't completely surprised to hear the news. he said that despite her cheery demeanor michele had actually contemplated suicide in the past. >> from before we were married she made suicide plans with high school friends, and that was something that alarmed me way back then. >> police continued to process the scene. while michele's body was taken to the medical examiner for autopsy. >> what is she finding? >> the words again consistent with suicide are used. >> in a round of phone calls michele's sister out in california got the news about the suicide. >> when you first heard, that did it make sense in any kind of way to you, that maybe she'd gotten in a bad place and -- >> i mean, i knew that she'd been fighting with the girls. i really thought like maybe she had a bad moment. >> then she had to relay the awful news to their mom. >> she said michele died. and i said, no, she didn't. i said no, she didn't. that's a lie. don't say that. i said don't say that. >> the friends back in corning could hardly take it in. michele gone. and by her own hand. >> my mom called me. she didn't want me to see it online or on social media before i heard it from her. >> and you went to see her? >> i did. i went home. it was so shocking. >> as funeral arrangements began, michele's friends were haunted by a request she made just months before her death. >> she said, well, promise me that if anything ever happens to me that you'll look out for my daughters. and then i reassured her, naively perhaps, that she was going to live a long life. but she was pretty persistent. so i said okay. and we left it like that. she got me with that story. >> but even in their grief there was confusion and doubt. the friends thought the michele they saw in her final days was anything but suicidal. >> what were her plans? was she forward-looking? >> constantly. we were always working on what was next. >> that wasn't where she was in her life? >> i'd say she's a fighter. that woman was a fighter. on saturday morning when the rest of us would be lounging around in her sweatpants she'd say it's a good day, we're going to get up, we're going to get dressed and we're going to make the best of it. >> even if michele were suicidal, they just could not see their friend hanging herself like that in a way that her daughters could find her. >> i started googling means that females use for suicide, and i think it was -- what i could find was around 9% of females who actually hang themselves. the most popular option by far is pills. >> but michele's mood and statistics aside, they kept coming back that lack of a suicide note. >> michele had a master's in english as well as an mba. she was a prolific writer. michele would have written a note of explanation. so once there was no note i think -- >> right. >> we just said something's wrong. >> little did they know exactly how wrong this would all turn out to be. coming up -- maybe it wasn't suicide. >> apparent suicide. did that make any sense to you? >> no. >> my gut was telling me there's something wrong here. >> maybe it was murder. >> the weight around her chin did not seem consistent with a hanging. on her face it looks like scratch marks, like maybe she's pulling at whatever as round her neck, trying to get it off. you can see where her bed was pushed out of place. it appeared that there was a struggle. >> when "dateline" continues. washed your hands a lot today? probably like 40 times. hands feel dry? like sandpaper. introducing new dove handwash, with 5 x moisturizer blend. removes germs in seconds, moisturizes for hours. soft, smooth. new dove handwash. tonight i'll be eating a calzone from doughballs in aurora. (doorbell) rock on. tonight i'll be eating lobster thermidor au gratin. really? sh-yeah, and monkeys might fly out of my butt. make it two calzones! got it? got it. sh-yeah, and monkeys might fly out of my butt. it's slippery. nooooo... noooo... nooooo... yeeeesss... quick, the quicker picker upper! bounty picks up messes quicker and each sheet is 2x more absorbent, so you can use less. hey look, i got it. bounty, the quicker picker upper. see every delivery... every yikes... and even every awwwwwwww... wait, where was i? introducing self protection from xfinity. designed to put you in control. with real-time notification and a week of uninterrupted recording... all powered by reliable, secure wifi from xfinity. gotta respect his determinatio. it's easy and affordable to get started. get self protection for $10 a month. police were investigating the hanging death of michele neurauter as a possible suicide. but they still needed to know more about her final weeks and days. >> hi, how are you? >> good. just cautious about how i approach a car. i don't want to startle anybody. >> the deceased's ex-husband lloyd, resettled in new jersey, had rushed to upstate new york after michele's body was found. now sitting in a police car he seemed eager to talk. >> how long's michele lived there at the residence over on deloitte? do you know? >> it's about five years. >> okay. >> she bought that after we divorced. >> he told them about his early relationship with michele. >> we went away to school together. we did everything together. so i never thought like that, like oh, under some circumstance i'll just walk away. >> when did you guys divorce? >> we divorced in august 2012. >> he explained that while the divorce had been finalized years earlier their custody issues were far from settled. they were still fighting over their youngest daughter. >> she wanted to live with me. her mom threw a tantrum. >> lloyd suggested his ex-wife was unstable and an emotional wreck. >> michele was screaming and furious. i know of that from past behaviors. that there was an occasion where michele was having a tantrum that she would open the door and scream things down the stairs and then slam her bedroom door and did that so many times she actually broke the door frame from doing that. that she was just completely out of control. >> but lloyd admitted his information was secondhand. he'd heard the stories from his children. >> i don't even know if she was seeing anybody or who else she was doing things with. she really pushed me out of her life. >> lloyd spoke with police for over an hour. as the interview ended, he had a question. when could the kids retrieve their stuff? >> in case i could pass on word-s there any idea when the kids could get into the house to -- >> we'll look into that too. >> if it were a simple suicide, the investigation wouldn't take long. but new york state investigator eric heard, who was among the first on the scene, thought not so fast. >> my gut was telling me there's something wrong here. >> it wasn't just cop intuition. there was physical evidence in his experience inconsistent with a suicide. starting with a position of the thin nylon rope on michele's body. >> the way it went around her chin did not seem consistent with a hanging. >> he noticed wounds on michele's head, too. >> on her face it looks like scratch marks, like maybe she's pulling at whatever as round her neck, trying to get it off. >> and then there was michele's friend rose. she rushed up to the scene with something urgent to say. >> apparent suicide. did that make any sense to you? >> no. >> she had told me, she's like i know her friends, she would never do this to herself. we were just with her the other night, we were having a great time, she wouldn't do this. >> it's not evidence, but it's a piece. >> it's not evidence at that point. >> and when police formally interviewed the friends she got a different picture of michele and their divorce. they said lloyd was the crazy one. relentlessly badgering his ex-wife with dragged out custody fights. >> i was at their house and i think lloyd had just served another petition for child custody of the younger child. and she was frustrated. her life was looking very positive and then this came up again. >> objective appraisal or friends taking sides? either way, they insisted michele wasn't a frazzled, out-of-control single mom. she was making the best of a bad situation. and dealing with an ex who demeaned her for years. >> basically, everything she did was criticized. he made her feel she was really ugly. he made her feel that she couldn't make any right decisions, she was a lousy mother, that she couldn't do anything right. >> so homicide versus suicide. on the one hand, a nasty divorce may have given michele plenty of reasons to be depressed and want a way out. but it was a police photo of michele's bedroom that caused investigator heard to think otherwise. >> you can see where her bed was pushed out of place. >> he spent hours poring over the pictures. >> looking at the wall and kind of zooming in, you can see things. maybe not visible to -- >> they didn't jump out at the time. >> they didn't jump out at first, but it looks like we see something, it looks like blood on the wall. so that was concerning. >> blood on the wall and a bed out of place. to heard it pointed to only one scenario. >> it appeared that there was a struggle. >> he believed michele had been attacked, the suicide scene staged. at the house there was no sign of forced entry. nothing taken. and investigators theorized that a random intruder wouldn't bother arranging such an elaborate scene. >> an unknown intruder, the one-a

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